Haltech wizards, lend me your eyes. My ITB setup is running and driving great, it put down 170whp on the dyno with a stock port and supporting mods. I was wondering if my timing maps are optimized though. As in, am I getting everything I can get out of the timing as it is? Or is there room for improvement? I'd like to squeak a little more power out of this motor before I build a new one.

If you see anything that could be improved in my timing maps, I'd greatly appreciate any info.

Edit: I'm unsure why the text map displays 38. My engine data page shows that it never exceeds 27 degrees advanced on leading.

 

I suppose I should of provided additional information. Car is an s4 rx7, 48mm dcoe itb's, star mazda manifold, 2xID1000's primary only injection, racing beat true dual, haltech e6x, t2 fuel pump.

Would anything be gained from adding more timing in the leading? Or a closer split?

 

I wanted to reply to this a while ago but kept forgetting. On 91+ octane you can get as aggressive as you'd like with the timing. Set it in a dyno and tune to minimum best timing. Basically, advance the timing until it doesn't make any more power. In my experience with 6-port S5 engines, you can run timing up to 35+ at peak torque and not experience detonation with 91+ octane. Best torque is usually achieved with about 27°, but for testing purposes we kept advancing the timing to see what the effects were.

Past peak torque, the engine will want more advance. It's typical to see 30°+ in the 7000+ rpm range.

Stock port, stock intake S5 engines can make 185+ on a Dynojet with a good (loud!) exhaust for reference.

 

Regarding split; there's not much in it at all. Set it to 3° at full load and forget it. More split at idle and in deep vacuum will help in those areas. But at full load it's not even worth playing with.

 

No problem at all! I appreciate the informative response. I'm happy the car made the 170whp it did, but given the extensive mods I'm hoping to squeeze a little more power out. The car is currently running 87, but I can easily fill with 92.

So, this may sound like stupid, but I'm not sure I'm understanding the correlation between the timing bar graphs and the text table I posted. The data in the text view indicates that I'm running more ignition angle than the bar graph shows. Am I missing something?

Otherwise, I'm understanding that I should be able to up the timing in several areas. My concern with the split was due to what I've heard regarding wandering timing from the CAS. If the timing can possible wander up to 5 degrees, should I not leave a split of up to 5 degrees just in case?

 

I meant to follow up with this. C. Ludwig, is having an s4 engine the limiting factor to the power I'm making? I'm kind of flabbergasted that stock port, stock intake s5's are making more power than my ITB set up. I just had a new 2.5 inch exhaust fabbed up and almost broke 180whp. Do you think there is more to get out of it? Or is this the limit of the s4 motor?

 

So, revisiting this. My total leading advance at WOT according the graph above is 17* with the trailing timing at 10*. Should I up to the total advance under load at WOT to 27 and set split 3* out to 24*?

Edit: After fiddling with the above maps, I got a 5 degree split in low vacuum areas and all is well (went with 5 in the event of wandering timing of the CAS). However, no matter what adjustments I make to the trailing map at WOT, the text data page tells me it's at 25* leading and 10* trailing. I've upped the trailing ignition angle map and it still reads the same values at WOT. Is there a setting I'm missing somewhere that's not allowing trailing to be changed? I feel like I'm missing something.

 

Sorry, for the repeated posts. I found an old thread where C. Ludwig explained that the trail map in the e6x is actually the amount of split you want to run, not the actual trailing ignition angle. Issue solved! I'm an idiot!

 

you would want the timing to be 27 and 24, if the split is 4 yes. however im not sure i follow why c .ludwig talks of 91 octane, when you should go further to 93/94 and 32 degrees.


[/quot3=him]
Edit: After fiddling with the above maps, I got a 5 degree split in low vacuum areas and all is well (went with 5 in the event of wandering timing of the CAS). However, no matter what adjustments I make to the trailing map at WOT, the text data page tells me it's at 25* leading and 10* trailing. I've upped the trailing ignition angle map and it still reads the same values at WOT. Is there a setting I'm missing somewhere that's not allowing trailing to be changed? I feel like I'm missing something.[/QUOTE]

 

I take it back. I changed the split to 3 degrees at WOT, and the data page is still reflecting a 10 degree split. Is there something I'm missing?

 

I said 91+. There's no more power to be had with more advance. Unless you're using a fuel with a very slow burn characteristic realative that we used. Octane rating has nothing to do with how much advance an engine, which is not knock limited, wants. As I said in that post, we've run them all the way up to 35° BTDC leading and there simply isn't any more power to be had.

 

And as far as the E8 goes, sad to say, but it's a flaming hot turd. Without actually putting a timing light on the engine while it's strapped to the dyno under load, it's hard to say what it's actually doing.

 

lol. Thanks for the reply! I'm pretty sure the 3* split is in effect as the car feels to have more torque and I'm getting MUCH better gas mileage. At this point, I'm pretty sure the E6x data page has a glitch in the split timing field under WOT.