xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

I am currently looking at the Autronic SMC, the Wolf 3d v4 plus, or the haltech e6k or e6x. This is be used in the rx7 for a while and will probally be used in our rally car at times. I have a few questions:
Can anyone tell me the warranties on the 4 EMS's I have looked around and some places have different time periods.
Does the Wolf or Haltech systems have anti-lag or taction control?
Is a 3d map that much better than a 2d?
etc., etc...

Evil Aviator

The Haltech EMS's have an anti-lag function, and the E11 has an aux rev limit function that acts as launch control.

In reference to what kind of map?

Yes, the vendors can tell you about the warranties.

Websites:
http://www.autronic.com/
http://www.haltech.com.au
http://www.wolfems.com.au

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

fuel or ignition maps, the wolf has a 2d but the autronic and haltech have 3d maps.

Evil Aviator

So what makes you think the Wolf3D has 2D maps?

Anyway, to answer the question, 3D fuel and ignition maps are better than 2D maps. FYI 3D means the maps have 3 axes; x = engine rpm, y = fuel injector or ignition setting, and z = engine load (usually defined as manifold pressure). A 2D map only has the x and y values, which is considered archaic by today's standards.

As for your dilemma about choosing an EMS, make sure you get one that is supported by one of your local tuners. An average person does not have the skills to properly tune an EMS.

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

I downloaded the wolf haltech and autronic engine software and the wolf only had numbers to input but the haltech and autronic had "3 dimensional" software.

Evil Aviator

Ah, that's just the software display. Ironically, Wolf had that first, then Haltech copied it, and Wolf dropped it. I hear that Wolf is going to bring it back in one of their next software updates. The only difference that it makes is that some people like to look at the 3D display to give them an overall view of the settings. The fuel and ignition maps themselves are 3D even though they are displayed in 2D format. Direct quote from Haltech: "The 2D maps are where most users will spend most of their time tuning their maps. Do not confuse the 2D view of a 3D map with a 2D map. Despite only seeing the map in 2 dimensions, you must remember to think of this view as a slice of a 3D map."

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

So it was basically a miscommunication So which one would be best for my applications do you think? I was going to go with a wolf, they arent too expensive and they seem to be able to do all that I need them too but they are hard to find used, unlike Haltechs. Autronics seems to be great all around and not too expensive for the features but are even more rare than the Wolf units, used units at least.

Which do you think would be best for swapping in and out of different cars? I guess if I save maps on a laptop they can be easily downloaded to the unit depending on which car the computer is in. I thought I read with a wolf you can get a second chip and just flip a switch or something and it reads the 2nd rom.

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

Is there some place to look at a side by side comparison of all the different ECUs?

Evil Aviator

Buy the one that has local support. Your chances of installing and tuning an EMS on your own is next to zero. No, the internet will not help you much, and neither will a wideband O2 sensor or any other form of magic fairy dust. You really need to ask your tuner about this subject, as you don't want to buy anything unless your tuner knows how to use it.

It's usually better to buy a new EMS if you can. Also, keep in mind that the older Wolf 3.0 computers do not have anywhere near the capability of the 4.0, and there is a big run on the older Haltech E6K's right now because of reported problems with the newer units. Autronic is not very popular in the US, so there is not much chance of finding one used.

All of the EMS's that you listed are fine. You just need to stay away from the engine-specific models like Microtech.

Wolf uses memory chips (similar to video game cartridges) that allow you to change maps with the hand controller. This is nice if you don't want to cart a laptop around with you when changing maps. However, most people have no reason to change maps often, and the other EMS's allow for map swapping with a laptop, so the Wolf advantage is not quite as large as it may appear. FYI a performance map can also act as an economy map, so that Fast & Furious stuff about switching to a special street race map for a quick drag race off the stop light is pretty much just movie BS. The only time you may want to change maps would be for emissions testing or for slightly changing parameters for various race tracks, in which case there really isn't much need for changing maps within a few seconds vs. a few minutes.

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

As far as tuning it to the 7, by myself, woud it be difficult to put a map that was stockish and just use it as a replacement ECU for the stock computer? Would there be real dangers to the engine? I wouldnt want to try to tune 350+hp on the computer.

Evil Aviator

Many people think that they can simply set up the new ECU to act exactly like the old ECU to just get the car running, and then tune for more power later. This is impossible in reality. There is not currently any aftermarket ECU that will mimic the stock ECU. A standalone ECU will gain some functions, lose other functions, and some functions will work in a different manner. The really hard parts to set up are the initial parameters and the transients. The fuel and ignition maps are actually the easy part, but the internet and slick advertising make people think that this is all that is involved in tuning an engine.

Yes

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

As far as breaking in the engine on a standalone, would someone need to do that for me or could they tune it initially and then retune after the break-in?

xfeastonarsex

iTrader: (5)

What about autronics auto-tune function?

enzo250

the auto-tune function works awesome BUT relying on that alone is not the right way to go.
you need to know how to setup and use a standalone before even attempting it yourself.
Otherwise have an experienced tuner do it for you.

Evil Aviator

^
The auto-tune function will allow your tuner to set up the mapping much faster, which will save you money because of the reduced dyno time and/or reduced labor.

Ottoman

I live in an area with no "tuners" and no dyno's either...

so basically i'm SOL if i wanna go stand alone ?

Evil Aviator

A dyno is not necessary, but a tuner is. Sometimes you need to tow your car to a tuner, or have a tuner visit your garage. The only other option is to educate yourself at a trade school.

Quadulus

What if you live in Fargo, ND and there is no such thing as a tuner nearby?

Evil Aviator

^ See my previous post above.

Bad2ndgen

Many tuners will come to you provided you pay for airfare and hotel, however I would reccomend finding a way to get your car to a steady state dyno facility that has a tuner that is familliar with your system. Tuning on the street is ok but will never be as good as tuning on a dyno.