Megasquirt 6 port bridge NA help
03-22-16, 09:12 AM
#79
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
Update, currently waiting on fuses to come in the mail, ripped off the upper intake to pour some oil in and snagged a wire and grounded it on the Intake and popped a fuse in the ms3
03-25-16, 10:58 AM
#80
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
Fuse has been replaced and I started messing around with cranking advance, and somehow I ended up entering 45° cranking advance and it started right up, discovered the engine builder put the 12a pulley on incorrectly (can bolt on 4 ways) anyone have tips on how to find TDC now that I have to reset timing? Can't go off of crank pulley or CAS, input is highly appreciated!
03-26-16, 10:01 AM
#81
Engine, Not Motor
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At TDC, the keyway in the eccentric faces the exhaust/intake port side of the engine.
As an aside, this is why I never separate pulley/hub sets. I'll either tack weld them together or drill a hole through both and wire them together.
As an aside, this is why I never separate pulley/hub sets. I'll either tack weld them together or drill a hole through both and wire them together.
06-27-16, 04:07 PM
#85
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
Update:
After doing some further digging into the car I decided to disconnect the coils and crank the car to see if I still got lost sync reasons 11 & 17. Of course with the coils unplugged I still got the codes, so that lead me to believe my CAS was bad.
After tossing back and fourth with the idea to buy a new CAS or not I thought to myself "Well, the CAS may fix my no start/dying issue, but if the ls2 coils are noisey I may want to go away from a VR sensor or I may have more issues down the road." So I went with the Full Function Engineering Hall effect trigger kit, wired it up and put in the new settings in the ECU and boom, started without any hesitation and stayed running!
When we went for the first test drive the car wanted to idle itself down and die (even though I have the idle set screw holding the throttle open 20% just to maintain an idle) I also noticed the stock S4 TPS had 2 ranges on it, 1-25% then jumps to 100%
I know the s5 TPS is the way to go but I'm currently doing research on retrofitting a more modern/easily accessible TPS (probably a GM unless anyone else has done something more effectively), one that doesn't cost $200 new and the only thing less expensive than that is used which just sounds like a headache waiting to happen.
The car will idle (90% of the time) and almost sounds like a P Port and idles like one too at 2000-2300 rpm,
If you want to see the car idle I will try to post a video (if my phone will let me) if not look me up on Instagram @Ratchet_Brap and don't mind the wiring, I haven't cleaned it up and refuse to until I work out every last bug.
After doing some further digging into the car I decided to disconnect the coils and crank the car to see if I still got lost sync reasons 11 & 17. Of course with the coils unplugged I still got the codes, so that lead me to believe my CAS was bad.
After tossing back and fourth with the idea to buy a new CAS or not I thought to myself "Well, the CAS may fix my no start/dying issue, but if the ls2 coils are noisey I may want to go away from a VR sensor or I may have more issues down the road." So I went with the Full Function Engineering Hall effect trigger kit, wired it up and put in the new settings in the ECU and boom, started without any hesitation and stayed running!
When we went for the first test drive the car wanted to idle itself down and die (even though I have the idle set screw holding the throttle open 20% just to maintain an idle) I also noticed the stock S4 TPS had 2 ranges on it, 1-25% then jumps to 100%
I know the s5 TPS is the way to go but I'm currently doing research on retrofitting a more modern/easily accessible TPS (probably a GM unless anyone else has done something more effectively), one that doesn't cost $200 new and the only thing less expensive than that is used which just sounds like a headache waiting to happen.
The car will idle (90% of the time) and almost sounds like a P Port and idles like one too at 2000-2300 rpm,
If you want to see the car idle I will try to post a video (if my phone will let me) if not look me up on Instagram @Ratchet_Brap and don't mind the wiring, I haven't cleaned it up and refuse to until I work out every last bug.
07-01-16, 10:06 AM
#86
Engine, Not Motor
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While a full range TPS would be better for you, especially with those high overlap ports (because the accel pump won't be able to reliably function on MAP signal), the stock silly 1/4 range TPS will do the job. Primarily because after about 1/4 throttle you don't need the accell pump anymore.
Keep the idle around 2K while the engine breaks in and you work on the tune. Then you can slowly drop it. Should be able to get it idling around 1300 - 1500 RPM at ratios leaner than you'd think (as displayed by the wideband). Don't try to use the BAC to idle the bridgeport. Just set it up for PWM warmup only.
Keep the idle around 2K while the engine breaks in and you work on the tune. Then you can slowly drop it. Should be able to get it idling around 1300 - 1500 RPM at ratios leaner than you'd think (as displayed by the wideband). Don't try to use the BAC to idle the bridgeport. Just set it up for PWM warmup only.
07-04-16, 02:49 PM
#87
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
I currently am not using any form of idle control (BAC), I am currently using the idle screw to keep the throttle open 20% but it still will work its way down and dies. When it dies the AFRs go full lean so I'm thinking I may have a slight restriction in the line.
The only stock sensor left on the car is the TPS, and I know the stock TPS can work, I just hate the design of it and would prefer something that would give me a full accurate range.
I'm waiting on my BMW 328is to sell so I can fund the turbo parts, should be getting $3k for it when the title comes so I figured I'd upgrade the TPS while I wait for the BMW to sell, then it's time for the big boy stuff
The only stock sensor left on the car is the TPS, and I know the stock TPS can work, I just hate the design of it and would prefer something that would give me a full accurate range.
I'm waiting on my BMW 328is to sell so I can fund the turbo parts, should be getting $3k for it when the title comes so I figured I'd upgrade the TPS while I wait for the BMW to sell, then it's time for the big boy stuff
Last edited by Scrappy_Brap; 07-04-16 at 02:50 PM. Reason: Because I'm retarded and can't spell
07-05-16, 10:11 AM
#88
Senior Member
Here is a shot of how I mounted a GM TPS on my throttle body. In this case you have to cut off the oil injection linkage but since we already were running premix it wasn't any issue.
07-09-16, 09:46 AM
#90
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I currently am not using any form of idle control (BAC), I am currently using the idle screw to keep the throttle open 20% but it still will work its way down and dies. When it dies the AFRs go full lean so I'm thinking I may have a slight restriction in the line.
The only stock sensor left on the car is the TPS, and I know the stock TPS can work, I just hate the design of it and would prefer something that would give me a full accurate range.
I'm waiting on my BMW 328is to sell so I can fund the turbo parts, should be getting $3k for it when the title comes so I figured I'd upgrade the TPS while I wait for the BMW to sell, then it's time for the big boy stuff
The only stock sensor left on the car is the TPS, and I know the stock TPS can work, I just hate the design of it and would prefer something that would give me a full accurate range.
I'm waiting on my BMW 328is to sell so I can fund the turbo parts, should be getting $3k for it when the title comes so I figured I'd upgrade the TPS while I wait for the BMW to sell, then it's time for the big boy stuff
If before, then your warmup curve probably has a lean spot at the end or your idle is tuned too lean such that when the warmup enrichment ends, the engine leans out.
It's fairly easy to modify the throttle body to accept a GM or Ford full range TPS. Search the Haltech subforum as there are detailed instructions.
07-09-16, 10:36 AM
#91
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
Cool, I'll take a look at the Haltech section!
It's odd, it happens before it dies but it happens in a pattern, as in its very predictable when I'm watching it idle I can predict when it'll go lean (about every 5-10 seconds or so) I had the car up to temp (at about 200°) and it still continues to do it
It's odd, it happens before it dies but it happens in a pattern, as in its very predictable when I'm watching it idle I can predict when it'll go lean (about every 5-10 seconds or so) I had the car up to temp (at about 200°) and it still continues to do it
07-09-16, 05:11 PM
#92
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
Update: I idled the car up some to compensate for slight misfire or whatever it is, (someone said it may be just extra air from the overlap)
I took the car for a drive and it was a handful to say the least, it kept trying to die unless I was tinkering with the throttle, the car is producing an abnormal amount of smoke, at first I thought it may be the oil burning off from pouring oil down the intake, but now I'm growing to be a little scared. The exhaust smells like oil, but I thought it would've burned off by now? But then again when I was chasing the bad CAS we suspected low compression so we kept pouring oil down the intake, attempting to start, run for a second, die, play with the tune, and repeat, so long story short I went through about 6 or so quarts all said and done when we were chasing our tails. Maybe just a pool of oil stuck in the exhaust? If that were the case then why is the car running rough, popping, and trying to die? I'm getting frustrated with chasing issue after issue!
I took the car for a drive and it was a handful to say the least, it kept trying to die unless I was tinkering with the throttle, the car is producing an abnormal amount of smoke, at first I thought it may be the oil burning off from pouring oil down the intake, but now I'm growing to be a little scared. The exhaust smells like oil, but I thought it would've burned off by now? But then again when I was chasing the bad CAS we suspected low compression so we kept pouring oil down the intake, attempting to start, run for a second, die, play with the tune, and repeat, so long story short I went through about 6 or so quarts all said and done when we were chasing our tails. Maybe just a pool of oil stuck in the exhaust? If that were the case then why is the car running rough, popping, and trying to die? I'm getting frustrated with chasing issue after issue!
07-10-16, 09:33 AM
#93
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If you poured oil down the intake, then it has pooled in the exhaust and will take a LONG time to burn off. Could be an hour or more depending on the temperature of the exhaust.
If the car kept trying to die, and you can predict it, then it sounds like there is an area of the map that is too lean. Eventually the engine crosses that area of the map, gets trapped in it, then it's all downhill from there.
You may have to have the idle of a new bridgeported engine rather high until things break in and the map is tuned. Tuning a bridgeport presents its own challenges like a lot of the load map overlaps with the light load map.
If the car kept trying to die, and you can predict it, then it sounds like there is an area of the map that is too lean. Eventually the engine crosses that area of the map, gets trapped in it, then it's all downhill from there.
You may have to have the idle of a new bridgeported engine rather high until things break in and the map is tuned. Tuning a bridgeport presents its own challenges like a lot of the load map overlaps with the light load map.
07-10-16, 02:22 PM
#94
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
I appreciate how much you've been helping me through this process! I highly appreciate it and can't thank you enough!
I hope it's tune related, but on the other hand I hope it's not because I have little experience tuning and there's no megasquirt tuners in the Louisville KY area, I am beginning to fear the thought of trying to tune it myself
I hope it's tune related, but on the other hand I hope it's not because I have little experience tuning and there's no megasquirt tuners in the Louisville KY area, I am beginning to fear the thought of trying to tune it myself
07-24-16, 10:09 AM
#95
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Don't freak out about tuning. For one thing, the worst case is you mess up and you have to reload the prior map. Anytime you are going to make large changes, save the map. I still do this when tuning. One tuning session might result in 50 more saved maps. Then after I go through and delete all the insignificant ones.
Also it's almost impossible to cause damage to an NA via tuning. Unless something dreadfully crazy is done like tuning for 17:1 AFRs w/40 degrees of timing under WOT. You're not going to blow it up.
But in the same sense, tuning a bridgeport is probably the most difficult tune due to the ambiguous vacuum signal, the inverse vacuum characteristics in parts of the map, and the pollution of the wideband at light loads.
If you have the car basically drivable, give autotune a try. It can make a passable map very quickly but don't try to tune the idle with it. Just set the authority for above 2000 RPM, between say 40KPA and 100KPA. The AFR table on my website is a good place to start. That way you will be starting with a smooth map, which makes things a lot easier.
Also it's almost impossible to cause damage to an NA via tuning. Unless something dreadfully crazy is done like tuning for 17:1 AFRs w/40 degrees of timing under WOT. You're not going to blow it up.
But in the same sense, tuning a bridgeport is probably the most difficult tune due to the ambiguous vacuum signal, the inverse vacuum characteristics in parts of the map, and the pollution of the wideband at light loads.
If you have the car basically drivable, give autotune a try. It can make a passable map very quickly but don't try to tune the idle with it. Just set the authority for above 2000 RPM, between say 40KPA and 100KPA. The AFR table on my website is a good place to start. That way you will be starting with a smooth map, which makes things a lot easier.
07-26-16, 07:25 PM
#96
Old [Sch|F]ool
Depending on the way it is ported, I would set the cutoff to only work at anything over 50-60kpa, period.
Mine brapped down the highway at 50kpa and 3000rpm. And yes it is really weird how you need to add fuel at low load but it is perfectly happy to run at 15-16:1 at 80-90kpa.
I am not convinced that the autotune works worth a damn on any application. Every time I tried it, even on mild piston engines, I ended up either having to fix a lot of the map or delete the whole thing and start over with manual tuning. It probably works great if you have acceleration enrichments/deceleration fuel trimming nailed, but unfortunately you can't get that right until AFTER the VE table is dialed in.
Mine brapped down the highway at 50kpa and 3000rpm. And yes it is really weird how you need to add fuel at low load but it is perfectly happy to run at 15-16:1 at 80-90kpa.
I am not convinced that the autotune works worth a damn on any application. Every time I tried it, even on mild piston engines, I ended up either having to fix a lot of the map or delete the whole thing and start over with manual tuning. It probably works great if you have acceleration enrichments/deceleration fuel trimming nailed, but unfortunately you can't get that right until AFTER the VE table is dialed in.
Last edited by peejay; 07-26-16 at 07:27 PM.
07-27-16, 08:27 AM
#97
Senior Member
When you are using autotune you should turn off the acceleration enrichment, and decell fuel cut. The car will run fine with those disabled and it lets autotune do its thing without getting confused by the changes to fueling by those trims.
Right now I am working with Tuner Studio 3 Ultra which can do autotune trims for each rotor. I have a wideband installed in both header pipes, I use the front rotor to do the base VE table, and then use the sensor for the rear rotor to develop a trim for that rotor relative to the main VE table.
Right now I am working with Tuner Studio 3 Ultra which can do autotune trims for each rotor. I have a wideband installed in both header pipes, I use the front rotor to do the base VE table, and then use the sensor for the rear rotor to develop a trim for that rotor relative to the main VE table.
07-30-16, 09:37 PM
#98
Ratchet_Brap
Thread Starter
So I am running a s4 TPS, while giving the car throttle it would go from running fine to running on one rotor then back to running fine, I am currently thinking that the ecu is having issues figuring out what fuel to give dependent on throttle due to it getting 50% air flow due to throttle being half way open compared to the TPS reading 100%, I've rigged up a bracket (not pretty by any means but hell, function over form) so I am getting ready to wire up a full range TPS from a 2005 B3000, I will keep you guys updated,
Hoping this fixes a lot of the issues but I'm not counting on it, if it's not one thing it's another lol... Shoot me now Mazda
Hoping this fixes a lot of the issues but I'm not counting on it, if it's not one thing it's another lol... Shoot me now Mazda
07-30-16, 10:07 PM
#99
Old [Sch|F]ool
You may be having other issues. I never had that kind of problem with the S3/S4 TPS when the acceleration enrichment was dialed in. As pointed out upthread, it works okay because you don't really need acceleration enrichment past 1/3-1/2 throttle.
A problem I did have was the TPS getting sticky and not following the throttle arm. This is very easy to see on the old-school boxes where one of the LEDs on the case is for acceleration enrichment. Accelerate, stumble and no light, then a couple seconds later the light would blip and it would stumble again.
A problem I did have was the TPS getting sticky and not following the throttle arm. This is very easy to see on the old-school boxes where one of the LEDs on the case is for acceleration enrichment. Accelerate, stumble and no light, then a couple seconds later the light would blip and it would stumble again.
07-31-16, 10:46 AM
#100
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I am not convinced that the autotune works worth a damn on any application. Every time I tried it, even on mild piston engines, I ended up either having to fix a lot of the map or delete the whole thing and start over with manual tuning. It probably works great if you have acceleration enrichments/deceleration fuel trimming nailed, but unfortunately you can't get that right until AFTER the VE table is dialed in.
Maybe I'm lazy in my old age but I make extensive use of autotune. It can smooth out a map to a set of ratios quicker and easier than I can. Which leaves my time free for the real tuning that matters (enrichments, boost, yadda yadda).
So I am running a s4 TPS, while giving the car throttle it would go from running fine to running on one rotor then back to running fine, I am currently thinking that the ecu is having issues figuring out what fuel to give dependent on throttle due to it getting 50% air flow due to throttle being half way open compared to the TPS reading 100%, I've rigged up a bracket (not pretty by any means but hell, function over form) so I am getting ready to wire up a full range TPS from a 2005 B3000, I will keep you guys updated,
Hoping this fixes a lot of the issues but I'm not counting on it, if it's not one thing it's another lol... Shoot me now Mazda
Hoping this fixes a lot of the issues but I'm not counting on it, if it's not one thing it's another lol... Shoot me now Mazda
Running on one rotor during throttle could be a lot of things. An unturned area of the map that is way lean. Fuel or ignition cut due to an incorrect parameter. Does it always happen above 4000RPM or so? If that's it, then the CAS is wired backwards. Secondary staging could be another on. Logs would be needed to make further guesses.
