SpAm@FC

iTrader: (4)

The only reason I'm happy about my completly stock fd (when i bought it) is, that no elcheapo kid was messing around with the car...

The car came directly from japan and has been driven one year in europe. Only mod: a catback

Especially in Europe the guys go the cheap route.. add a 3" catback, 3" downpipe, 3" cat delete, some blingbling air intake and a cheap autobahn88 IC... driving in cold weather and *boom*

My FD has 60.000km on the clock (~58.000km driven in japan)... it's a nice start to mod the car... no wires hacked, no bondo on the chassis, no bent frame... I've read a very true sentence on a car forum...

"Never buy another ones project -> it's fucked up... but never build up a car from scratch, it will cost you an arm and a leg"
There is much truth in this sentence I prefer the expensive way -> at least I know what I've got in my garage and I'm the idiot if it blows up because of a poorly executed mod

getgone

iTrader: (2)

I have stuck to the stock setup (engine and body) because (1) the car is reliable (with the basic reliability mods), (2) the car is quick enough for the street, and (3) the stock body lines are classic and mature. I do not generally condone street racing (especially the high-speed, bonzai runs at 100+ mph), but I have launched off the occassional traffic light and have had only a handful of cars actually out duel this thing. That is in 20 years of ownership. Most of the 350+ hp club have trouble getting traction and lose any advantage with wheel spin. In essentially stock mode, I have only spun hard once on a set of nearly worn out performance tires. The rest is technique and timing. I also have sense enough to know that a $30,000 car is not going to take down a Lambo, or a Porsche Turbo, or an Acer Viper. But a few M3s and Vettes have had to go home with wounded feelings. As for the rest, I am a grown up. I am not about to show up at the office or a client's home in a neon treatment straight out of F&F, blatting and jiggling to the ole parking space. But everybody still envies the car as is and I get enough complements for my satisfaction. Even had some kid want to buy it 3 months ago. As is, the car also has the nimbleness and handling to outclass most of even the high-end sports cars. I do not track the car and never will, but put a set of race slicks on this thing and you will be in pretty good company. And I speak with experience as I do track a ramped up second gen. (Getting good enough I think to pour a p-port in it and do some real racing.)

Montego

iTrader: (1)

And that's fine but this is getting a little stale. I realize that your car is stock so you have a personal issue with me saying a stock car is slow. At this point we can agree to disagree. Just like you I once thought my stock FD was fast so I don't take offense.

You also have to take into consideration the reputation that an FD has. Many people (who aren't Rx-7 owners) seem to believe that the car is somekind of rocketship with brutal acceleration where nobody can rival the almighty FD. Well in fact in stock form it isn't. It is extremely quick in the lower gears but not so much after that. As I said the car was fast in 1992 and in a world of stock cars. But in 2013 that really isn't the case. Shoot a new mazda 3 has more ponies doesn't it?

well that's easy as I said it in every post so far: Get up to 75 MPH floor it. How is that accelaration for you? Just a brutal as when you were going 20 MPH? yeah no...

A healthy 93-95 RX-7 dynoes at around 225 RWHP (Rear Wheel Horse Power not Flywheel Horse Power)

SpooledFD3S

iTrader: (10)

it's quick, but not fast by today's standards.

My fd just has reliability mods and exhaust with a high flowcat and I'm only going to do a few more things like a r1/r2 oil cooler. I've never been a hp fiend, but more of a balance and response kind of guy which is why I'm keeping the stock twins.

XLR8

iTrader: (52)

"Fast" is a very relative term.

ramo

iTrader: (30)

momma says i cant go fast cause its dangerous

Vader

I'm one of the people who got the mod bug early. That being said, if I had it to do all over again, I would have done basic bolt ons and the reliability stuff and left it alone. After a certain point, the more power I made, the less fun it was to drive. That car was the most amazing/rewarding car to drive at the 300-320rwhp mark. Sequential twins, rad, IC, exhaust, cold air intake etc..Just the best. Instant power, response, balance, and handling. The way the car was meant to be.

RCCAZ 1

iTrader: (10)

There are FASTER cars in a straight line, but very few feel as "connected" with the driver as the FD. Supras are faster in a straight line, but the FD eats it up on a road course in most cases. Predictability and feel through the driving rack are things that Mazda takes pride in, and the FD was their pinnacle. Its the one thing that really captured my attention the first time I drove the car. It "felt" like no other car I had ever driven.

I switched a few years back from stock twins to a single [GT35 derivative (TD61)] with low and high boost tunes. Low is 375 RWHP at 13 psi, and high boost is 439 at 16.5 psi. When driving the back road twisties I use the low boost setting and (for me) the car still has the predictability of the stock twins. Very easy to throttle manage through curves and apply power coming out of the corners without the car getting too crazy. High boost requires a little more finesse, hence the reason I usually leave it set lower. From a reliability perspective, I love the single setup. So much cooler in my engine bay. Not needing to stare at my PFC water temp readings nearly as much as in the past. Vmount IC was a huge improvement as well. Mazda would be wise to consider such an IC/rad arrangement on future offerings. It truly gives the car some operating margin on intake and coolant temps in the summertime.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

The ultimate sword if you can keep it in its sheath on the street and if you don't break it at the track. I can't do either so I opt for the twins at 300 on the street and a lower powered single for track duty

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Yes as the solar system/planetary teacher just pointed out power and speed are relative and you can go as fast as your bank account and *****/talent allow.

More power will absolutely give you lower lap times but you reach a point (to me that's a max of 400 and 350 much safer) where the car will need too much attention/cost to justify both the lap time and your own time keeping it going. For many people they reached that point long ago and own a Z06 etc.... hehe

A stock powered track FD needs:
Sways
springs 500
255 sticky rubber
etc...
And will compete with mostly stock c5s (not z06s they are FAST)

At the 350 power level alone you will need:
BBK
Aero
275 minimum sticky race tires and the car still throttle steers most every corner
springs 750 plus
upgraded diff (A stock diff won't last me more than a year or two before the input shaft is loose)
Fat front sway
Cooling of all varieties including transmission
etc.....
And it will compete with most stock car made including GTRs GT3s Z06s Vipers etc....

At anything above 400 you will need: (we are talking 6 to 1 power to weight and 5 to 1 at 500hp plus)
BIG tires like 335 out back and 315 up front
BIG aero
springs 1000 plus
BIG sway bars
Massive brakes (think 14 inch front 13 inch rear)
upgraded trans and diff
LSX
etc.....

And will compete with most anything you see at the track or as fast or faster than a new 997 cup car.

This would be the type of car I'd like to take to the ultimate track car challenge to put up a good # for the FD. It would not win but it would get the trophy for the fastest 20 year old car



I agree this is a great thread and the stock or lightly modded FD deserves serious props

The stock FD has very good power/speed between 70 and 90 which is where you really need it at the track. I think the top speed is 165 which is incredible for a 255 hp car. I'll try to dig up an old track video where I'm driving a stock FD with just a cat back running a 2.16 (sm lap record at VIR is a 2.18 so yes miatas are no joke) on the VIR full course (old cheap victo racers on the car). In the vid I'm giving a modded c5 hell or possible a z06 I can't remember it was like 6 or 7 years ago.

Montego

iTrader: (1)

I am assuming a DP as well. Even if the answer is no on the DP: Sorry Fritz but that isn't stock.

As I said earlier on this thread, the stock components choke up the power hence the 10-8-10-8 boost pattern of a stock setup. In other threads I have also stated that IMO if I could do it over again I would just do all bolt ons and stay at 10 psi as at that point the car is fast enough and very reliable.

My point being is that these cars are begging to be uncorked.

wstrohm

Factory says 158.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Precat still in place, no boost controller, stock ecu and boost was not spiking just typical 10 down to 8 or 9 psi on the top end.


Thanks for the exact #

t-von

iTrader: (8)

For me when it comes to stock, nothing was better than that modified seq twin turbo I drove a few years back. It was only putting down about 300whp. When the factory twins are working to perfection, nothing comes close to the response an joy of just driving around town. The bottom end torque the twins make was fantastic. Hell my na 20b couldn't match the bottom end of that car. Plus his exhaust didn't drone. If I were to do a 2nd fd, I would start off with another unmolested car, keep the twins and keep it simple.

Jason94R2

iTrader: (3)

I love the sequential twins. Only plan to go to BNR's for some more oomph with less effort from the stockers. The fact that 5th gear is snappy at 55-60mph at like 2k-ish rpms is enough for me to never leave these since 99.5% of the use of my FD is real world street driving.

I'm also coming from a powerhouse VR4 so i really cant stomach not having some low end grunt. I think a mild port with BNR's properly sorted will make for a truly epic driving car w/o pushing the setup too hard at all.

Jason

djseven

iTrader: (56)

An FD with just a down pipe and reliability mods on a stock clutch is one of the most pleasurable sports cars to drive. Turn the steering wheel just a little and hit the throttle and tires will break free being extremely predictable. Car is also as quiet as a Camry and still has enough power to outrun any modern day sports car under $50k. Most haven't driven a stock one in so long they have forgotten how capable and smooth the cars are, plus they are probably trying to justify all they spent on mods over the years as well.

Gomez

Some pay more to buy an FD with a bunch of very nice mods.

I went out of my way to pay a premium for an FD that had not been stuffed with at all.

When FD owners get under the hood, they invariably **** it up.

Montego

iTrader: (1)

Seems like this was directed at me so I'll chime in. Nope djseven I actually drove a perfectly working stock Rx-7 for 5 years and 54,000 miles before even adding one single aftermarket modification (other than a boost gauge that I added on the 4th year). So no I never forgot how capable the stock setup is as I probably have more seat time on one than 85% of the people on the forum. Given that my car still scares the crap out of me whenever I WOT I say that justifies the money spent but as I have already said, the stock FD just needs to be uncorked with simple boltons.

Of course when I say stock I mean stock. As it came from the factory in other words.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

Check out any classic car auction or even that show Chasing Classic Cars. Which cars sell the quickest and for the most money? The ones with the most horsepower or the ones that still have a window sticker and perfect stock interiors?

If every FD had reliability mods, then a stock AST would be worth thousands to people like Wayne Carini.

Gilgamesh

in my case:

i have a formula mazda for the turns, also a ITA miata for club racing.
I have a locost to autox
I have a rx3 to hill climb

what i dont have is a sexy FD to drive daily that makes great power with enough lag to be able to make a choice about getting in boost or not.

If i were to do it again, i would do it the same.

Small single turbo FDs have made a run at winning SM at the SCCA nationals autox. I knew once i pulled my twins they would never see my motor ever again

Tem120

iTrader: (5)

I'm going to have to agree .. When I first got my FD boosting 7 PSI ( no restrictor pills ) I thought my car was TO FAST I didnt know what I'd do with it Iwas scared of pressing the accelerator pedal ....

Considering I came from a Miata ..... well we all know about that 116whp monster.

but after a while ... the itch was there.. I got used to it . and started working on fixing that 7 psi Issue ... and eventually i was running 14 psi , and thought my car was slow .

So yeah us humans have the ability to adapt which makes us call what we once thought was stupid fast .. slow...... as we try to relive those first days when the car scared you to push the right pedal down.

adamrs80

iTrader: (7)

This is not intended to sound mean but I think the original question is flawed. It implies that some people would not find a bone stock RX-7 desirable. I think even the OP would like to start with a stock FD. What car enthusiast does not like seeing a stock vehicle just as it came from the factory? I am talking about a bone stock, well kept, well maintained, RX-7. What I mean is that realistically while we can all agree that a properly "reliability-modded" or properly "power-modded" RX-7 is great to find, who would not rather find a properly maintained but completely stock vehicle that has not been messed with at all? I think if we are all being completely honest with ourselves we would rather be the ones doing the modifications, reliability, power, whatever on a clean slate. The piece of mind that comes from not having to figure out what was done by prior owner and being able to personally check all the important items off the list....cooling, fuel filter, rats nest, pre-cat. I am fortunate to have one of those RX-7s. I got mine with 38k miles, same owner since 95, very detailed records, receipts, only had a fan-switch mod. I learned everything along the way and I did not have to reverse anything that was done because nothing had been done. I know what I have done and it's as close to being the original owner as I'm ever going to get. Who wouldn't prefer that?

SA3R

There was some anecdote I used to remember (only bits of it now) where in the 1800's, they had invented the first steam powered "car".
The first person to sit in it and drive it was one of those high-society, noble Count-of-Monte-Cristo types that would have been typical back then.

I think they got it up to like 35mph, and when the guy shut it off, he was white as a ghost, and remarked that he "never wanted to go that fast in his life, ever again, and see no reason why any sane human being would ever need to travel that fast." It genuinely scared the nuggets out of him.

I guess thats the thing with a stock FD. You transition out of something like a Camry or a Subaru or any BMW, and the first few times you drive the stock FD, you're going "Oh wow, this feels snappy... Holy crap, it feels quick." Compared to what you were used to, yeah.

Then you get used to it, and it becomes a normal thing. Thats the dangerous area, because it wont be long before you want a bit more and a bit more.. And slowly you lose the reliability you had.

My fiancee had only ever been driven around in 1.4L Hyundais of 1991 vintage before I met her. Those sorts of cars were enough to scare her, believe it or not. Got in the stock RX-7, and the first time I nailed it hard from a rolling start, she nearly climbed up the door trim in fright, which I wasnt expecting, because I was used to how the car feels. She wasnt.
Then, the first time we drove through a windy coastal road (5 minutes late for a doctors appointment, barely any other traffic on the road) I was winding it to 7000rpm in 1st, 2nd and 3rd in and out of some nice corners. She freaked out the same again. Car still with stock engine.

Its all relative I guess.

Jason94R2

iTrader: (3)

2-3 days in my F250 and the FD feels like it moves with a purpose again. But still want lower 300's out of it for this summer.

Jason

Taz

iTrader: (1)

It's funny to read this thread and see what some recent rotary believers have to say about the FD. I've had my 93 red R1 for 20 years, and today it is a 500 hp race car. Brings a smile every time I strap on the 5 point harness, but do I miss my street car. I longed for those joy rides with friends. So last November, I went 3,000 miles away to California, and bought a 9,000 mile bone stock R2 for a stupid amount of money. Red, of course. But memories can be deceiving. Once home, and after driving the car around, the sexy thought of keeping the R2 stock lasted all of 2 seconds. What? Keeping it stock for the next owner? … said my significant other. So a quick change of some new cabinets for the kitchen and I was open for business. Out went the 16" miata rims for some 18" G25's with PSS Michelins, a PFC for the stock ECU, 99 spec turbos, M2 IC, Ohlins, RB exhaust, HKS RS Intake, N-Flow rad and so on….There is some uniqueness to the FD's in general, modifying it makes it more so.
It'd be great to see people's age next to their sig just to better gauge their responses.

JIC
20 rotary years old.