PWR Charge Cooler Project--Pics
#26
first post! woo (I've been lurking for a long time)
Here's some pictures of my water to air install in a FD.
The charge coolers have advantages and disadvantages to a FMIC.
Advantages are (in the case of the PWR barrel coolers) :
High flow potential.
Extremely low pressure drop across the core.
only a small proportion of the main cooling radiator is obscured by the additional charge cooler radiator (I see the same temps with the charge cooler as with the original SMIC)
The disadvantages are
the air temps coming out of the cooler aren't as low as a large fmic. This is mainly to do with the short core of the cooler. The tuner who supplied my cooler has measured drops of 80 degrees(C) though, which is pretty amazing considering the size of the core.
They can be a pain in the *** to completely bleed the air out the system. My system will be self bleeding once I replace the bleed screw with a line back to the filler though.
There are no specific kits for the FD, all the pipework and brackets have to be fabbed.
There's quite a few people in the UK with these coolers now, some of which are nurburgring regulars so they've been extensively tested with long periods of WOT
My car's off the road at the moment as I'll be installing a T04Z in the next couple of weeks.. it will be interesting to see how the cooler performs with lower temps going into it (my twins are shot)
http://www.zen44871.zen.co.uk/Pictures/W2AInstall/
Here's some pictures of my water to air install in a FD.
The charge coolers have advantages and disadvantages to a FMIC.
Advantages are (in the case of the PWR barrel coolers) :
High flow potential.
Extremely low pressure drop across the core.
only a small proportion of the main cooling radiator is obscured by the additional charge cooler radiator (I see the same temps with the charge cooler as with the original SMIC)
The disadvantages are
the air temps coming out of the cooler aren't as low as a large fmic. This is mainly to do with the short core of the cooler. The tuner who supplied my cooler has measured drops of 80 degrees(C) though, which is pretty amazing considering the size of the core.
They can be a pain in the *** to completely bleed the air out the system. My system will be self bleeding once I replace the bleed screw with a line back to the filler though.
There are no specific kits for the FD, all the pipework and brackets have to be fabbed.
There's quite a few people in the UK with these coolers now, some of which are nurburgring regulars so they've been extensively tested with long periods of WOT
My car's off the road at the moment as I'll be installing a T04Z in the next couple of weeks.. it will be interesting to see how the cooler performs with lower temps going into it (my twins are shot)
http://www.zen44871.zen.co.uk/Pictures/W2AInstall/
#27
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Originally Posted by M104-AMG
Yep, air-to-water, intercooler are VERY efficient, just a bulky package. They are the "secret" to the forced-induction Mercedes out today. Also, if you use your own water-supply (he tapped into the engine cooling system), you can even be more efficient.
What I'd like to do, is have an Air-to-water exchanger made in the shape of the stock intercooler, and place the radiator of it on the side without an oil-cooler on my touring FD, for more stealth . . .
:-) neil
What I'd like to do, is have an Air-to-water exchanger made in the shape of the stock intercooler, and place the radiator of it on the side without an oil-cooler on my touring FD, for more stealth . . .
:-) neil
one. why use the water from the engine cooling system? the temperatures are in excess of 80 deg C, so unless the temperature of the charged air is above this, no heat rejection will take place from the air, in any case, its most likely to go the other way with the air getting hotter
two. try explaining to me how you can design a water to air cooler to the same shape as an air to air. think of it this way: the outside air (air-air) is a free commodity; the water isnt (water-air), you have to recover it, basically the most effective design is the barrel when it comes to water-air coolers
#28
2/4 wheel cornering fiend
Originally Posted by AndrewDevlin
in reply to kentos post about it creating additional time, i dont believe this is true, you are still using the same conduction transfer medium (aluminium) and any slight increase in time will be neglagible considering the wall thickness are < 1mm
your most likely going to be worried about the transient effects of water temp build up which is a function of 'its' own cooler and its volume... ie can your water maintain its temperature over its period of use
your most likely going to be worried about the transient effects of water temp build up which is a function of 'its' own cooler and its volume... ie can your water maintain its temperature over its period of use
Originally Posted by fro
High flow potential.
Extremely low pressure drop across the core.
Extremely low pressure drop across the core.
Originally Posted by fro
(I see the same temps with the charge cooler as with the original SMIC)
Originally Posted by M104-AMG
They are the "secret" to the forced-induction Mercedes out today.
#29
Rotary Enthusiast
Translations:
Originally Posted by fro
(I see the same temps with the charge cooler as with the original SMIC)
Kento, he was talking engine coolant temps.
"why use the water from the engine cooling system"
AD, he was just saying put the aux exchanger to the side, where an atx oil cooler (or 2nd R1 oil cooler would be. He did not say use engine cooling sys.
----------
I have posted the benefits of a/l IC's for the FD with a small stock front bumper opening. The PWR gives very low pressure drop, which is critical in getting the most from stock turbos.
The mistake most make is in using an inefficient high pressure oil cooler for the aux unit up front. A well designed, multi pass 3/4" core water based radiator up front, about the size of the condensor, would allow steady state efficiencies better than any SMIC, but not as high as FMIC's. The aux rad up front would be less of an airflow restriction, vs a fmic, so cooler engine temps would be seen at track events, vs fmic.
Originally Posted by fro
(I see the same temps with the charge cooler as with the original SMIC)
Kento, he was talking engine coolant temps.
"why use the water from the engine cooling system"
AD, he was just saying put the aux exchanger to the side, where an atx oil cooler (or 2nd R1 oil cooler would be. He did not say use engine cooling sys.
----------
I have posted the benefits of a/l IC's for the FD with a small stock front bumper opening. The PWR gives very low pressure drop, which is critical in getting the most from stock turbos.
The mistake most make is in using an inefficient high pressure oil cooler for the aux unit up front. A well designed, multi pass 3/4" core water based radiator up front, about the size of the condensor, would allow steady state efficiencies better than any SMIC, but not as high as FMIC's. The aux rad up front would be less of an airflow restriction, vs a fmic, so cooler engine temps would be seen at track events, vs fmic.
Last edited by KevinK2; 09-20-05 at 09:34 AM.
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