Kenteth

Anyone know if these things are even worth $20-30? If say you lower the car 1.5" you will need to dial out the camber. Any idea if either of these kits found on ebay will help? They are quite a bit cheaper than true pillowballs. Anyone know how many degrees they can dial out, what abotu a true pillowball/cusco ect.

OBX:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...spagename=WDVW

also OBX:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...spagename=WDVW

INGALLS:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...spagename=WDVW

Not ebay, EIBACH
http://www.drivewire.com/performance...gnmentkit.html

edmcguirk

I would worry about anybody who puts up pictures of stuff that won't fit on an FC but camber bolts are an acceptable way to set camber.

I prefer better quality bolts that I got here:
https://www.stempfperformance.com/topframe.asp

They use a full thickness bolt with a nylon offset that you rotate into position. There are no gaps arount the bolt that might allow slippage.

ed

Smoken'

iTrader: (1)

The cam bolts are the way to go. I have worked at an alignment shop for 4 years, and i have put plenty of them in. Have never had a problem with them.

ddub

Pillowball mounts by themselves don't allow adjustment of camber... You'd have to get a pillowball that comes with adjustable camber plates. Pillowball mounts are meant to get rid of the softer, more flexible stock mount with a solid one to make the suspension a lot stiffer and work at its max capacity.

I'm not sure if those work or not, but you could always get a camber adjuster kit from like Racing Beat or something. This is what they say on their site.

"The Rear Suspension Camber Adjuster is an adjustable link that replaces the stock, fixed-length link to allow moderate rear camber changes by tilting the rear suspension subframe. The immediate range of adjustment is .60 degrees less negative camber to .77 degrees more negative camber. With careful inspection and possibly some minor dimpling of the floor pan, this range can be nearly doubled. After installation, adjustments to camber are quickly made. There is virtually no toe change with this adjustment. "

Kenteth

I'm assuming I can tell the alignment shop that I have camber bolts and they will use them to further dial out for correct alignment?

ddub

I'm sure you could even buy the proper camber adjusting bolts there. When my friend slammed his DSM and went to get it adjusted they had a kit or the bolts or whatever that he could get through them. Bought them through the alignment shop, they installed them, they adjusted camber. All he had to do was drive there

Kenteth

Do you think they would cost more than $30 there? Generaly, 4pt alignments cost about $50 around here.

ddub

No idea, never gotten an alignment myself. Very easy way to find out, though, would be to go there and ask, or call. I'm sure they'd be more than happy to give you a quote on the parts (provided they can get them) if it means you might be doing business with them. Not only that, but say they can't get the parts, this gives you the opportunity to ask them if you bought the above mentioned adjustment bolts if they'd be able to dial in correct camber for you.

BKH777

go to your local parts store and tell then you need camber bolts for your car thay cost about $20 to $25....you can get 1.5 deg. of adjustment out with them...I am a sup. tech...work on peoples sup. and making them drive strate thats about all I do all day, for the last 20 years and I have installed 1000s of cam. bolts...no problems ever...

you do need a camber link for the rear (if you lower it) racingbeat makes a very nice 1 (have it on my own car) its adjustible and instead if a rubber bushing the stock bar has helm rod joints so it can't bind (the cheaper ones WILL)...but you do need it or your rear tires will wareout on the inside and you don't get as good strateline traction (tires lean in to much when you lower it)...only problem with the link is if you have the car lowered more than 1", you will have to dimple the floor so the fram does not hit the floor and make noise, but it takes 15 min. to do that so no biggie...

you need to install the link w/ alignment machine hooked up get it close, go drive the car about 25 miles then set the alignment, drive the car about 250 miles and recheck the alignment (IT WILL MOVE) then after that you should be good (not your $59.95 kind of alignment).
oh yea make sure all you sup. bushings are in good shape (install poly bushings?)
lowering these cars puts a lot of stress on them mostly the rear subfram bush. but check them all very well...

BKH777

for a normal 4 w/a say 59.95, but with 2 cambolts the price goes up about $60 per bolt...parts & labor...the rear is a hole other problem....to do it right anyway!!!to align a lowered 2 gen. rx7 right...

4w/a= $59.95
2 cambolts $120.00
Rear toe adjuster link $120.00 + labor, 2 hours at anyshop if your lucky say $69.00
realign after 250 miles $59.95


your looking $500.00 to do it right

Kenteth

Damn... those are some expensive cambolts

RETed

"Crash" bolts will eventually slip.
They are a waste of time.



-Ted

Kenteth

What do you suggest ted?

ra ra rotory

Im with Ted, These bolts are worthless, If you want to adjust your camber at all, Get the Racing beat bar (or mazdatrix) for the rear (I have one myself, if you have good machineing skills you could fab your own adjustable one out of the stock bar, not hard at all) As for the front, You need adjustable camber plates (aslo have myself) Gives you a whole **** load of adjustability.

Tofuball

OK, so I hear from this thread to NOT buy these bolts ($20) as they slip, and to instead get the RB ($100) part?

Kenteth

What bar are you talking about. Strut braces have nothing to do with camber other than they may add a bit of rigidity

MasteRX

The Racing Beat bar he is talking about is an adjustable link for the rear sub-frame which allows for rear camber adjustments.

Kenteth

right, nothign avail for the front though?

RETed

For front, get front camber plates.
This is the "right" way to get adustable camber.



-Ted

Kenteth

camber plates = pillow mounts?

RETed

When I mentioned "camber plates" this is equal to "adjustable pillow mounts".
Usually, when people mentioned "pillow mounts", they are not adjustable.

I prefer the K2RD ones, but Paul Ko stopped offering them for sale.
GC ones are okay, but they are not made for the FC3S.
There are a number of Japan units out there (Cusco, etc.) that are okay but are inferior due to no needle bearing for up / down loads - they only have a spherical bearing for this, and it will fail prematurely.


-Ted

edmcguirk

There are different kinds of "crash bolts" Any bolt that requires you to enlarge the hole will eventually cause a problem. Any bolt that leaves a gap around the shaft will also move. These bolts depend on bolt tension to hold your suspension in place. You can't possibly get enough clamping force on a bolt to hold it without slipping.

The bolts that I quoted earlier leave no gaps. They will not slip. They work just fine for many years of autocross and track driving.

(however my race car does not use them because camber plates are better - more adjustability and accuracy)

ed

RETed

Not true...those "cam bolts" link that was posted used a smaller diameter shaft on the hole on the shock body.
It will slip eventually.
Try and nail a curb hard enough, and I bet the "alignment" will slip.

Crash bolts or cam bolts - they are all cheap ways of dialing in camber (in the front) and should not be used if you got the money for a proper set of camber plates (up front).


-Ted

jon88se

Who is nailing curbs all the time? Now, for actual competition I agree with Ted that camber plates are the right way to go (that's why I've got Teins on my car, 3 years and no problems - keep them clean and lubed). With competition rubber and constant track pounding, I can see a possibility for slipping with crash bolts. BUT, for street driving where the cornering load/speed is relatively low, they should be fine. I've had a set of crash bolts up front on my Galant VR4 for about a year without problems (there is NO front adjustment from mitsu). Also, many car makers USE crash bolts as OEM pieces...my Galant has them out back for rear camber adjustment (in conjunction with the 4 wheel steering) and I know the GC8 Subaru 2.5 RS ('98-'01) has them up front as OEM. The black aftermarket pieces are generally lower quality hardware than the stronger bronze-ish colored ones as they are a softer metal and will round/strip more easily.

If your FC is a daily car and does NOT see the track, crash bolts should be fine IMHO. BUT, they should only be used to dial in a bit more/less camber and not as a band-aid to align a car with bent parts. My .02

RETed

Um, we regularly track our cars with R-compound DOT rubber all the time.


-Ted