eyecandy

iTrader: (19)

Please read before voting.

I am just trying to gauge some opinion here, I have pretty finshed all the desgining and ready to begin to buy, first here is alittle back ground info.

-My max power will be about 400HP, both Intercoolers are good for 600+HP.
-No AC will be used in both cases
-Both setups are going to be all custom, a few highlights are noted below.
-Both setups will cost about the same with a +-$15 bewtween the two.

V-mount:
-Dual pass radiator (2row)
-Less pressure drop (approx .25lbs)**
-Proper shielding around the IC and radiator

FMIC
-Triple pass radiator (2row) (cooling will not be a problem)
-More pressure drop (apprx .25lbs)** but aprroximatly 11% more cooling effiecency, which is better than having a lower pressure drop.
-Proper shielding/ducting to trap all air from back of IC to fron of rad.

Thats about the most of it, what do you think?

RedR1

iTrader: (5)

There are litterally TONS of threads on this. A lot of the intercooler guru's have put in their input, with Kevin Wyum posting like 30 times in one thread alone. I'm not trying to sound liek a dick so don't take it that way, but just type in VMIC up there in that search option in the 3rd gen section, as well as rotary performance area, and you will find more information than you ever needed.

However, to help you out, to sum it all up in a nutshell: No system is perfect or has more advantages of the other (VMIC/FMIC/SMIC). They all have their advantages and set-backs. It all comes to practicality, or your wallet.

Chris~

AntiVenom7

i know you think cooling wont be a problem, but at least with my FMIC(apexi) it seems like more than a 1/4 of radiator is blocked. cooling hasn't been a problem, but then again, i have been to the track with it or turned the boost up to where i want it. i am gonna try and do some ducting, but i wish i had gone v-mount.

like chris said, there are a million threads on the subject.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I think you should just plumb three stock intercoolers in series. Can we get a poll on that?

RedR1

iTrader: (5)

^^ and 2 sets of the twins for a quad setup, and run them at 30 psi Ultra hot heat thru uless stock intercooler that cant cool past 15psi. . . . makes for an interesting science experiement

fastcarfreak

I say front mount. Between the cost and the better cooling of the intake charge, i just like them better. vmount setups are awesome for tracking the car though. For drag racing, its fmic all the way.

1sicsol

All the heat sits on the top of the engine bay, so theres got to be heat soak, just like the stock intercoler.

Go with the front mount.

adictd2b00st

thats what vented hoods are for

*edit* not to mention with a fmic your water temps are gonna be higher, DEF not a good thing with our cars

rotoboy661

i agree with the fmic as the drag setup

but most people with Fd's dont drag as much, well occassionally , but most ppl drive their FD's daily and have problems with cooling

with that said the vmount is far more suprior than the fmic in terms of cooling and effectivness on the street

i hade the apexi fmic and koyo rad before, and i was amazed of how water temps rose so quickly, when i was puttin the car under load like an uphill climb
, even with the aluminum radiator it was up there like 106c

now im cruising up at 80 mph and getting 84-87c

if u ask me for the price u pay for a vmount its well worth, unless u wanna fry your coolant seals instead

i guess it just depends on what you want to do with your car (drag or street) , i drive my single Fd everyday (almost) and im thankful i switched to the vmount

good luck on what u guys decide

heres a pic of my setup

RedR1

iTrader: (5)

Mike (or anyone else), maybe you can answer this as I noticed you have quite some info on the VMIC. the radiator is placed at an angle as to let the heated air escape beneath the motor correct? We all know hot air rises, and the object to lower chins and side skirts is to keep as little airflow under the car as possible. As the radiator heats and passes the warm air along, do you notice any increase in drag, or lift since the VMIC is placing warm air there, when the SMIC vents it upward?

I know a vented hood is a must for a VMIC, which was also dictated by a company who doesnt even make hoods (HKS). However, the rad is placed so low that the air will not reverse and get sucked out the hood. Can someone shed light on this? Could it possibly be hazardous at the end of a highspeed striaght since you're pushing more air thru the radiator the faster you go?

rotoboy661

yes air passes thru rad and downward, thats why we dont need an undertary, as for drag not really didnt pay much attention to that but im sure its not too bad

but in my setup i have a slight gap between where the rad and ic meet (making the V) so not too much turbulance is created

well as for vented hoods its a not a must but better suited for this application

i was at d1 recently and saw the apexi fd engine for the 1st time, and it exactly describes what your asking, at hi speeds fmic have the same effect, but i think i know what yur getting at, trapping more air on the nose of the car right???

i never felt the front get light with my setup @ 150mph so u should be fine

heres a pic of that setup



yes air does channel out thru hood and out, and does like a cowl induction used on early muscle cars

spekdah

I was FMIC fro a while, then I went FlatMIC for a while, but I found I had much better results with FMIC so I went back.
Hers is a pic of my FlatMIC

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

had some heatsoak problems with my smic so now im going with the fmic..im not really concerned on the cooling problem cause i dont drive my car for long periods of time and hardly in heavy heavy traffic..then again i dont drive my car everyday neither so im good..plus i like the look of the car with a fmic so i chose that..

Brian_93

FMIC baby

RedR1

iTrader: (5)

Isn't that sorta the same as a VMIC? just with a little less angle? I'd think that they would perform almost equal. . .?? Then again, i've yet to test either, so I really have nothing but speculation at the moment. How did the FMIC perform better? Pressure drop? Underhood temps? Please elaborate if ya don't mind!

eyecandy

iTrader: (19)

I appreciate the votes thus far and it seems to be heavily slanted to the V-mount.

I have read every thread on V-mounts and Front mounts here and got what I need. The intention of this thread was to take a poll, and I tried to give as mush info about the two setups as possible. Although I did notice I left something out, I forgot to mention what the car would be used for:

Approx. 70% street and 30% track/autox, although its NOT my daily driver.

Some of you mentioned FMIC because of it being cheaper, in my case it will not be cheaper since I will be using a custom buiklt radiator.

Here are a fewer other bigger points swaying me either way(+ good -bad):

V-Mount
+no IC blocking radiator (both getting clean air from nose)
-IC still under hot engine bay
-bottom of rad further from the front wheel axis (possible clearance issues, hitting curbs etc)
- For full benefit a vented hood is needed (will NOT be purchasing any time soon)

F-Mount
+IC out of engine bay in clean cool air
+Radiator upright (easier for air to pass through)
-IC blocking rad, custom thriple SHOULD have NO problem handling the cooling (noted earlier)

bleung

I think the v-mount setup allows less air to circulate in the engine bay but I doubt this is really harmful. My local shop recommended I put a fan on top of the intercooler to suck the air through to the engine bay. His theory is that the air sitting behind the intercooler in the engine bay prevents good flow through the intercooler itself because that pocket of air has no where to go. I only remember how hot the engine bay was when the car was stock and its definitely cooler under there now but I have other mods like full exhaust that contribute to the cooler underhood temps.

I'm not really sold on the above theory, just repeating what someone said. In my opinion, the v-mount is an excellent setup that was cleverly designed. I wanted something that allowed me to make more power while keep the car running cooler.

eyecandy

iTrader: (19)

I really do not see how it will differ from a FMIC or SMIC, you either got the rad, engine or hood in any or all cases sitting right behind the IC.

WolfpackFD3S

I think VMIC is the best way to go as I daily drive my RX7, I had bought a FMIC and was very unsatisfied on the fitment and was very worried about overheating (Didn't feel like cutting off like half the bumper reinforcement and having a sagging bumber). Don't think a vented hood is a must either, sure it would help, but definitely not required to run the setup (most people i have seen with a VMIC do not have vented hoods). Plus plan on doing some track events later on so FMIC would not be the way to go for me.

-Rob

eyecandy

iTrader: (19)

I am still torn between the two even though the polls speak otherwise. If, rotoboy661 would ever get back to me about the RE regular V-mount he is selling I will mostly likly buy that.

Here is some other food for thought, alot of people claim that FMIC cause over heating problems on the track (and city driving). Then explain this to me. RE Amemiya, R-Magic and FEED use Front mounts on there race/shop cars. Yes RE and R-magic produce V-mounts as well, but they do not use them for their time attack cars. Altough unlike FEED and R-Magic, RE does not sell a Front mount to the public, I am not sure why that is.

I believe RE uses a cross flow dual pass radiator, and I think I read somewhere that FEED and R-magic use a triple pass rad. I know quite a few other companies and enthusiats have switched from SMIC/FMIC to V-mount but a good majority still use a FMIC.

rynberg

That's not really food for thought, or not much more than a light snack anyway. Those cars are dedicated track cars with custom designed and efficient cooling systems. How hot does it get in Japan, anyway?

The fact is, FMICs make the car run hotter. That is FACT. You may be just fine in street situations, but road racing in the warmer months is really going to tax a system which is already struggling WITHOUT a 3-4 inch hunk of metal in front of the radiator.

A v-mount is a great idea. If someone could develop a kit that combined the characteristics of the Rotary Extreme kit and the HKS kit, I would be very happy (work with 93-95 A/C, PS, allow use of 51R battery).

eyecandy

iTrader: (19)

FEED and R-Magic cars are not track only, they still have full interior, and AC! Temperarture in Japan is much like the northeast here, 70-80's with humidity. Plus that is why I sated about using a triple pass radiator in my setup.

What are you getting at here?

rynberg

I like the RE kit, except I don't trust that tiny little battery. I've heard it's a bit of a pain in the *** to get the P/S and A/C lines rerouted but other than that, it fits and works well.

The HKS kit allows you to use a 51R battery and also includes a splitter between the IC and the radiator. However, it is designed to work with the 99+ RX-7s and so there's no easy way to reroute the A/C lines.

If someone came up with a kit that allowed the use of a 51R battery, had the splitter, and allowed the easy rerouting of P/S and A/C lines, I would be a happy camper (and a customer).

bleung

Does anyone have a pic of the splitter on the hks kit?


nevermind, found it here:

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...ght=hks+vmount

RedR1

iTrader: (5)

Also the HKS kit does not come with a radiator. Only includes all couplers, intercooler, and clamps. All other kits that I have comes across do include the raidator tho.