Custom replacement solenoid system
08-18-09, 05:08 PM
#107
Can you take some high resolution pictures and send them to my email?
I have access to various solenoids through my work.
With help from owners, we might be able to reverse engineer a working prototype from the images and information posted in Rob's threads.
there is a need for these, and it would be great to have these readily available.
Part numbers and write-up would be made public for the DIY guys.
Thanks!
~ Jesse
I have access to various solenoids through my work.
With help from owners, we might be able to reverse engineer a working prototype from the images and information posted in Rob's threads.
there is a need for these, and it would be great to have these readily available.
Part numbers and write-up would be made public for the DIY guys.
Thanks!
~ Jesse
Last edited by Howard Coleman; 03-29-11 at 09:26 AM.
08-18-09, 06:56 PM
#109
F'n Newbie...
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+1
The last pair I saw was a used pair of unknown condition, the guy asked $100 more then they cost new and refused to reply when I suggested he lower his price...
Having an alternate source of higher PSI solenoids would be GREAT for those of us running more boost who don't want to just keep replacing the stock ones with more stock ones...
To be honest I'm not sure what the max psi is for running the stock ones reliably. Though I do know that mine went down hill fast once I started pushing 16psi, now that I'm pushing 17-18 it's no bueno.. I'd like to run 20+, but that's not an option without solenoids that can handle it =(
The last pair I saw was a used pair of unknown condition, the guy asked $100 more then they cost new and refused to reply when I suggested he lower his price...
Having an alternate source of higher PSI solenoids would be GREAT for those of us running more boost who don't want to just keep replacing the stock ones with more stock ones...
To be honest I'm not sure what the max psi is for running the stock ones reliably. Though I do know that mine went down hill fast once I started pushing 16psi, now that I'm pushing 17-18 it's no bueno.. I'd like to run 20+, but that's not an option without solenoids that can handle it =(
Last edited by fendamonky; 08-18-09 at 07:00 PM.
08-18-09, 08:18 PM
#111
If you look through the pictures and posts about the original system, a lot of the stuff is not "necessary" but were added in to make for a cleaner kit with easier installation.
All that is really "needed" is turbo control vacuum, turbo control pressure, charge relief, and charge control solenoids. Charge control, charge relief, and turbo control (vacuum) are all three way solenoid valves. Turbo control pressure is a 2 way solenoid valve I believe, I've never looked at one closely though. The EVAP purge control solenoid is only for emissions, it's not needed. The stock precontrol and wastegate solenoids could be used and remain in their stock location (they never/rarely seem to fail) for boost controlled by the stock ECU or Power FC. Otherwise aftermarket boost control could be used.
I think if you could find 3 decent 12v 3-way solenoids (like Greddy Profec/Apexi AVCR solenoids would work but those might be expensive) and one 2-way solenoid with threaded holes and you'd be in business. It won't be as nice as these kits, and you better understand the vacuum routing, but it can be done.
Alright somebody who is ambitious but doesn't want to track down suppliers of cheaper stuff, get 3 Greddy Profec solenoids (they're close to $150 each new, ugh) and one factory precontrol solenoid you might have lying around. The three profec solenoids would be for charge control, turbo control (vac), and charge relief. The precontrol solenoid (which are two-way) would be for turbo control (pressure). then post up here and maybe I can throw out some ideas on how to do the routing. I've studied solenoid valves carefully for my own custom projects.
Another option that comes to mind would be three Perrin (which makes Subaru stuff) 3 way boost control solenoids, $100 each http://www.perrinperformance.com/pro...id?category=37 :
and then the other port opens when the coil is engaged. it seems just like stock, or like the Profec 3-way solenoids. The only question is whether boost control solenoids, which are designed to be duty controlled (cycled on and off), would be ok over the long haul with constant +12V applied to them in bursts of a few seconds. I suspect the answer is yes based on my own testing but I'm not positive. You just don't want the coil to heat up too much.
If you went the Perrin route, you'd be paying $300 for three 3-way solenoids, using a precontrol solenoid to replace the turbo control pressure solenoid, and then running the necessary vacuum lines. you'd have to hardwire those 3-way solenoids in or find suitable matching connectors.
Here's a pic of the precontrol solenoid from the FSM. I'm very familiar with its operation, but no so much the turbo control (pressure) solenoid. Can anybody confirm that it would work?
All that is really "needed" is turbo control vacuum, turbo control pressure, charge relief, and charge control solenoids. Charge control, charge relief, and turbo control (vacuum) are all three way solenoid valves. Turbo control pressure is a 2 way solenoid valve I believe, I've never looked at one closely though. The EVAP purge control solenoid is only for emissions, it's not needed. The stock precontrol and wastegate solenoids could be used and remain in their stock location (they never/rarely seem to fail) for boost controlled by the stock ECU or Power FC. Otherwise aftermarket boost control could be used.
I think if you could find 3 decent 12v 3-way solenoids (like Greddy Profec/Apexi AVCR solenoids would work but those might be expensive) and one 2-way solenoid with threaded holes and you'd be in business. It won't be as nice as these kits, and you better understand the vacuum routing, but it can be done.
Alright somebody who is ambitious but doesn't want to track down suppliers of cheaper stuff, get 3 Greddy Profec solenoids (they're close to $150 each new, ugh) and one factory precontrol solenoid you might have lying around. The three profec solenoids would be for charge control, turbo control (vac), and charge relief. The precontrol solenoid (which are two-way) would be for turbo control (pressure). then post up here and maybe I can throw out some ideas on how to do the routing. I've studied solenoid valves carefully for my own custom projects.
Another option that comes to mind would be three Perrin (which makes Subaru stuff) 3 way boost control solenoids, $100 each http://www.perrinperformance.com/pro...id?category=37 :
and then the other port opens when the coil is engaged. it seems just like stock, or like the Profec 3-way solenoids. The only question is whether boost control solenoids, which are designed to be duty controlled (cycled on and off), would be ok over the long haul with constant +12V applied to them in bursts of a few seconds. I suspect the answer is yes based on my own testing but I'm not positive. You just don't want the coil to heat up too much.
If you went the Perrin route, you'd be paying $300 for three 3-way solenoids, using a precontrol solenoid to replace the turbo control pressure solenoid, and then running the necessary vacuum lines. you'd have to hardwire those 3-way solenoids in or find suitable matching connectors.
Here's a pic of the precontrol solenoid from the FSM. I'm very familiar with its operation, but no so much the turbo control (pressure) solenoid. Can anybody confirm that it would work?
Last edited by arghx; 08-18-09 at 08:29 PM. Reason: Perrin solenoids
08-19-09, 11:11 AM
#113
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If you look through the pictures and posts about the original system, a lot of the stuff is not "necessary" but were added in to make for a cleaner kit with easier installation.
All that is really "needed" is turbo control vacuum, turbo control pressure, charge relief, and charge control solenoids. Charge control, charge relief, and turbo control (vacuum) are all three way solenoid valves. Turbo control pressure is a 2 way solenoid valve I believe, I've never looked at one closely though. The EVAP purge control solenoid is only for emissions, it's not needed. The stock precontrol and wastegate solenoids could be used and remain in their stock location (they never/rarely seem to fail) for boost controlled by the stock ECU or Power FC. Otherwise aftermarket boost control could be used.
I think if you could find 3 decent 12v 3-way solenoids (like Greddy Profec/Apexi AVCR solenoids would work but those might be expensive) and one 2-way solenoid with threaded holes and you'd be in business. It won't be as nice as these kits, and you better understand the vacuum routing, but it can be done.
Alright somebody who is ambitious but doesn't want to track down suppliers of cheaper stuff, get 3 Greddy Profec solenoids (they're close to $150 each new, ugh) and one factory precontrol solenoid you might have lying around. The three profec solenoids would be for charge control, turbo control (vac), and charge relief. The precontrol solenoid (which are two-way) would be for turbo control (pressure). then post up here and maybe I can throw out some ideas on how to do the routing. I've studied solenoid valves carefully for my own custom projects.
Another option that comes to mind would be three Perrin (which makes Subaru stuff) 3 way boost control solenoids, $100 each http://www.perrinperformance.com/pro...id?category=37 :
and then the other port opens when the coil is engaged. it seems just like stock, or like the Profec 3-way solenoids. The only question is whether boost control solenoids, which are designed to be duty controlled (cycled on and off), would be ok over the long haul with constant +12V applied to them in bursts of a few seconds. I suspect the answer is yes based on my own testing but I'm not positive. You just don't want the coil to heat up too much.
If you went the Perrin route, you'd be paying $300 for three 3-way solenoids, using a precontrol solenoid to replace the turbo control pressure solenoid, and then running the necessary vacuum lines. you'd have to hardwire those 3-way solenoids in or find suitable matching connectors.
Here's a pic of the precontrol solenoid from the FSM. I'm very familiar with its operation, but no so much the turbo control (pressure) solenoid. Can anybody confirm that it would work?
All that is really "needed" is turbo control vacuum, turbo control pressure, charge relief, and charge control solenoids. Charge control, charge relief, and turbo control (vacuum) are all three way solenoid valves. Turbo control pressure is a 2 way solenoid valve I believe, I've never looked at one closely though. The EVAP purge control solenoid is only for emissions, it's not needed. The stock precontrol and wastegate solenoids could be used and remain in their stock location (they never/rarely seem to fail) for boost controlled by the stock ECU or Power FC. Otherwise aftermarket boost control could be used.
I think if you could find 3 decent 12v 3-way solenoids (like Greddy Profec/Apexi AVCR solenoids would work but those might be expensive) and one 2-way solenoid with threaded holes and you'd be in business. It won't be as nice as these kits, and you better understand the vacuum routing, but it can be done.
Alright somebody who is ambitious but doesn't want to track down suppliers of cheaper stuff, get 3 Greddy Profec solenoids (they're close to $150 each new, ugh) and one factory precontrol solenoid you might have lying around. The three profec solenoids would be for charge control, turbo control (vac), and charge relief. The precontrol solenoid (which are two-way) would be for turbo control (pressure). then post up here and maybe I can throw out some ideas on how to do the routing. I've studied solenoid valves carefully for my own custom projects.
Another option that comes to mind would be three Perrin (which makes Subaru stuff) 3 way boost control solenoids, $100 each http://www.perrinperformance.com/pro...id?category=37 :
and then the other port opens when the coil is engaged. it seems just like stock, or like the Profec 3-way solenoids. The only question is whether boost control solenoids, which are designed to be duty controlled (cycled on and off), would be ok over the long haul with constant +12V applied to them in bursts of a few seconds. I suspect the answer is yes based on my own testing but I'm not positive. You just don't want the coil to heat up too much.
If you went the Perrin route, you'd be paying $300 for three 3-way solenoids, using a precontrol solenoid to replace the turbo control pressure solenoid, and then running the necessary vacuum lines. you'd have to hardwire those 3-way solenoids in or find suitable matching connectors.
Here's a pic of the precontrol solenoid from the FSM. I'm very familiar with its operation, but no so much the turbo control (pressure) solenoid. Can anybody confirm that it would work?
http://www.solenoidsolutionsinc.com...turevalves.html
http://www.solenoidsolutionsinc.com/valves.html
Manifold rack with solenoids:
http://www.solenoidsolutionsinc.com/WATTMIZE.PDF
I would really appreciate if more people could contribute to this. I don't like the stock solenoids at all. They break with the flick of a finger. And if they can't handle 20PSI, then I need to figure something out. I'll be ordering a set of BNR turbos before the year is out.
We should really make a new thread and start from scratch to put together a DIY. Its sucks when people say they are going to post stuff up, videos, pics, writeups, and they never do.
08-24-09, 05:49 PM
#116
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I just found this in another thread. Saxyman's solenoids are still available here: http://axiomautosports.freehostia.co...solenoids.html
08-24-09, 09:46 PM
#117
I just found this in another thread. Saxyman's solenoids are still available here: http://axiomautosports.freehostia.co...solenoids.html
I hope they are available; but good luck getting any response. Even money doesn't create a reaction.
08-27-09, 05:51 PM
#123
I haven't bothered to search, I'm sure there's a few posts on it. Essentially, it's the elimination of any parts of the turbo/fuel/engine system that is not necessary for the motor to run and turbos to boost properly in sequential form. There's a handful of solenoids, hoses, actuators, valves, etc. you can remove, assuming you don't have emissions requirements for your car. Things can be dropped like the ACV (air control valve), EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) valve, double throttle, AWS (accelerated warm up system), etc... and block off plates are installed where the old valves went, corresponding solenoids are removed along with the hoses, unused nipples are plugged, etc.
08-30-09, 07:47 AM
#124
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You should sell them to me!
Yes he should, that would be very convenient, and nice to have a reliable dealer around.
I just noticed this thread so I made a similar post else where but these guys are apparently selling them as well.
Here is a quote from the AAE website.....
NOTE to our UK Customers: Due to increasing demands, we can no longer ship direct to customers in the UK. In order to better cater to our customers there, Axiom Autosports Engineering has partnered with Lightning Dynamics (www.lightningdynamics.com). Please contact them if you are interested in purchasing one of our products.
Interestingly these guys are selling BNRs
Yes he should, that would be very convenient, and nice to have a reliable dealer around.
I just noticed this thread so I made a similar post else where but these guys are apparently selling them as well.
Here is a quote from the AAE website.....
NOTE to our UK Customers: Due to increasing demands, we can no longer ship direct to customers in the UK. In order to better cater to our customers there, Axiom Autosports Engineering has partnered with Lightning Dynamics (www.lightningdynamics.com). Please contact them if you are interested in purchasing one of our products.
Interestingly these guys are selling BNRs
08-30-09, 08:24 AM
#125
I consider it a misnomer.
It removes some vacuum hoses, actuators, and solenoids but they are all for emissions systems.
The sequential turbo system remains the same as always. Same solenoids, actuators, etc. So for enhancing the reliability of the turbo system I don't believe it gets you anywhere. It just reduces clutter under and around the UIM.
David
It removes some vacuum hoses, actuators, and solenoids but they are all for emissions systems.
The sequential turbo system remains the same as always. Same solenoids, actuators, etc. So for enhancing the reliability of the turbo system I don't believe it gets you anywhere. It just reduces clutter under and around the UIM.
David