well it looks like im going to be replacing my 95 fd with a cheaper shell and upgrades and i was wondering who could tell me with bias which one of these is or in the case of bi state will be the best bang for the buck
thx
barban

 

bi state? never heard of them...

 

search....upgraded twins is the keyword

bistates are unproven as of yet...there are no dyno sheets to support what they are doing yet. I think they have a deal with the rx7 store to market their turbos on the site.


bnrs set is proven....there were a few kinks along the way but overall they have a very vocal and supportive group of customers who are happy with what bryan has done over there at bnr. Their stage 3 set is currently a very attractive upgrade with an extremely fair price. If I ever need another set of twins I will go that direction as the power and the price are just too good to pass up.

the m2 set I have. I love them. The performance is there...The response is second to none. If you want sequential response and dont mind paying for it then this is the set for you. Im very happy with them.


jason

 

The BNR's aren't ball bearing are they?

 

No they have dynamic seals...

 

dynamic seals? Is that like "special sauce"? What could make a seal dynamic and why would that be good?

I'm certainly not dissing BNR as I'll likely be getting some someday, but wonder what that marketing term is supposed to mean.

 

BI State customs has set the price of their upgraded 400HP + twin turbos at $1,599 plus good core. The upgraded turbos that BI State is offering are comparable to the BNR Stage 3 turbos that they offer. This is what the BI State Customs upgraded twin turbos come with.

-Turbine housings are modified for increased air flow
-Turbine Wheels Clipped
-Both secondary and primary compressor turbine wheels are upgraded
-Specially modified thrust bearing for increased lubrication and longer life
-Units are completely digitally balanced
-Ported Wastegates
-Units will be fully rebuilt

Here is the phone number 618-234-0069

 

Japan Spec Twins ('99 Type RS)

 

Are they dynamic seal? That is the biggest differance in BNR stage 3's and all the other upgraded twins out there. Well and that they use a different compressor wheel that no one else is using (I dont know what BiState is using).

STEPHEN

 

Its not a marketing term. A dynamic seal is real part used in certain types of turbos. BNR has done serious fabrication to use dynamic seals instead of carbon seals (carbon seals are what come stock). Carbon seals suck and there is no longer a good supplier for good carbon seals because there is no demand for them. The FD is about the only car still getting turbos rebuilt with carbon seals...which is old 80's turbo technology. This is why its hard to get good quality carbon seals now a days

STEPHEN

 

BI State Customs uses the production style Dynamic seal that has proven to be best for this application.

 

What does "production style" mean. The stock turbos were produced with carbon seals not dynamic seals

STEPHEN

 

I'll be sure to post sheets and pictures when we get them on my car here shortly. Yee Haw!

 

They are based off a carbon seal but the garrett engineers refer to them as a rebuildable dynamic/carbon design which, they suggest for our particular application. Nasayers will often criticize the design but until they prove their Garrett engineering credentials I will leave it up to the current engineers I deal with.

That's all I would like to discuss about our seals for now.

Thank you

 

Dude, that is crazy $$

 

Yeah, but they're brand new castings! I paid $2600 @ SR Motorsports, and the new J-spec twins (now have 5200 miles) are worth every penny!

 

What exactly does "dynamic" mean? Is this referring to material type, design, something else?

 

how many fan blades are on the compressor wheel?

I ask because the number of blades on the gt30 compressors in the m2 set are fewer than on the wheels of the bnr set. Im curious as to the differences in compressor wheels...and why...what are the benefits of using different wheels not in terms of size but in terms of shape and design.


j

 

I have been told that the single gt 35/40 spools almost as fast as twins but has a lot more potential in the hp and torque department...plus the bonus of simplification of the engine bay.

I have also been told that the m2 upgrades tend to burn out faster than the stockers....of course that may be becuase one tends to push the m2s harder....

anyone want to confirm or deny either theory?

 

The GT 35/40 does not have nearly the low end of the stock twins. No single does. Apparently, it does spool very fast above 3500 rpm though.

I don't know where you heard that rumour about the M2 twins burning out. I know of only three people on the forum that are running the M2 twins and none of them has experienced any issues (other than the over-oiling which has been fixed).

 

a rebuilt turbo will always be a rebuilt. if you want reliability get the 99 twins. rebuilt twins are easy money for rebuilders and good cores are very hard to find. reason why pettit racing stopped selling hybrid turbos and now recommed the 99 twins. m2 set may be an exception since they use garret ball bearing on the stock manifold but then again the manifold may have cracks.

so you say they come with a warranty. that you will definetly use and dont forget the extra dollars in installation and parts (gaskets, studs, bolts,..) you will be spending to put them on and off which the warranty does not cover. most will have some sort of crack on the manifold which will eventually crack deeper. by the time you are done you would be better off buying new turbos or even a single turbo kit. so learn from my mistakes and buy new.

just my .02 and good luck

 

....from someone trying to sell a 35/40

thanks for the info btw

 

Agreed. However, my turbos are mint. No manifold cracks, no play, no nothing. I don't "abuse" what I have. I definately "use" it, but don't push the envelope. I'm guessing I will have a VERY fast, reasonably reliable car. Both the engine and turbos are warrantied. Yes that only covers part of it, but better than none. We'll see. I'll be MORE than happy to post any and all figures I get from the setup.

 

I agree with the fact that going to single turbo is the best overall decision when thinking about keeping a FD. If I were keeping the car, I would have gone with the GT35/40 single. My turbos were spent and I went with BNR Stage 2s - I had a few problems with getting boost out of them non-seq (wouldn't boost past 10 psi) - had them pulled and sent back to BNR who put in his new compressor wheels which spool very well. I did have to pay for R&R but Bryan was glad to fix anything I wanted. Now my rebuilds don't leak, they pump at 380 rwhp at only 15 psi sequentially with a HF cat. I think the BNR set will be limited to 425-420 rwhp at the most at 18 psi but the most is 412 rwhp non-seq (SPO). M2s seem to have a little more power and response than mine on the primary but even out up top. Both M2 and BNR have produced multiple 360 rwhp - 412 rwhp on stock manifold twins which is great. BI State has to prove themselves yet. Gt35/40 seems the best way to go for reliability and overall power.

 

35/40 here i come