Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

i know this thread has been covered alot. but i just installed a wideband, im running lt8-s. my a/f ratios are at 10.4 on idle free revs to 2500 bogs driving is along the lines or 11.5- 12.3. i have used silverrotors base map and not helping. its streetported 3mm seals, fmic, 3in exhaust, walboro, stock turbo. i cant get the thing to run right. i have 53 miles on fresh motor im scared to drive the car any longer with a/f ratios that low. I need something to get me till i can get it tuned i live in kansas so getting to a tuner is a little difficult.
any help will be great.

TEDDER1

iTrader: (1)

People are gonna need to know injector sizes and stuff.

Im no expert but mine had the water temp setting adding too much fuel at operating temps (82*C/180*F) and had to lower the %. It made the whole driving range/idle rich and now im ok.

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

injectors are 550s. ill try that and see what happens, im also getting really bad idle its very loopy, could that cause idle problems too?

TEDDER1

iTrader: (1)

When then water temp setting is too high it blankets the entire time with extra fuel. When it sees that water temp it automatically increases fuel by that %, no matter if its idling, under load, cruising, etc.

The Mixtrm setting does the same thing. mines at 0%. [example] it also corrects* by adding/subtracting across the entire fuel curve.

TEDDER1

iTrader: (1)

when you hit load does it just buckle and the AF ratio near bottoms out?

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

Yes ill be sgifting into the next gear early because it will spit and sputter at 2500 to 2800 like a Rev limiter. Ill upload my map see if you can tell what's going on

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

here is my current map. i forgot to answer to a/f yes it goes down to 11.5 when it bogs

idle Map


30" ~ 1.33
25" ~ 1.48
20" ~ 1.95
15" ~ 2.38
10" ~ 2.48
05" ~ 3.48
00" ~ 4.0
2-20psi ~ 4.95

Load Map

Load minMS~ 1.76
25" ~ 1.86
20" ~ 1.95
15" ~ 2.24
10" ~ 2.90
05" ~ 3.90
00" ~ 4.81
2psi ~ 5.62
4psi ~ 6.10
6psi ~ 7.14
8psi ~ 7.86
10psi ~ 8.48
14psi ~ 8.71
16psi ~ 9.00
18psi ~ 9.48
20psi ~ 10.00

RPMwot Map
0500-9000~ 00%

RPMcrs
0500-9000 ~00%
Pump Map


Pump2Start ~ 2000
Pump1Amt ~ 10
Pump1Pulse ~ 02
Pump1Trig ~ 14
Pump1Stop ~ 00
Pump1Adv ~ 05

Pump2Time ~ 10
Pump2Amt ~ 30
Pump2Trig ~ 16
Pump2Stop ~ 00
Pump2Adv ~ 05

PumpDwell ~ 3.00
PumpTimers ~ No
Pump1Sync ~ No
PumpSpare ~ 00
PumpCold ~ 00

Water Map
Screen 20

-25 ~ 0
-17 ~ 70
-9 ~ 60
-1 ~ 55
5 ~ 50
11 ~ 50
18 ~ 45
24 ~ 35
31 ~ 30
38 ~ 20
46 ~ -1
60 ~ 10
68 ~ -1
82 ~ -21
99 ~ 0
124 ~ 0

Air_t Map
Screen 21

-25 ~ 0
-17 ~ 8
-9 ~ 6
-1 ~ 5
5 ~ 4
11 ~ 3
18 ~ 3
24 ~ 0
31 ~ 0
38 ~ 0
46 ~ 0
60 ~ 0
68 ~ 0
82 ~ 0
99 ~ 0
124 ~ 0

Crank Map

-25 ~ 72
-17 ~ 72
-9 ~ 72
-1 ~ 67
5 ~ 62
11 ~ 57
18 ~ 50
24 ~ 41
31 ~ 31
38 ~ 26
46 ~ 20
60 ~ 15
68 ~ 5
82 ~ 0
99 ~ 0
124 ~ 0

t*rpm


Idle ~ 00
1000 ~ 10
1500 ~ 15
2000 ~ 20
2500 ~ 25
3000 ~ 25
3500 ~ 25
4000 ~ 25
4500 ~ 25
5000 ~ 25
5500 ~ 25
6000 ~ 25
6500 ~ 25
7000 ~ 25
7500 ~ ??
8000 ~ 25
9000 ~ 25

t*map Map


Idle ~ 00
25 ~ 05
20 ~ 04
15 ~ 03
10 ~ 02
05 ~ 00
00 ~ 00
2psi ~ 00
4psi ~ 00
6psi ~ 00
8psi ~ -02
10psi ~ -03
12psi ~ ???
14psi ~ -04
16psi ~ -05
18 psi ~ -06
20 psi ~ -06

t*air Screen 25
-25- 124~ -04%
t*gap


0500 ~ 15
1000 ~ 15
1500 ~ 15
2000 ~ 14
2500 ~ 12
3000 ~ 10
3500 ~ 10
4000 ~ 10
4500 ~ 10
5000 ~ 10
5500 ~ 10
6000 ~ 10
6500 ~ 10
7000 ~ 10
8000 ~ 10

t*Inj Map


0500 ~ 120
1000 ~ 150
1500 ~ 150
2000 ~ 150
2500 ~ 150
3000 ~ 150
3500 ~ 180
4000 ~ 180
4500 ~ 210
5000 ~ 210
5500 ~ 210
6000 ~ 240
6500 ~ 240
7000 ~ 270
8000 ~ 270
9000 ~ 270

t*wat Map S

Option Map
Opt Mixtrm 02%
Tpscal +10
Opt titrm + 00
Opt static +00
Opt max +30
Opt Rpmwot 04
Opt rmpcrs 15hg
Af_StE ~ 10
Dwell ~ 3.00
REVstg ~ 3000
MAPstg ~ 05 Hg
%stg ~ 50%

mattmarrx3

idle Map


30" ~ 1.33
25" ~ 1.48
20" ~ 1.95
15" ~ 2.38
10" ~ 2.48


id drop the 20 hg down a bit and try to get it idleing at 12. ish those number under load are not to bad ive to 10.5 on cruse and 9.6 under full load and a miss at 6500 up to 8500 and have only changed to a 3.5 inch exuast after the dyno get a dyno done it will make it a lot better and safer to tune it

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

alright man ill try that. havent really mess with it ive been out of town. well see what happens.

bumpstart

very fat idle numbers!!
with 550 injectors you need to have the 15 and 20 in Hg maps with 2.1- 2.4 real time numbers

if stage % is 50 ,, then this will amount to 1.5 to 1.6 ms in the idle bin values ( 15 and 20 in Hg )
\
1.95 ms will equate to 2.95 ms real time
and 2.38 ms will equate to 3.57 ms real time ,,,, WAY to much and detrimental for carbon build up and for washing all the lube away and contaminating the oil with petrol
values below idle vacuums ( 25 and 30 in Hg ) should be made the same as those at the idle point ( same as -20 map ) to prevent dips coming down to idle

also ,,the bug when you stage is a rich glitch missfire and represents on the wideband as a momentary lean out

you simply have way to much fuel going on and need to pull down the -5in Hg and 0 psi load bins

also,, your boost retard timing map is terrible !!! do not trust that one at all , search my posts and you may find a few 550/1000 maps that have a much better retard timing map

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

okay ill adjust it, makes sense on what you described, sorry im new to the whole standalone thing so bear with me. Is this the map your talking about?


-5 ATDC datum mark is 0 static timing
timing max=30 ( 25 BTDC )
mixtrim=5%
staging 78%
staging thresholds 2 psi , 3000 rpm
RPM WOT =3 PSI
RPM CRUISE=-9"hg
idle maps
-25=1.19
-20=1.19
-15=1.48
-10=2.38
-5=3.33
0=3.50
loadmaps
-25=1.38
-20=1.38
-15=2.43
-10=2.90
-5=3.33
0=3.50
2=3.62
4=3.90
6=4.10
8=4.57
10=4.95
14=5.95
16=6.33
18=6.95
20=7.95

WOT
1k=5%
1.5k=10%
2K=5%
2.5k=5%
3k=5%
3.5k=5%
4k=5%
4.5k=5%
5k=5%
5.5k=5%
6k=5%
6.5k=5%
7k=5%
7.5k=5%
8k=5%
8.5k=5%
9k=5%

CRUISE
1.5k=-20%
2k=-25%
2.5k=-25%
3k=-25%
3.5k=-20%
4k=-15%
4.5k=-15%
5K=-10%
5.5k=0%

T map
idle=0
-25=7
-20=6
-15=5
-10=3
-5=2
0=1
2=0
4=-2
6=-4
8=-6
10=-8
14=-13 ( -12 )
16=-16 ( -14 )
18=-18 ( -16 )
20=-20 (-18 )
T RPM
idle =10
1000=10
1500=14
2000=20
2500=22
3000=24
3500=24
4000=24
4500=24
5000=24
5500=24
6000=26
7000=26
8000=26
9000=27

split
idle=15
1k=15
1.5K=15
2k=14
2.5k=12
3k=10
3.5k=8

bumpstart

yes, just use only the ignition curve from that
you will note that total timing is around 7-9 indicated ( map + rpm ) at 20 psi and 9000 rpm, with -5 datum smudge that makes about 2-4 BTDC real time
and so is a very safe map with as much as 5 degree of margin ( fuel depending )

numbers in parenthis are used for low comp rotors

be aware the map is posted with such margin for a few important reasons
- many people dont twig to the -5 datum thing and can indavertantly be 5 more than intended from outset
-there is fuel quality variances in the market the numbers may be used in
- the map is safe enough if used with a 9.4 or 9.0 or 8.5 compression starting point
- there is natural drift with rpm in the timing signal interpolation from Vr signal to be wary of

use these as a starting basis and creep up incrementally

take the view that there is not a lot to gain in the last 2 degrees off from optimum timing , and much to lose

keep your fuel map
adjust the idle bins as described above
( when warming up real time numbers will be higher,, wilder extend port may need 2.5-2.6 real time at 90 degrees )
( assuming normal mode ) then get the calculator out and pull about 15% out of the screen 8 load bins for -5 and 0 psi

this should raise idle vacuum and make things less sooty and less glitchy as it transitions to boost

Brapbrap87

iTrader: (2)

so im gonna be using T map
idle=0
-25=7
-20=6
-15=5
-10=3
-5=2
0=1
2=0
4=-2
6=-4
8=-6
10=-8
14=-13 ( -12 )
16=-16 ( -14 )
18=-18 ( -16 )
20=-20 (-18 )
T RPM
idle =10
1000=10
1500=14
2000=20
2500=22
3000=24
3500=24
4000=24
4500=24
5000=24
5500=24
6000=26
7000=26
8000=26
9000=27
.. i have tried this, it has hard start will it seems like it doesnt want to start then slowly cranks over then its fine.
i have adjusted load and took out 15%. its still running like crap, very glitchy. now what do you mean by real time?

bumpstart

have you done a timing calibration and a TPS calibration,, these things you must do FIRST
you must then keep the engine running with throttle till the engine is warmed up fully time BEFORE you play any of the fuel maps
doing so before you have warmed up is chasing your tail because you have crude coolant temp corrections bullying the crap out of the true map
and you may as well give up now if you cant grasp that

have you then modded the idle fuel values so that the display reads around 2.4/2.5 ms REAL TIME -WHILE IDLING

NOTE above,, changing the idle values will do nothing if your TPS calibration is out
and the idle numbers will be unexpected values if your timing is not claibrated to the -5 ATDC mark

( real time is what is displayed in the handset while running ,, it is NOT at all what is written in the fuel map bins pre -staging , or during warmup )
all prestage values written in the bins effectively have 50% added to them cause that is what you have as the staging % value

UNDERSTAND?

these ignition numbers and basic idle values i have used in countless extendies with 550 injectors - and i know they work well

if the motor still glitches heavily at staging , check first that all injectors have the same resistance,, matching hi and low ohming injector pairs can bring a staging glitch

then you can try to continue pulling fuel incrementally out of the -5 and 0 bins ( where your staging is set )
or you can push the stage point fractionally higher to 0 or to 2 psi
,, and the engine will demand and use more of the excessive fuel from the prestaging bins up to the point of staging

Eli063

This thread was also usefully thanks