Kilo Racing 3 Rotor FD Conversion
Just want to say congrats on sticking with the project where 99% of people would have given up. Enjoy the car!
With respect to tires...
Are your PS2's really old or something? They should be able to handle that much power. Guys in the One Lap had 600-700hp cars on PS2's and they were not spinning them all over the place.
Also, what's the weather like down there right now? Those tires will not like sub 40 degree temps *at all*. Might as well be made of stone below that temp. Even if it's 50-60 presently as the outside temp (and road surface temp) comes up they will definitely gain grip. Same goes for driving, if you get out and get them warmed up on some cloverleafs they will definitely come up in temp and consequently, grip.
Other tires to consider: Yokohama Advan Neova AD07s if you can get the correct size for the rear. They are as close to as r-comp as you will get in the dry out of a street tire. They also will want some heat to get grippy, and they are not the best ijn the wet. R888s or Nitto NT-01s would be your next option up, but they are R-Comps so they need considerable heat to start to get adhesive grip, and they will wear alot more and not be quite as good in the rain (especially when you start to wear them down into the good dry rubber.)
Interesting thing to note: getting wider rear tires does not help with longitudinal grip, because they stretch the contact patch out wider. I have a link somewhere I migh be able to dig up that describes this principle in physics terms if someone is interested. What you want for longitudinal grip (if you mainly want to be able to not spin the tires while going straight) then a narrower longer contact patch is desired. So you get narrower tires and run them lower pressure.
In either case rubber compound is still very important, and getting proper tire pressure and temp are going to help you out alot as well.
With respect to tires...
Are your PS2's really old or something? They should be able to handle that much power. Guys in the One Lap had 600-700hp cars on PS2's and they were not spinning them all over the place.
Also, what's the weather like down there right now? Those tires will not like sub 40 degree temps *at all*. Might as well be made of stone below that temp. Even if it's 50-60 presently as the outside temp (and road surface temp) comes up they will definitely gain grip. Same goes for driving, if you get out and get them warmed up on some cloverleafs they will definitely come up in temp and consequently, grip.
Other tires to consider: Yokohama Advan Neova AD07s if you can get the correct size for the rear. They are as close to as r-comp as you will get in the dry out of a street tire. They also will want some heat to get grippy, and they are not the best ijn the wet. R888s or Nitto NT-01s would be your next option up, but they are R-Comps so they need considerable heat to start to get adhesive grip, and they will wear alot more and not be quite as good in the rain (especially when you start to wear them down into the good dry rubber.)
Interesting thing to note: getting wider rear tires does not help with longitudinal grip, because they stretch the contact patch out wider. I have a link somewhere I migh be able to dig up that describes this principle in physics terms if someone is interested. What you want for longitudinal grip (if you mainly want to be able to not spin the tires while going straight) then a narrower longer contact patch is desired. So you get narrower tires and run them lower pressure.
In either case rubber compound is still very important, and getting proper tire pressure and temp are going to help you out alot as well.
The 20B is definitely different because of the extra torque that is available so the car really launches with ease. From my "spirited drives" over the past two days, I really can't control the car if I use more than 40% throttle. The wheels break loose in all the gears I've tried (1-4). Haven't done this in 5th gear as I am a little afraid of romping on the car at that speed.
It is a lot of fun though. Left my condo building the other day, turned left and hit the throttle a bit. Did some very nice drifting action
Found a good back road (off of 9A for those of you in Jax) and went through gears 1-4 and found that anything over 40% the wheels would start to break loose. I'm also running 12 inch rear tires so that is pretty impressive. If you slowly roll into the throttle you can use the power without spinning the wheels but it is not as fun
This is at 525 WHP and 14 PSI at 6,800 RPMs. I would think if we ran the dyno all the way up to redline, this would equate to 550-560 WHP but maybe someone can look at the dyno I posted and extrapolate the info. It's a straight line up so it shouldn't be too difficult.
I will someday turn up the boost a bit but only to dyno the car so I can have bragging rights. After a few driving lessons maybe I can use the power but not now.
It is a lot of fun though. Left my condo building the other day, turned left and hit the throttle a bit. Did some very nice drifting action
Found a good back road (off of 9A for those of you in Jax) and went through gears 1-4 and found that anything over 40% the wheels would start to break loose. I'm also running 12 inch rear tires so that is pretty impressive. If you slowly roll into the throttle you can use the power without spinning the wheels but it is not as fun
This is at 525 WHP and 14 PSI at 6,800 RPMs. I would think if we ran the dyno all the way up to redline, this would equate to 550-560 WHP but maybe someone can look at the dyno I posted and extrapolate the info. It's a straight line up so it shouldn't be too difficult.
I will someday turn up the boost a bit but only to dyno the car so I can have bragging rights. After a few driving lessons maybe I can use the power but not now.
If using the OEM wheel sensors, we can build traction control.
my AEM and Pi ECU are setup to use the boost controller solenoid(s) to lower / decrease wheel spin. This is something C and I were *very* interested in wiring up.
Sadly the SQ6 is still pending but the AEM was almost a 45min deal to setup. It sucks with TC on to be honest, makes me too comfy/confident in my poor ability.
my AEM and Pi ECU are setup to use the boost controller solenoid(s) to lower / decrease wheel spin. This is something C and I were *very* interested in wiring up.
Sadly the SQ6 is still pending but the AEM was almost a 45min deal to setup. It sucks with TC on to be honest, makes me too comfy/confident in my poor ability.
Just want to say congrats on sticking with the project where 99% of people would have given up. Enjoy the car!
With respect to tires...
Are your PS2's really old or something? They should be able to handle that much power. Guys in the One Lap had 600-700hp cars on PS2's and they were not spinning them all over the place.
Also, what's the weather like down there right now? Those tires will not like sub 40 degree temps *at all*. Might as well be made of stone below that temp. Even if it's 50-60 presently as the outside temp (and road surface temp) comes up they will definitely gain grip. Same goes for driving, if you get out and get them warmed up on some cloverleafs they will definitely come up in temp and consequently, grip.
With respect to tires...
Are your PS2's really old or something? They should be able to handle that much power. Guys in the One Lap had 600-700hp cars on PS2's and they were not spinning them all over the place.
Also, what's the weather like down there right now? Those tires will not like sub 40 degree temps *at all*. Might as well be made of stone below that temp. Even if it's 50-60 presently as the outside temp (and road surface temp) comes up they will definitely gain grip. Same goes for driving, if you get out and get them warmed up on some cloverleafs they will definitely come up in temp and consequently, grip.
As for the age of the tires, you may be on to something. They were put on the car about 4 years ago and have not been used much as the car has been undergoing the conversion so maybe they've hardened up a bit.
I read recently about the testing of the new Yokohama's and the magazine (can't remember which) said they were the best tires they have ever tested for grip and performance. Called them game changers.
[QUOTE=David Hayes;9034523]Well, it is Florida so it is getting pretty warm. It's in the 80s now. It was a bit cooler when I went out for the spirited drive but it was probably 65 or so which I think would be plenty warm. I didn't warm up the tires as in a burn out or anything, just romped on it.
As for the age of the tires, you may be on to something. They were put on the car about 4 years ago and have not been used much as the car has been undergoing the conversion so maybe they've hardened up a bit.
QUOTE] If those tire have been on your car for 4yrs then the chances are good that they probably are older then that . Tires are made and then thrown on a shelf until someone purchases them. who knows how long they sat until you picked them up. Some tires, not sure if all, have a manufacture date on them somewhere. once the rubber gets older from the date they were produced they get dry and start to get harder. The Michelin PS2's are great tires for your car, I wouldn't think you would need much more then that, but I could be wrong.
As for the age of the tires, you may be on to something. They were put on the car about 4 years ago and have not been used much as the car has been undergoing the conversion so maybe they've hardened up a bit.
QUOTE] If those tire have been on your car for 4yrs then the chances are good that they probably are older then that . Tires are made and then thrown on a shelf until someone purchases them. who knows how long they sat until you picked them up. Some tires, not sure if all, have a manufacture date on them somewhere. once the rubber gets older from the date they were produced they get dry and start to get harder. The Michelin PS2's are great tires for your car, I wouldn't think you would need much more then that, but I could be wrong.
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 30,793
Likes: 646
From: FL-->NJ/NYC again!
The kaaz will only help if David decides to start seriously drag racing his car, as far as I know.
I think an S4 TII diff would be perfect for his car if/when the torsen dies on him.
I think an S4 TII diff would be perfect for his car if/when the torsen dies on him.
yup...335 PS2s on my wheels forsale
just have to find someone to buy them now lol
on a side note, my car is running and ready for me to pick up. dyno next thursday wheeeeeeeeee
just have to find someone to buy them now lol
on a side note, my car is running and ready for me to pick up. dyno next thursday wheeeeeeeeee
A Kaaz LSD eliminates this by locking the wheels together when power is put down. It will give the wheel in the corner better traction under acceleration, more stable acceleration and power to all the driven wheels in a corner. This will allow the driver an opportunity for a better exit speed. I would think that the Kaaz lsd would provide a stable platform with better ability to get power to the road, which really means a faster FD! Now I could be wrong, not really knowing how he drives but it would seem to be a good fit for Davids fd....... not that you don't know the above Rich, I did not know the difference between the stock torsen and the Kaaz. wouldn't the Kaaz be better? how do they compare?
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,773
Likes: 0
From: Boulder, CO
I had the kaaz 1.5 way diff on one of my drift 240's, the only time i noticed it to clunk was when making 90 degree turns at low speeds (under 10mph) - any other time and it never clunked -- the power transfer was very even to both wheels
I'll be fine guys. My spirited driving is in both straight and corners. Too much fun not to punch it a little under both scenarios.
A forum member (and BMW and Porsche driving instructor) has offered to teach me to drive and I plan on taking him up on this.
A forum member (and BMW and Porsche driving instructor) has offered to teach me to drive and I plan on taking him up on this.
Well, it is Florida so it is getting pretty warm. It's in the 80s now. It was a bit cooler when I went out for the spirited drive but it was probably 65 or so which I think would be plenty warm. I didn't warm up the tires as in a burn out or anything, just romped on it.
As for the age of the tires, you may be on to something. They were put on the car about 4 years ago and have not been used much as the car has been undergoing the conversion so maybe they've hardened up a bit.
I read recently about the testing of the new Yokohama's and the magazine (can't remember which) said they were the best tires they have ever tested for grip and performance. Called them game changers.
As for the age of the tires, you may be on to something. They were put on the car about 4 years ago and have not been used much as the car has been undergoing the conversion so maybe they've hardened up a bit.
I read recently about the testing of the new Yokohama's and the magazine (can't remember which) said they were the best tires they have ever tested for grip and performance. Called them game changers.
That is probably it. My grip on Kumho MX tires was off after 3 or so years of usage. Rubber degrades over time. Grassroots Motorsports ran an article about that sometime last year.
I've been reading some good press about those Yokohamas as well. A lot of the BMW guys love them on track. A bit pricey but very good.
I'm sure you'll get good info from Neil but look into BMW CCA events in your area for more learning experiences. They generally have great educational content and I've found it often helps to have input from more than one person.
After 4 years and 8 months, I am proud to say that I am unsubscribing from this thread!
Congrats David, hope you enjoy your new toy in the best of health, be sure and keep us updated!
Best!
Charlie
Congrats David, hope you enjoy your new toy in the best of health, be sure and keep us updated!
Best!
Charlie
Quicky Update
Yes, the conversion is real and the car drives great! No more vids yet but I will try my best for you soon.
I'm busy this afternoon replacing all of the broken bits and pieces on the interior of the car. It is surprising how brittle the plastics get and the number of things that break. Not too bad in my case but I am pretty ****. FYI - I did get 1 of 3 center speaker grilles left in the US so if you need one of these, call Ray Crowe pronto.
I'm also going to work on the PLX gauges as they are all not displaying. My oil/water temps are not displaying at all and my boost gauge displays but does not register. As I recall, all the gauges daisy chain together so I am going to ensure they're hooked up right and then go from there. As they plug into the PC maybe I can reboot them? Any PLX experts out there?
My one other problem is a very annoying and squeaky power steering belt. Jesus thought he had fixed this by replacing the belt but it has now come back. At idle, no squeak, but once RPMS increase, squeak. I have adjusted the tensioner and the squeak disappeared when I loosened it a bit, but it's now back. The power steering pulley is new as is the other pulley so I don't think it's one of these. Maybe the condenser pulley is misaligned?
Regardless, it's fun to drive!
I'm busy this afternoon replacing all of the broken bits and pieces on the interior of the car. It is surprising how brittle the plastics get and the number of things that break. Not too bad in my case but I am pretty ****. FYI - I did get 1 of 3 center speaker grilles left in the US so if you need one of these, call Ray Crowe pronto.
I'm also going to work on the PLX gauges as they are all not displaying. My oil/water temps are not displaying at all and my boost gauge displays but does not register. As I recall, all the gauges daisy chain together so I am going to ensure they're hooked up right and then go from there. As they plug into the PC maybe I can reboot them? Any PLX experts out there?
My one other problem is a very annoying and squeaky power steering belt. Jesus thought he had fixed this by replacing the belt but it has now come back. At idle, no squeak, but once RPMS increase, squeak. I have adjusted the tensioner and the squeak disappeared when I loosened it a bit, but it's now back. The power steering pulley is new as is the other pulley so I don't think it's one of these. Maybe the condenser pulley is misaligned?
Regardless, it's fun to drive!






