KZ1

Hey Guys,

Jason and I wanted to get your opnion on a new product we have developed, so let us know what you guys think.


Basically, this kit is similar to other Nitrous cooling kits for intercoolers, Designed specifically for RX-7s and their tempermental A/F behavior, it differs in several ways:

-Operates at idle and Off-WOT
-Includes Ducting Seal to seal Nitrous from getting into air-intake
-Only kit that will fit stock-mount intercoolers(specially designed ring)
-Includes 5lb bottle polished for use with Nitrous
-

I went onto the Dyno with this thing and did all kinds of tests, found out that most of the power increases when using it at WOT throttle were just because it was running leaner from Nitrous getting into engine. Initially disaapointed I found out that this product could be adapted to work simply at idle or off-WOT to cool intercooler and combat heat-soak. Think of it as a sort of super fan for stock mounts. The greatest improvements will be seen on stock-mounts as they get completely heat soaked after stoping and idling for a few minutes, while at idle, mist the intercoler a few times, and boom drastically decrease heat-soak. If you ever have had a stock-mount you know how discouraging i is to drive you car at 65C intakes temps in the summer with no power. I have tested it with the m2 medium and PFS intercoolers will also work with all other stock-mounts and of course front-mounts.

Anyways, attached is a sort of spec sheet and write up. I have also attached a pic of how it is mounted, it requires no drilling if mounting in an RX-7 3rd Gen. The price is ver competitve to the NEX systems at 450$.

Please respond to this post with your feedback, the kit will be available soon at the RX-7 Store depending on the interest, so let us know your level of interest and your willingness to participate in a group buy.

I have been running the system on my RX-7 for almost a year now with great results, I don't have to worry about stopping at a stop light before a race as it restores all that lost power from heat-soak

www.keezer.ca/Publications/K-522 Cooler.pdf

matty

i have seen setups where rather then spraying the intercooler, there is some plumbing which is attached to the ic itself. The plumbing radiates the IC with cold n2o. this way would seem alot more efficient. I am not sure if either are worth the money though.

matty

oh wait...i just followed that link: www.keezer.ca/Publications/K-522 Cooler.pdf
it appears that this doesnt spray the IC but radiats it.

DCrosby

Link no longer works... but, so how does it recycle the nitrous !? It works like an Air Conditioner Right !?
The EXpanding gasses eat up energy (Heat) and need to get radiated and re-compressed !? If not you'd vent nirous to the outside air, and if not properly mixed, could cause a flamability hazard / explosion !? Plus you'd run through Nitrous pretty fast, and would have to refill something that isn't exactly cheap !?

I'd like more details on how it cools, and what kind of maintenance costs I'm looking at, and when does it activate, at idle... how does it know when it's getting heat soaked !? Temp or timer !?

-DC

matty

u actually hit the nail right on the head as to what i am talking about.

Kento

Not worth it, IMO. Refilling a water injection tank is a hell of a lot cheaper and easier than nitrous.

KZ1

if it worked like an air conditioner ti the xompressor could be bigger than the engine itself. it works like the NEX system and sprays onto the intercooelr with a trigger switch.

all modern nitrous systems vent to atmosphere, that cannot be avoided.

It costs about 20$ to fill up a 5lbs bottle at the speed shop near me.

KZ1

Probelm with water injection is that it effectively injects inert gas into combustion process thus retarding ignition timing, combustion temperatures are determined my air/Fuel ratio not intake temps. Cooling the intercooler much mroe effectively cools temps and increases oxygen density, wtaer injection really does not do this. Water injection is used by racers when they have exceeded the mechanical limits of retarding timing. or if you do not have control over your ignition maps and want to run more boost. With a stand alone, etc you see no realy benefits with water injection on that end. ALso, in order for water injection not to rob power from the engine, tunning must be perforemd. WIth the cooler the intake temp probe takes care of adjustments.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

The difference here, i believe, is that you wouldn't necessarilly have to tune for this the way i believe you do w/ water injection.

KZ1

not only that, but it works much better at effectively cooling the temps than water injection.

Fumanchu

Sounds good to me. You have my attention. Sitting in traffic in LA is the worst.

When is it going to hit the shelves?

FD3S_RS

I've been using the Nitrous Exp N-tercooler kit. Yes it works wonders at full throttle (only operates at full throttle). Your *** can feel the gains. But damn it won't last more than 5 runs (2nd,3rd,4th gear), possibly less. And damn here in Indonesia, its damn expensive to fill up the damn bottle. So, I stopped using the system. I am running a big I/C stock mount by ARC. Thinking about using WI but its quite a pain to install and not reliable enough. Perhaps I'm either installing a fan on the I/C or a water spray for the I/C. Cheap and reliable system. Just my thought, no insult to anyone

zooq

how are you going to stop nitrous from going into the intake?? isn't nitrous going to hurt the motor even when at idle?

KZ1

Your A/F must be very rich for you to have not blown your engine, on my WOT I had to shut it down in 4th as it got too lean to keep going. The net is full of stories of guys doing to same thing adn blwoing engines on teh NEX kit. In most cases people who build guys like to have control over what is going on as far as timing, a/f, etc. that is why the KIC kit is used at idle or Off-WOT to cool intercooler. it cools just as well at idle as it does WOT, only differnce is you are not going to blow your engine off-wot.

It comes with a 5lbs tank which I used for 3 weeks, I would mist the intercooler for a few seconds after each run and waiting for the next. worked like magic.

great points though great to hear from soomeone who has been using it. What kidn of mods do you have? The KIC kit can be used like you did, we just don't recomned it, if you want NOS in your engine get a regular NOS kit at least it has somewhat better control.

Anybody who has driving in 50F and 100F knows what kind of power diffence we are talking about

KZ1

the KIC kit seals the front of you intercooler to your existing duct as to eliminate the leakage in the front and help in the cooling. You are always going to get some leaking around the back, maybe on the bottom of the intercooler. it cannot be help. that is why we recomend to use at off-WOT and idle.

there is no way it could possibly hurt you engine at idle, pull you fuel pump fuse and see the effect, or stop your engine. Engine runs lean all the time at this levels it cause no damage or detonation. Also, the amount of nitrous getting by is so little it really isn't an issue. I have comletely open intakes and the effect of nitrous getting in the engine is again not an issue ( at idle and WOT)

tbonerx7

Maybe use a different gas to cool than n2o?

I'd think you sell more water misters than the n20 intercoolers. You've got to be a serious racer to be using the n20 intercooler.

Other considerations... would you consider it safe? (sound like a yes to me). Ease of installation? Effectiveness--dyno numbers/mods. Who can benefit-benefit the most? Possible risk of damage? I've heard of brake rotors cracked when people take 'em to the car wash (I know the temps are different and the method is different). Weight? Heavy, light? Complexity? Is it simply sensors and a release--more more complex? Maintenaince costs. Failsafes--on/off switch? If bottle runs out part way through a run ,etc.

I think it's a good idea, I don't know if it's really worth it. I'd rather use nitrous to get power a different way rather than for this way of cooling... I know there are drawbacks...

Just food for thought.

saxyman990

I'm currently in the process of building a custom sprayer for my IC (few small bugs to work out, but it should be finished pretty soon). I use CO2 rather than nitrous. It's a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to find, and it's just about as cold.

The few short tests that I've done definately indicated some positive benifits. It drastically lowers intake temps. The butt-dyno approves of this mod .

The best part about it, was that it cost me less than $100 to build the kit (although, i need to go to a more expensive solenoid, so that price will probably climb another $50).

Just FYI, and positive affirmation that IC sprayers (when used properly) work quite well.

particleeffect

i'm just not crazy about spraying nitrous into anything but the engine. it seems like such a waste. less wastefull to just boost less and spray the engine or go with h2o. you don't need to tune for h2o fwik, you can and run leaner and let the water work for anti det, but you don't need to. just spray it in just b4 the IC instead of just before the throttle body.

RX-Racer

I'm doing the same as you, Its alot cheapier to use Co2
than using No2. So far i have only spent . . .$40. Alot
cheapier than you.

JP

FD3S_RS

I kinda of agree with Tbone. perhaps you could probably sell more I/C water sprays rather than Nos. The whole system would be a lot cheaper. Just need electric water pump, a hose, a few nozzles (from a windscreen washer, or what the Evo 7 uses, a big plastic tank (so we can put big chunks of ice)

twinturboy

I think a water sprayer would be better also.

KZ1

I found C02 didn;t come close to coolign enough, bottle and selenoid are expensive items at least 200$ for both

I can;t understand how c02 is easyto find than nitrous, to get nitrous around my city I can go to any speed shop, to get C02 I haev to go to some huge plant where they fill industrial bottle. only one in whole city. and the C02 was more expensive than the NOS

KZ1

true it woudl be cheaper, but it woudl do anything either, I don;t think you guys understand how this thing functions. C02 is just as expensive and cools less, way less. water will do nothing, it will evaporate befire it even hits the intercooler.

The NEX intercooler kits hase a huge following, the goal here weas to offer a less expensive kit that would actually fit and work with the RX-7.

dubulup

Alcohol/water mixture mister would be the way to go IMHO.

Couldn't nitrous be dangerously cold with an extremely heat soaked IC...I know you've done testing, but just seems dangerous in the long run.

What do I know???

saxyman990

How does it not come close to cooling enough??? The boiling point of CO2 is -109 degrees F, wheras the boiling point of N2O is somewhere around -126 degrees. When you are talking that kind of extreme negative temperatures, it is plenty cold enough.

Read my post. My setup (including bottle, solenoid, as well as my first fill-up) was less than $100. And that price actually includes a lot of Asthetic-type work. It's all about shopping around.

CO2 can be refilled at any paintball store. Also, most sports equipment stores can refill CO2 bottles (sports authority, Gart sports, Dicks sporting goods, etc). Also much cheaper than nitrous. Only a few bucks will fill an entire bottle. (my bottle refils are usually in the 5-8 dollar range).

Just my $0.02. I'm not saying this is the best way to do it, I'm just giving my point of view.