turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

Well I just got my PFS Race/Large SMIC and want to paint it black, just worried about the heat transfer. Should I powdercoat it? or is there a better option for a intercooler/radiator?

Also, im going to take the compressor housing off my T04R since its polished and ceramic coat it black. Cold side dosnt get to hot, but temps are pretty high for a powerder coat.

Im going to have my RB Duals ceramic coated black as well.

These are all being done for a more sleeper look ... but no choice.


Just wanted to run these by you guys to make sure im doing the right process for the specific parts.

Also... didnt know which section to post in... so if this were to be moved to the right place where id get some good answers, that would be appriated.

turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

?

sevensix

iTrader: (1)

rb duals look the same as stock exhaust why coat them , maybe the piping for better flow but... the tips and canister? naaah

RXtacy

iTrader: (7)

Ceramic chrome ftw

FD3S2005

iTrader: (11)

powdercoat, to reduce heat would be good.. i wouldnt on the RB

also may be out of the question, but what would be good, polish of the intake manifold or powder coat? or could you do both ? not sure what to get

cp1

i would definately not ceramic coat either an intercooler or radiator as it does not allow for heat to dissipate properly. they use it on exhaust manifolds both to look good and to reduce the heat they conduct outward. not a good idea at all...

coatings on anything will reduce its effectiveness for heat transfer. a light curable paint is the best option if you want to change the color but nothing more otherwise the heat will just be contained inside and that is not the best idea for cooling.

twomucboost4u

iTrader: (9)

If your interested in having any kind of heat containing properties powder coating will not work. As far as what cp1 said above about the intercooler I believe that to be incorrect. You can gain a lot by heat coating both your intercooler and piping and let me tell you why. The coating is to contain the temperature within, and to reduce the negative effects of heat soak. By coating the piping and intercooler your making it more efficiant by having less outside influence due to heat soak from engine bay temps. Your intakes temp will only be as cool as the outside temperature you are taking in if not maybe a little cooler 2-5degrees unless you are running some kind of aux injection or intercooler sprayer. I have my piping ,intercooler, greddy elbow, UIM, LIM all treated with a heat coating and it helped a lot in keeping solid air temps. heat soak was usually never a problem I coated the whole intercooler except for the fins. if i was driving temps stayed solid around 28-32 degrees depending on the weather at a long stop or traffic temps would climb maybe 3-5 degrees but as soon as I would start moving again they would go back down telling me heat soak was never an issue. Save the powder coating for rolecages, suspension pieces.


Chris
Chris

turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

Im coating everything black because of the cops my friends... chrome modified exhaust= not good.... black stock looking exhaust = better than not good.

my enginebay is going to be FLAT BLACK competly soon.... atleast as much as I can... polished **** dosent fly in SoCal.

Ceramic coat (to keep heat in... also used on stuff that gets really hot) the RB duals

Powdercoat (dosnt really effect heat... and works on cold stuff and NOT exhaust, downpipe, etc..) the SMIC

Juiceh

iTrader: (4)

The best thing to do with your compressor cover is to leave it in its original cast finish. That allows it to have the most surface area to dissipate heat since the surface is pitted and rough. Yeah it doesn't look as nice as a polished one. cp1 is right, do not use ceramic coating on the compressor cover. Ceramic coatings are used to reflect heat. A ceramic coated exhaust manifold\hotside housing\downpipe all help to keep exhaust energy inside, which helps spool and reduces engine bay temperatures. A ceramic coated intercooler pipe will protect the intake charge post Intercooler from engine bay heat better than an uncoated aluminum pipe. Ceramic coating will just keep heat in the housing, which you don't need.

You can ceramic coat the top, bottom & end tanks on the intercooler if you really want. But just don't coat the fins. Rather than coat any of the intercooler I'd get it anodized black. Then the entire thing will be black including the fins. That would have a much better overall appearance and fit your sleeper criteria quite nicely.

turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

Anodizing! competly forgot about that. thanks

so far this is whats going to happen (update of post #8)..

Ceramic coat = RB Duals
Powdercoat = Compressor housing
Anodize = SMIC

cp1

sorry belief is not fact.

i have all done all the professional testing from when i used to work for a engine machine shop and rebuilder.

there is a benefit to coating the exhaust side of the engine with ceramic and or powder coating now powder coating usually wont hold up against the high heats but containment is the idea on the exhaust side you dont want that heat to stay under the hood you want it down and out.

To ceramic coat the intake side their is a huge temp disadvantage. your car will invariably run hotter in all conditions. an air to air intercooler relies on that air to metal to air contact. ceramic coatings act as an insulator. yes it is correct to say that internal heat will not escape from your intercooler but this is not what you want you want to cool the intake side with moving outside air. which is why front mount intercoolers are efficient plain. the heat soak you are refering to is your assumption that the car is not moving and therefor outside cool air would not be able to enter the engine bay. this is all wrong for many reasons. over 90% of all radiant engine heat under the hood is lost almost immediately upon forward motion ie. incoming air.

You want this incoming air to interact with the fins on an intercooler or rad. ceramic coating a cooling component is akin to putting a winter coat on in the summer. meaning that your right your body heat wont escape but you wont feel any cooling effect either as the internal temperature is much warmer than the outside ambient air temp.

reduce the contact surface of an intercooler by insulating it and temperature will go up and quickly. you may think it runs cooler but the benefit for coatings can only be seen on anything exhaust side as this reduces the average ambient air temperature under the hood. dont ever kid yourself that the air being pushed out of a turbos intake side will ever be cooler than the outside ambient air temp. not possbile at all due to the compression of the air and the speed at which it is moving, the best you can hope for is to lower that temp to the outside air or by applying a liquid to air cooling system.

I hope this helps and i do know exactly what i am talking about. one need only ask a dyno shop why they use large fans against the car during a run and that is to best simulate a real forward motion. ie air circulation to cool the intake air by forcing cooler outside air into the engine bay

again belief is not fact.

sevensix

iTrader: (1)

yeah leave the ic alone, some flat paints will be fine i think there are some that will increase the thermal exchange? not sure i haven't looked into that but ceramic coating the heat exchangers of ic or radiator is not a good idea at all. and as far as compressor, ceramic coating will probably be best, powdercoat wont do much to keep the heat in, which is what u want if u're considering underhood temps(think turbo blanket) not sure if all of this was covered, i skimmed

DaveW

^^^ +1 - absolutely correct

The IC, and, of course, the radiator, operate by transferring heat from themselves to the air passing through them. Anything that makes that heat-transfer process less efficient will make the IC less capable of removing the heat from the turbo-heated intake air. As far as heat soak goes, yes, it may get hot less quickly, but it will also cool down more slowly, for the reason noted above.

crcleofdst

Just to add a little to the discussion, you may get some benefit by coating the piping coming into, and out of the intercooler, maybe even the intercooler endtanks. As long as your not coating the portion that is doing the heat exchange, I can't see it hurting.

sevensix

iTrader: (1)

^ i always wondered.. whats hotter, the air in the tubing leading to the IC or the ambient underhood temps.

after IC it should be cooler so that should def. be coated..

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

You can coat the end tanks of the IC without issue. Just don't coat the core. There is a special paint you can buy which is for painting cores for radiators. Since an IC is similar, you could use it there as well if you need.

cp1

like i said above, ambient temperature of the engine bay is only a factor when the car is sitting still. as soon as you have air circulation 90% of that heat dissipates almost immediately. to answer your first question the entire intake tract is constantly cooling the intake air... and since heat radiation is largely due to surface area (other factors include material, density etc.) the intercooler is responsible for a majority of the cooling effect that is not to say that the uim does nothing. it still cools the air, tho not with near the same efficiency. IN testing coating any part of the entire intake tract will decrease the amount of heat lost even somewhat slightly thus making your intake air hotter. if you dont want heat to affect your intake make sure you take steps to insulate the exhaust (this is responsible for the major share of underhood heat) and get it away from the engine as fast and as efficiently as possible.

i have no problem with ceramic coating for asthetics your LIM or UIM because these things are not huge contributors to air cooling like your intercooler or radiator. so you are only taking the cooling advantage away from components that have only a minimal effect (read not zero but minimal) on the Intake Air Temperature. every component of the intake system including the compressor side of the turbine is losing heat constantly, insulate your most beneficial components and dont be surprised by a very hot engine that produces less horsepower in the end than one just left alone

cp1

ok so i found a copy of a dyno runs we tested on a customers stock 87 toyota supra turbo and just put them into a spreadsheet. to show you the same graph we got on temperatures throughout his intake system. as much as we could tell this was a completely stock supra. so we took temp readings at 7 points. at the air filter just as air was coming into the intake, right after the compressor, just in front of the factory s shaped intercooler, immediately after it, in the fender on the intake tract, at the 3000 pipe that lays across the cylinder head and at the intake manifold. readings were in degrees celsius. we did two runs one with the shop fan on like you would do normally to simulate driving and another with it off. even with it off there is still substantial cooling from the factory components. but you will notice there is one spot where the 3000 pipe was where temps rose a few degrees this was we figured because this pipe lays directly over top the exhaust side of the turbo so there was a significant source of heat. before each run the car was cooled completely then brought up to operating temps with the fan on (we only turned the fan off for the short run). these are real recordings

the first run with the fan on produced 172 whp while the uncooled run gave 158 whp

charlies7

iTrader: (4)

Dam man, I know a local anodizer. I could have taken care of that for you before I shipped you the intercooler. Everything came ok right?

turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

Ah **** Charlies7... should have told you earlier


Guys.. holy ****... would you please take a look at my post #10 . I AM NOT going to ceramic coat the compressor housing or SMIC... just the catback.

Im ANODIZING the SMIC..... and POWERDERCOATING the compressor housing.

I appriate the input... but even in my first posts, I already explain why im why im doing certain coatings to specfic parts. Im having 3 differnt coatings done to 3 differnt parts. All coatings respective to its part

Im..

ceramic coating the catback (RB duals)
powdercoating the compressor housing
anodizing the SMIC

im asking is the specific coating correct for its respective part?


also... mahjik..
link to paint for IC cores?

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

http://www.eastwoodco.com/shopping/p...iProductID=125

There are others out there. You need something similar as it needs to be light for the fins.

turBRO240

iTrader: (1)

BTW... I will only be painting the back side of the SMIC if I dont get it anodized. The front part will be covered by the duct.

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

You may as well paint the whole thing if you are going to paint any of it. I don't see why you wouldn't while you have it out.

Juiceh

iTrader: (4)

Why not annodize the comp housing as well? It is made out of Aluminum isn't it?



PM'd

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

I have powdercoated several intercoolers and I would not recommend doing the core itself, just the end tanks, and top plate possibly. powdercoat is quite thick, several times thicker than paint, and acts like plastic as an insulator. The goal of an intercooler is to EXCHANGE heat, while applying any sort of coating to it will act as a coating to help it RETAIN heat, which is the opposite of wha tyou want to do.

At most I would spraypaint it flat black, which is probably the thinnest paint with the greatest heat exchange rate. IF you can leave the front side unpainted then that is better, as most of the heat exchange will occur there versus the back end (which will tend to be slightly hotter due to enginebay heatsoak).

IF you need a powdercoater I work pretty cheap.