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Microtech Preparing to Install Microtech: Questions and Tips

Old 08-16-08, 02:31 PM
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Preparing to Install Microtech: Questions and Tips

I am in the process of preparing my car to receive a microtech, and I have a few questions and am looking for advice from people who have gone this road before!

Fist off, it's an '86 N/A (GXL) with a streetported engine.

In preparation, I've removed the whole upper intake assembly to give me acess to everything I need to see. The next step was to label and remove the harness on the passenger side of the engine bay. I have since removed the wiper motor harness from the main loom. Now here are the questions...

1. I've read and been told that I can axe the entire rat's nest which is great. Do I simply plug all the open nipples with appropriate sized caps? Obviously I need to retain the vacuum line for the brake booster, but are there other vac lines I need to retain?

2. Do I need to keep the Charcoal canister?

3. I have an FD alternator in the car. There is a wire that goes from the alt into the same loom as the wiper motor - end ends in that same yellow connector . I'm assuming I need this still - do I?

4. Here's the big question - what can I axe from the harness on the driver's side of the engine - the one that connects to the igniters? Keeping in mind I'm retaining the power steering (but not the AC) should I even be touching this harness or do/can I pull out parts or all of it?

5. I have an S5 full range TPS. Would it be a good idea to use it instead of the narrow range S4 stock one?

If you guys have any other tips or advicee for me it's greatly appreciated! Most threads I've read have been on TII's so I'm unsure how much they relate. I appologize for the newbness of the post, but with the scope of the job, it would be easy to tear somethhing necessary out or leave in a bunch of things for no reason - and I want to be sure to do it properly.

Nick
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Old 08-16-08, 06:31 PM
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1.You can REMOVE EVERYTHING. Only thing you leave is the vaccum lines for THE oil metering pump. Everything can be cleaned right out.
2.You should keep the charcoal canister other wise you get fumes in the car and no were for your oil to go when your giving your car stick.
3.You still need the alternator wires. other wise the alternator wont charge properly.
4. If you have already removed the wiper harness, you should be able to remove the whole harness out completely. On the aus spec cars which i have worked on i have had to just lay new wires for the alternator and water temp sensor after removing the whole loom, BUT I only have experience with AUS spec cars so wait for someone to confirm that their is nothing extra other then the wipers on the US spec model.
5. The full range tps will give you nothing extra unless your tuning in tps mode. Which most people dont.
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Old 08-16-08, 06:56 PM
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Thanks!

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
1.You can REMOVE EVERYTHING. Only thing you leave is the vaccum lines for THE oil metering pump. Everything can be cleaned right out.
Everything including the booster line? Yeah, I'm leaving all the things associated with the OMP.

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
2.You should keep the charcoal canister other wise you get fumes in the car and no were for your oil to go when your giving your car stick.
Whenever I looked at an engine bay pic post Microtech install the canister was there - then I saw an N/A install and didn't see it - so I thought I'd ask!

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
3.You still need the alternator wires. other wise the alternator wont charge properly.
Perfect - I had kept it, so I'll be sure not to lose it!

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
4. If you have already removed the wiper harness, you should be able to remove the whole harness out completely. On the aus spec cars which i have worked on i have had to just lay new wires for the alternator and water temp sensor after removing the whole loom, BUT I only have experience with AUS spec cars so wait for someone to confirm that their is nothing extra other then the wipers on the US spec model.
Ok, I'm a bit confused...... So, are you saying that you took out the harness that goes to the igniters aswell as the harness that includes the AFM / Injectors / TPS connections? I've already got rid of that one, but I'm not sure if there is anything I can/should take out of the car on the other side (loom fo igniters and main fuse box etc...).

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
5. The full range tps will give you nothing extra unless your tuning in tps mode. Which most people dont.
Perfect - I wont go through the hassle of switching them out. I plan on bailing the BAC and running a dedicated Vac line straight to the microtech.

Thanks again for the help!
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Old 08-17-08, 07:10 PM
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Dont remove the main loom in the car. the one you have already removed is perfect. no need for anymore.

Also you need a brake line. lol. I hope no one tells you that you dont need one.
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Old 08-17-08, 08:43 PM
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Hey man, thanks again!

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
Dont remove the main loom in the car. the one you have already removed is perfect. no need for anymore.
That's what I figured, but I had this sudden thought that the wiring to the igniters are now not necessary and I should remove them! But the more I thought the more that I thought how I needed every other wire in that loom!

Originally Posted by rx72c View Post
Also you need a brake line. lol. I hope no one tells you that you dont need one.
LOL - yeah. I had left the booster line in place as I couldn't imagine not needing it - but the way you said I could get rid of EVERYTHING made me think twice!

I have one more question though....

I had planned on getting a wideband O2 sensor to keep an eye on things. Would this wideband in any way interact with the microtech, or would it simply be on it's own? Say I were to get an Innovative wideband (LC-1) would either an XD-16 OR a DB series guage be suitable? Could the sensor go in the stock location? Does the Microtech need an O2 sensor at all?

Thanks again!!!
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Old 08-18-08, 06:59 PM
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Microtech does not require the sensor. Sensor can go in stock location.
As for the LC-1 sensor i dont have any experience with it so i couldnt tell you exactly guage it would work with.
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Old 08-19-08, 10:00 PM
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Thanks for the help man, it has cleared up some of the misconceptions I had!
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Old 08-21-08, 08:49 AM
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If the LC-1 has a narrowband output, connect that to the Microtech instead of the stock sensor. It will enable you to display A/F ratio in the software and in datalogs, which will make tuning a hell of a lot easier.
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Old 08-21-08, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
If the LC-1 has a narrowband output, connect that to the Microtech instead of the stock sensor. It will enable you to display A/F ratio in the software and in datalogs, which will make tuning a hell of a lot easier.
Hmmm... good point. If it doesn't have a narrow band output, then I should probably look for one that does. Any recommendations? Thanks!
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Old 08-21-08, 03:13 PM
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im pretty sure it does.
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Old 08-21-08, 05:01 PM
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yea the LC-1 does put out a narrowband signal but it isn't linear. i have done this and the reading on the microtech doesn't match the wideband gauge. when it is not near stoich it doesn't read accurately, when cruising it is damn near spot on. i read a post as to changing the values in the lc-1 software to different voltage ranges but i can't find it anymore.
when the **** is microtech gonna join the rest of the world and have wideband input?
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Old 08-21-08, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by pistones View Post
yea the LC-1 does put out a narrowband signal but it isn't linear. i have done this and the reading on the microtech doesn't match the wideband gauge. when it is not near stoich it doesn't read accurately, when cruising it is damn near spot on. i read a post as to changing the values in the lc-1 software to different voltage ranges but i can't find it anymore.
when the **** is microtech gonna join the rest of the world and have wideband input?
Hmmmmm.... Interesting. What wideband (that worts with an LT10) would you guys recommend then?
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Old 08-22-08, 03:59 AM
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If your microtech was ordered with the wideband option you can order one from microtech.
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Old 08-22-08, 03:46 PM
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For a step by step emissions removal and some other nice little mods you can do, go to www.rotaryresurrection.com. Kevin has everything spelled out for you with pics.
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Old 08-23-08, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by pistones View Post
yea the LC-1 does put out a narrowband signal but it isn't linear. i have done this and the reading on the microtech doesn't match the wideband gauge. when it is not near stoich it doesn't read accurately, when cruising it is damn near spot on. i read a post as to changing the values in the lc-1 software to different voltage ranges but i can't find it anymore.
when the **** is microtech gonna join the rest of the world and have wideband input?
I wouldn't expect a narrowband signal to be linear, as a narrowband sensor doesn't produce a linear signal. But it's too bad that the LC-1 does not produce a decent signal, or the Microtech is incapable of reading it.

Microtech won't release code for our ECUs to allow things that every other ECU does. Effectively they scammed us into buying crippled boxes with the promise that we would get new software soon...and that was 6 years ago.
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Old 08-23-08, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Rotorhead34 View Post
For a step by step emissions removal and some other nice little mods you can do, go to www.rotaryresurrection.com. Kevin has everything spelled out for you with pics.
Yeah, I've read Kevin's site a few times, but the issue is that (like 98% of the threads I've read) they are on Turbo engines. While the basics are the same, there are obviously differences and that's where I need most of the clarifications.

*EDIT* Just looked at Kevin's site again and there is a 13b NA emissions removal link that I missed before! I had read the Turbo one a few times but never saw the NA one! Thanks for making me take another look.


Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
I wouldn't expect a narrowband signal to be linear, as a narrowband sensor doesn't produce a linear signal. But it's too bad that the LC-1 does not produce a decent signal, or the Microtech is incapable of reading it.
Is this problem with the LC-1 a common thing? Is it ONLY with the LC-1 or is it a function of the Microtech and can therefor expect it with ANY wideband I get? As I haven't bought the wideband yet, is there a different (or better) option than the LC-1?


Right now I've only got one real question regarding the removal of all the emissions equipment - and it has to do with the BAC valve. Now, from what I've read, removing the thermowax etc is only really a good idea if you live in a climate like Florida or California.... and I do not. Now, I don't want to deal with a BAC, so this is what I was thinking.... Axe the BAC and put a blockoff plate on the remaining hole. From that plate I'll draw a dedicated vacuum line for the Microtech (as it would seem to give me an uncluttered and direct manifold pressure). Now, if I basically ran the coolant tube (that used to go to the BAC and then to the back of the TB) directly to the back of the TB and leave the thermowax in place - will it still work? Is this a good idea or am I missing something?

Thanks again guys!

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Old 08-23-08, 04:46 PM
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You can run the coolant lines through the thermowax and it will work fine. All your doing is bypassing the bac. I know it gets cold up there and keeping it might be a good idea for you.

As for the wideband, you'll just have to take your readings from the wideband seperate as the microtech just wont. It wont really matter what wideband you get, however, most seem to like the LC-1, me included.
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Old 08-24-08, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Nick86 View Post
Yeah, I've read Kevin's site a few times, but the issue is that (like 98% of the threads I've read) they are on Turbo engines. While the basics are the same, there are obviously differences and that's where I need most of the clarifications.
There are only a few minor differences. It's essentially the same.

Is this problem with the LC-1 a common thing? Is it ONLY with the LC-1 or is it a function of the Microtech and can therefor expect it with ANY wideband I get? As I haven't bought the wideband yet, is there a different (or better) option than the LC-1?
The problem is centered around the Microtech. Unlike every other standalone, the Microtech is factory configured to recognize either a narrow band sensor (why they include this I don't know, because the ECU doesn't support closed loop and the narrowband doesn't work well for tuning) or a wideband. If you have the ECU configured for a narrowband, you need to send it back to Microtech for the wideband option and get charged for the privilege.

Thus, it really doesn't matter what wideband you buy since it won't connect to you ECU.

Right now I've only got one real question regarding the removal of all the emissions equipment - and it has to do with the BAC valve.
BAC is not emissions equipment.

Now, from what I've read, removing the thermowax etc is only really a good idea if you live in a climate like Florida or California.... and I do not.
Correct. No one has a good reason to remove the cold start cam/thermowax unless it's a race car.

Now, I don't want to deal with a BAC, so this is what I was thinking.... Axe the BAC and put a blockoff plate on the remaining hole.
The BAC is there so the ECU can control the idle. It has many advantages as it allows a stable idle under all kinds of electrical loads. I suggest you retain the valve. I'm currently trying to figure out how to modify my intake manifold to allow me to run one with minimum of carnage. However of course, if you didn't buy the BAC option, you need to send the Microtech back and have it installed (paying for the opportunity).

From that plate I'll draw a dedicated vacuum line for the Microtech (as it would seem to give me an uncluttered and direct manifold pressure). Now, if I basically ran the coolant tube (that used to go to the BAC and then to the back of the TB) directly to the back of the TB and leave the thermowax in place - will it still work? Is this a good idea or am I missing something?
Yep. Just remove the BAC from the loop.
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Old 08-25-08, 12:15 AM
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Thanks again for the help guys!


Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
If you have the ECU configured for a narrowband, you need to send it back to Microtech for the wideband option and get charged for the privilege.
I haven't ordered the microtech yet, so should I be specifying a "wideband option" when I order it? You may say that I should consider other ECU options, but the fact is that Microtech has by far the most local tuners and support, so I figured it was the wisest option.


Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
BAC is not emissions equipment.
Yeah, I've just been using "emissions equipment" as a general term for everything I've been able to remove even though items like the BAC, resistor pack and Pressure sensor aren't emissions equipment at all. lol I shouldn't generalise!


Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
Correct. No one has a good reason to remove the cold start cam/thermowax unless it's a race car.
Yup, that's precisely what I figured. Drivability is a priorety to me, so I'm leaving the thermowax on there.


Originally Posted by Aaron Cake View Post
The BAC is there so the ECU can control the idle. It has many advantages as it allows a stable idle under all kinds of electrical loads. I suggest you retain the valve. I'm currently trying to figure out how to modify my intake manifold to allow me to run one with minimum of carnage. However of course, if you didn't buy the BAC option, you need to send the Microtech back and have it installed (paying for the opportunity).
I hate my BAC. lol seriously, I've tried 3 of them - one was siezed and the other two seemed to do nothing but give me a surging idle, so I unplugged it about 5 years ago and have not looked back since. I understand what you are saying about retaining it (especially as I want drivability to be seamless) but I've had no issue without one for a long time, so I am not apt to go to the effort of retaining it. Am I out of line here or is it THAT worth having?

Your project to run it on your manifold does sound interesting... I'll be interested to see how it goes!
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Old 08-25-08, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Nick86 View Post
Thanks again for the help guys!
I haven't ordered the microtech yet, so should I be specifying a "wideband option" when I order it? You may say that I should consider other ECU options, but the fact is that Microtech has by far the most local tuners and support, so I figured it was the wisest option.
Yes. Tell them you want wideband logging.

The Microtech has it's MAJOR flaws, but by far has been the most reliable ECU I've ever worked with. It's immune to noise, and very easy to tune. I run one on my car, though I do curse the flaws quite often.

Yup, that's precisely what I figured. Drivability is a priorety to me, so I'm leaving the thermowax on there.
Good choice.

I hate my BAC. lol seriously, I've tried 3 of them - one was siezed and the other two seemed to do nothing but give me a surging idle, so I unplugged it about 5 years ago and have not looked back since.
The surging idle points to another problem with the car. The stock ECU really can't think on it's feet and if the idle is outside the range the BAC can deal with, it hunts.

I understand what you are saying about retaining it (especially as I want drivability to be seamless) but I've had no issue without one for a long time, so I am not apt to go to the effort of retaining it. Am I out of line here or is it THAT worth having?
If you don't have A/C, or an electric fan, big stereo or in general big electrical loads, you will probably be fine without it if you set the idle to 1000 RPM and tune it slightly rich. But what the BAC will allow you to do is maintain that perfect 750 RPM factory idle and not have it dip or hunt around when the engine load changes.
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Old 10-17-08, 02:34 PM
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I've received my LT10 and begun the process of positioning, wiring and cleaning up the engine bay. All is falling into place, but I have one other question:

I've decided to buy new injectors. The car is an '86 N/A, so (if I remember correctly) it came with the low impedance injectors and a resistor pack. As I'm putting the microtech in, what injectors should I get as far as impedance goes - low or high?

If I get the low ones, do I still need the resistor pack?

Thanks!
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Old 10-17-08, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Nick86 View Post
I've received my LT10 and begun the process of positioning, wiring and cleaning up the engine bay. All is falling into place, but I have one other question:

I've decided to buy new injectors. The car is an '86 N/A, so (if I remember correctly) it came with the low impedance injectors and a resistor pack. As I'm putting the microtech in, what injectors should I get as far as impedance goes - low or high?

If I get the low ones, do I still need the resistor pack?

Thanks!
The microtech will drive both low and high impedence injectors. Just make sure they are all the same impedence. You will not need the resistor pack either way unless you mix them.
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Old 10-17-08, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Rotorhead34 View Post
The microtech will drive both low and high impedence injectors. Just make sure they are all the same impedence. You will not need the resistor pack either way unless you mix them.
Cool - thanks. All four injectors will be the same - it's just now a case of high or low!

Now, I've read a bunch of opinions as to the benefits and drawbacks to each, so I have yet to see a clear "use the X impedance" consensus. Most people seem to say "use what the car came with" so I for me that would be low. Anyone have a different opinion?
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Old 10-18-08, 10:09 AM
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You can run any impedance you wish. Just don't mix and match.
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