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Just noticing that I have uneven front ride height. Rear is roughly the same. I got new wheels/tires on the car and it is now more apparent than with the stockers. After driving around/settling there is about a 3/4" difference ground to fender between front left and front right. Photos only show 1/2" because I had just jacked the car and settled it by rolling back & forth.
Took these measurements:
Driver side fender: 25-3/8"
Driver side pinch rail: 5-1/2"
Pass side fender: 25-7/8"
Pass side pinch rail: 6"
So, to me that shows the difference is in the suspension rather than the body.
I have eibach pro-kit springs on original touring shocks/mounts/bushings. The car drives and handles great. I was expecting the driver mount to be damaged or collapsed, but it appears intact and similar to passenger both compressed and free. Any suggestions of what else to do or to check? I am leaning towards new upper shock mounts, maybe even coupled with a set of tein coilovers.
Very common problem, the rubber hat/bushing at the top of the spring has sagged over time. Driver's side sags due to the weight of the driver in the car.
New spring hats will fix the problem. I remember them being not too bad from Mazda ($80 each?).
If you have aftermarket springs you don't even need a spring compressor to do the job.
BTW, there's a better name for that part but it's too early and it's not coming to mind .
I don't think FD's sit quite level up front. Every FD I've owned has sat slightly higher on the drivers side (US passengers side).
I recently fitted Ohlins that were all set up to the same specs prior to fitment and got similar results. Haven't decided whether to just leave it or to adjust the front right coilover a bit to even it out.
Very common problem, the rubber hat/bushing at the top of the spring has sagged over time. Driver's side sags due to the weight of the driver in the car.
New spring hats will fix the problem. I remember them being not too bad from Mazda ($80 each?).
If you have aftermarket springs you don't even need a spring compressor to do the job.
BTW, there's a better name for that part but it's too early and it's not coming to mind .
Dale
Thanks for confirming my diagnosis on this. I found a number of threads, but wanted to be sure.
Originally Posted by Ceylon
I don't think FD's sit quite level up front. Every FD I've owned has sat slightly higher on the drivers side (US passengers side).
I recently fitted Ohlins that were all set up to the same specs prior to fitment and got similar results. Haven't decided whether to just leave it or to adjust the front right coilover a bit to even it out.
I'll have to see what I come up with when I get around to addressing the issue. I'm a little skeptical that the rubber top mount being smushed could make up the entire difference I am seeing. 3/4" is a lot. Maybe the bottom bushing at the LCA is crushed as well.
Originally Posted by amp
dump the current setup... go CO adjust and call it a day...
I was thinking that... any suggestions? I recall people liking the Teins with stock upper mounts for a street/track duty car for better comfort.
I don't think FD's sit quite level up front. Every FD I've owned has sat slightly higher on the drivers side (US passengers side).
I recently fitted Ohlins that were all set up to the same specs prior to fitment and got similar results. Haven't decided whether to just leave it or to adjust the front right coilover a bit to even it out.
^^
This
Yeah, I corner balanced my FD on Ohlins and it ended up still being ~1/2" lower on the Left hand side front.
If you even out the wheel arch heights visually with coilovers you are probably screwing up your handling.
I've worked on a few cars that have had the driver's side sitting too low. Every one I've put the new top bushings in and good to go. When you pull them off the car and compare to new ones it's a substantial difference, the rubber is crushed down a great deal.
I wouldn't chase your tail on anything else, get that top mount replaced (do both fronts!) and see how you are. I guarantee you that if it's not perfect it will be MUCH better.
I don't know what 28-380 is. But I would recommend getting 28-012A also. That lower spring insulator was badly deteriorated on my car and I replaced them when I got new struts. They are around 1/4" thick.
I don't know what 28-380 is. But I would recommend getting 28-012A also. That lower spring insulator was badly deteriorated on my car and I replaced them when I got new struts. They are around 1/4" thick.
Vince
28-380 is the top-side isolator bushing for the strut. It should not significantly affect ride height.
Question about our shocks... is there any way to tell if they're bad off the car? I have my DS shock off and when compressing it the resistance is high and constant, but I hear some sound as the oil goes thru the valving. Makes me wonder if it's bubbles I'm hearing. Also, if I turn the shock over I can hear oil moving back and forth in there... shouldn't there be no gas in with the oil? No external leaks, but I'm worried the gas is now in the oil cavity.
These shocks are original 150k milers, but I actually like the ride and handling of the car as-is.
They have 150,000 miles on them- obviously they are shot.
Yes, what you are describing is a blown shock.
If you like the feel of blown shocks I suggest going with Koni Yellows for the FD. They have very soft damping and are adjustable so you can turn them down more.
Ok, maybe we should define shot. These don't have any external oil leaks so to me the only way they would be bad is if the internal gas mixed with the oil. That would happen in a monotube shock.
I guess my question should have been more along the lines of:
1. Are the stock shocks monotube where the oil should be separated from the gas or
2. Are they twin tube where the gas and oil are together in the outer tube. That would explain how you would hear the oil slosh back and forth like I did.
I have a hard time believing they are blown based solely on mileage for a few reasons:
-If there is enough oil and valving still in the shock they should still damp movement as intended. These don't have leaks and haven't been damaged.
-Howard Coleman posted up his shock dyno results in a handling thread and stated there was little difference between new and shocks around my mileage
I guess I have more faith in old shocks than some people. Honest question - how can our shocks fail without external leaks?
Shock performance starts degrading from the moment the shock is put on the car.
The force of squeezing the oil through the valve orifices creates heat which breaks down the oil just like oil in your engine.
This is why high end shocks use synthetic oils and why racers rebuild their shocks all the time to get them back to the valving they built them to have.
A twin tube shock like the stock shocks have the has mixed into the oil which can lose pressure over time through the seals without leaking and cause the oil to cavitate in use and affect the damping as well.
Your stock springs are shot out of spec as well.
Auto-xers buy new stock springs for stock class racing and check them against their old springs all the time.
Got both front mounts on there and the problem persists. I think it just moved both sides up equally and now my camber is all out of wack lol. At least it shouldn't rub now.
The original mounts were definitely DONE. The rubber was almost completely smushed out of the way as the cross section shows. Both sides appeared the same.
Originally Posted by BLUE TII
Shock performance starts degrading from the moment the shock is put on the car.
The force of squeezing the oil through the valve orifices creates heat which breaks down the oil just like oil in your engine.
This is why high end shocks use synthetic oils and why racers rebuild their shocks all the time to get them back to the valving they built them to have.
A twin tube shock like the stock sho
cks have the has mixed into the oil which can lose pressure over time through the seals without leaking and cause the oil to cavitate in use and affect the damping as well.
Your stock springs are shot out of spec as well.
Auto-xers buy new stock springs for stock class racing and check them against their old springs all the time.
Makes sense. So that fluid viscosity is problably now what it used to be after 150k and 25 years haha. They could be fresher than that... I've only owned the car since 133k and they feel good on the bench and on the car. For the record I did swap out to eibach pro-kit springs like half a decade ago.
For now I'm just going to get it aligned and enjoy the car. I hate having it up on stands when I could be brapping around. Hoping some pointers, research, and a few autocrosses will show me the way.
One other odd possibility: My car had a bent front sway bar link and it was twisting the front end uneven. If the pictures are still showing in my thread, I have a picture of it.
One other odd possibility: My car had a bent front sway bar link and it was twisting the front end uneven. If the pictures are still showing in my thread, I have a picture of it.
Vince
Good call I'll look into that. I have home brew sway bar links made from spherical rod ends and due to the wash they attach I couldn't set them at the same length.
This just made me think... i should have swapped the springs side to side to see if the problem reversed.
Did you happen to compare the springs when they were out. Maybe they are mismatched, and are not the same length.
Unfortunately not, but I'm getting Delta V here in Richmond to align it on monday. The shop up the street said they couldn't align because it's "too low and the snout is too long"
I will ask them to measure the fender/pinch rail height on an actual flat surface. I don't know why I didn't realize earlier that my 80 year old garage floor may not be flat.
One observation on the new shock mounts: the car handles bumps so much better than before! That rubber really does stop the NVH from transferring to the body..
06-27-18, 08:09 AM
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pretty much. I'm pretty sure my strut is going to explode 10 miles after fixing the mounts just to spite me for starting this thread.
