racedriver

There seem to be a lot of people in my area using the Tec2 and 3. On paper it looks to be easier to set a base map than say a haltech. Why are there not more people on the forum using the tec? Anyone with experience please share them, Anyone had both a TEC and hALTECH?

RETed

Price.
Support.
Superior adaptability of the Haltech systems to the stock wiring and components.


-Ted

forcefed7

Racedriver,
I've had both, and have worked with a bunch of TEC1&2. I currently have a TEC3 on my car (single turbo FD) and I'm very happy with the unit. Both units work well. I've had great result with my TEC3 (570+ RWHP).
That's not to say I didn't have my Haltech working well too. I think that the TEC3 will catch on, and the TECH support is there. I still think that best unit is a system that you (the end user) knows how to use the best. Both Units can blow your engine up with the best of them, if you don't know what you're doing
Hope this helped.

RETed

Wow, nice numbers!&nbsp I've heard the TEC3 can do true split trailing now - is this true?&nbsp What are the ranges?&nbsp RPM and load dependent?


-Ted

forcefed7

Thanks Ted, The TEC3 can do true split trailing now, rpm dependent, 12 or 16 (can't remember) point that the user sets, rpm points and amount of split.

RETed

Thanx for the info!


-Ted

13BAce

So no more of that dual sensor stuff?

forcefed7

No more dual sensor setup, the TEC3 is a completely new unit, a huge improvement over the TEC2. If you wanna know more about it check their website or I can try and answer any questions you might have.

13BAce

I bought a TEC II last year, but I had SO many problems. The first time I didn't get the crank wheel. Then when I got that I found out that one of the magnetic sensors was bad. Then when I finally got it working ok it was firing my injectors with the motor turned off. It had a bad resistor, and Electromotive fixed it for nothing, but I got so frustrated that I sold it. I would have liked to use it. Will the TEC 3 made for a 3 rotor also run a 2 rotor?

forcefed7

Yeah sorry to hear about your luck with the TEC2. They have fixed the problems with the crank sensors, they are now 1/2" sensors. Yes you can get a 12 cylinder
TEC3 that will run a 2 or 3 rotor engine.

13BAce

Thanks for the info.

RX794

I'm saying it now like I've said it before, Electromotive stand alones are the BEST for the $, the ignition accuracy is not matched by anyone else other than high end Motec systems, and if you went that route you could probably buy another RX7 for the price of a Motec.

13BAce

Did you switch?

RX794

No I didn't(still using PFC), but I know and I've seen how good this ECU is(Tec2, Tec3), just giving it props, it's the only standalone I would ever use in my car(if I switch), that's how much I believe in it, and like it.

13BAce

I wish I had had better luck with my TEC II, but the TEC 3's new features look good. Finally being able to mount the ECU inside the car is a big plus.

RETed

I knew this was going to happen...

I'd like to hear you qualify your statement?

The TEC systems run 1&#176 resolution on adjustment.&nbsp Electromotive CLAIMS 1/4&#176 resolution.&nbsp Lesse...60 teeth divided into 360&#176 = 6&#176.&nbsp Therefore, Electromotive is claiming every rising edge/tooth max/falling edge/tooth min cycle can be broke down into a 24 finite segments?

So what prevents a Haltech from using the same 60-2 trigger wheel?&nbsp Nothing.&nbsp You do realize that Haltech can use a 60-2 trigger wheels set-up identical to the Electromotive systems, right?&nbsp Does that mean the Haltech picks up the same tyep fo accuracy?&nbsp Electromotive seem to like to imply their system does...

Haltech is still priced lower than an Electromotive.&nbsp Don't be giving me no special deal pricing here.&nbsp I'm talking about typical pricing available to anyone.&nbsp Last time I checked, a Haltech E6K is still priced about $1,500 (no Aussie imports) in the U.S.; the TEC-II is easily over that, and the TEC3 is priced at around $1,900 from Racer Wholesale.

Best price for the money?&nbsp I don't think so.&nbsp Now before you go arguing about the included (superior) coil systems with the Electromotive price, we are talking about RX-7's here, right?&nbsp You do know that the Haltech interfaces seemlessly into the stock FC/FD ignition systems (input and output), so unless you're stating with a gutted shell, you've already got your coils in the car.

This whole spiel sounds like I'm vigorously defending Haltech.&nbsp Yes and no.&nbsp I get a bit peeved when people mention "BEST" on ANYTHING.&nbsp The word "BEST" is has to qualify, and it really is relative to each and everyone one of us.&nbsp YOUR "BEST" is NOT the same as someone elses "BEST".



-Ted

13BAce

Would the ECU be performing calculations to estimate the engine position inbetween teeth?

Electro_Russ

13BAce,
We only allow 1 deg resolution in the software. Our system is capable of 0.12 accuracy. We only claim 1/4 degree due to latency of the microcontrollers. We have a patented system that breaks down the trigger wheel pulses into 3600 measurements per revolution. This system compensates for changes in speed of the trigger wheel. Allowing extremely accurate timing.
We don't bash our competition. Every system on the market has its advantages. One of our advantages is that our system provides more accurate timing. We have tested nearly every system on the market in this category. After doing so, we can make the claim that our system is more accurate. We will guarantee that !!!
As for the trigger wheel type. I don't know why a haltech isn't as accurate with the same wheel. Does this accuracy help?? Maybe...Maybe not... I can only comment on what our system is capable of. The accuracy of the ignition shouldn't be the only determining factory in choosing an engine management system.

13BAce

Thanks for the reply. I figured it was something like that.

RETed

I guess someone squealed.


-Ted

RX794

Guess now you guys know that I wasn't BSing when I said that it's the ONLY true standalone I'd EVER put in my car, and why. Ignition accuracy (especially in a rotary) is what makes the big difference in engine response and HP, and also I don't really like it when I tell some ECU's not to fire the trailing before the leading, and it happens anyway, that's why I like Electromotive, it does what YOU say, NOT what IT feels like doing.

13BAce

Yeah, I remember you telling us about how your timing was fluctuating alot with the E6K.

RETed

The only problem is...
I haven't seen it on a Haltech E6K yet.
I'd tend to blame either the tuning and/or the install for extreme problems like that.
I haven't seen the proof otherwise.

The factory OEM Mazda ignition maps fire trailing ignition split anywhere from about 40&#176 advance to zero.&nbsp The TECII can't do this, and I think the TEC3 can't either.&nbsp You want to run slight split so the trailings won't fire before the leadings, then fine, you're entitled to your method.&nbsp To totally ignore what Mazda has done with the stock ignition is stupid.&nbsp Eletromotive has all kinds of wrong statements all over their literature about what a rotary engine ignition is supposed to be like.&nbsp Maybe the Russ can elaborate on this?

All these threads up being a big war.&nbsp EMS opinions are a passionate subject for most people because they involve big money and time (for most people), and people don't like to be told "their" choice is "bad".&nbsp When I hear opinions that so-and-so brand is BEST, I know they got their heads up their asses and cannot produce an objective opinion on the subject matter.&nbsp When I hear stupid comments like "I've seen a TECII swapped on a previous Haltech rotary and it produced 25 more hp", I find that total bullshit.

Care to discuss?&nbsp I'm game.


-Ted

Electro_Russ

I agree with you... I hope this doesn't turn ugly like most other OPINION based topics.

As for timing split... I've done a LOT of testing on a 13B single turbo with timing split. All i was able to alter was emissions during cruising. It didn't change the power one bit. The TEC2 had to use a fixed split. The TEC3 is adjustable based on RPM. Download the software from our website and check it out. www.emi.cc

Russ
Electromotive Inc.

RX794

All we're discussing is opinions here, relax. Whatever works for you, works for you, let's just leave it at that. All I was stating was my opinion on the subject, and what I've seen, if you want to take up Electro_Russ' challenge about Electromotive's ignition accuracy vs. what you're using, then take that up with him, until then you can believe what you want, and say what you want, that's your opinion and you're entitiled to it, just like everyone else is to theirs.