I've read the Banzai website's instructions on how to do this, but how will removal of this component affect engine operation? From the name of the unit, I guess there would be "fuel pulsations," but how is that going to affect the engine? Constancy of A/F ratio? Mileage?

My guess is that car manufacturers don't put a $147.50 part in a car unless they feel it is needed. Why did Mazda think it was necessary?

 

Well Ray will sell you the part for about 85 bucks, but that still alot for what it does. The "Pulsations" It dampens are from what plumbers call "water hammer". The injectors open and close rapidly, causing the fuel in the rails to move then stop instantly, gas being a liquid and not compressable, needs some place to go when the injector slams shut, and that's where the FPD comes into play. The FPD takes the surge of fuel and "dampens" the pressure..

What are the consequences of removing it from the system? I don't know, but lots of cars with aftermarket fuel systems run without them. There are aftermarket FPDs, but I don't think they'd be worth the trouble.

 

Good topic. If aftermarket set-ups don't have them, I see no reason why if couldn't be removed (if done properly).

 

The only reason it is so costly is because Mazda knows it fails, and it fails with catastrophic consequences. We have not seen any adverse effects on any of the cars that we have performed this mod on. Even with long term use 3+ years on one customer's completely stock vehicle.

The reason it can be eliminated on the aftermarket setups is because the aftermaket fuel pressure regulators have built in pulsation dampers. This of course all happens after the fuel has been through the rails, unlike the OEM part where it occurs prior to entering the primary rail.

 

Thanks for your responses.

So, the reason for removing it is to eliminate the possibility of fuel leakage when it fails, right? Can the OEM FPR then be directly replaced with an aftermarket type which contains a built-in FPD, or are there other mods needed to "get back to where you started" (minus the reliability problem)?

 

I figured mine might be bad again.. and plus i have to replace the injectors.. so since i'm at it.. i'm thinking about removing the FPD.. if any 1 have had a problem after removing it.. let us/me know thanks...

 

i just asked 2 experts and one of them said that worst it could happen is rough idle.. thats the worst.. it doesn't mean its going to... so hope you guys got that.. and one of them said just block it off.. but i'm just going to do what that banzai website says to use a plug to tap it in.. so i'll see how that works out....


what you guys think//?

 

c'mon don't tell me i'll be the first one to do this on this Forum.. where all the Gurus at?? let me hear some opinions...

don't you guys think its worth it i mean.. no bad side effects plus im sure you/I could use the 170 to buy something else for the car instead of buying the a new FPD every year or so.. mine was replaced last year.. and here it goes again... plus its safe... if you haven't read this check it out.. it shows how to remove it.

http://www.banzairacing.net/pd_elimination_how-to.htm

 

I have had it done for around 4 months. I haven't noticed any idle problems, since changing it out. Of course I'm not guru either. I am running 1300's and a walbro along with it though. But that shouln't change anything.

 

As usual I disagree with most everyone here. There was a fuel system engineer much smarter than us who decided a fuel pulsation damper was needed. All the self taught fuel geniuses here decide it's not needed because some other guy removed his and his car hasn't blown up yet

Is the FPD known to fail and cause a fuel leak? Yes. Does that make it ok to throw it in the trash? Not in my opinion. That's dumb logic. People aren't even sure what it does but their mind is already made up they can do without it! Stupid.

Leave the FPD installed and replace it every 3 years or something. The only FPD's that leak are the ones which are original; it's not like they go bad all the time and require constant service. If your FPD leaks then replace it. I guarantee your engine will blow before your FPD goes bad again.

Without an FPD the fuel pressure will fluctuate (at a frequency higher than your fuel pressure gauge is capable of displaying). If the fuel pressure is fluctuating everytime the injectors open and close then they are not metering fuel as accurately as they could be.

 

Many standalone fuel pressure regulators also have pulsation dampers built into them. You typically see these installed when someone has upgraded to a complete aftermarket fuel system with a bigger pump and injectors to support more horsepower. There's no reason you couldn't install one on a stock car, but it would be overboard IMO.

 

I agree with Damon. If Mazda could have saved $50 or so per car by not running a pulsation dampener and just plumbing a nipple on the fuel rail, they TOTALLY would have done so. There's a definite reason for it.

IMHO, it's OK to eliminate the pulsation dampener on a beater NA FC or something, but the FD is another thing. Accurate fuelling is *key* to making good, safe power. If the computer is telling the injectors to fire, and sometimes you get x amount of fuel, sometimes y amount due to fluctuations in line pressure that's not cool.

Dale

 

I have not noticed any difference in AFR's, idle or otherwise, after removing the FPD. I did not make this change as lightly as you suggest either.

 

I wouldn't call one of them an expert if he says..."just block it off"

 

hmm...not sure I like these statements in the same post.

 

Good thread guys, thanks.

As I started to read this I was thinking of ripping mine out tell I got to Damon's posts. I'm now glad I left it in when up adding my aftermarket FPR and gauge.

Joe

 

I just got home from the SHop and replaced mine.. I used that nipple thing to eliminate the FPD. so yeah NO more.. so far so good no complaints i took pics too let me know if you guys want to see it.. mine wasn't bad but i was having gas leak. till 2 of the gas line clamps weren't secured enough.. now they are got 2 new primary injectors seals replaced the seals one the secondary also. and no damper.
$1.04 for the part, and $80 for labor.. so 81.04 cents

THAT WAS DIRT CHEAP... good mechanic. know him for a while now used to work on all my cars..
so if you're on the bay are and don't feel like paying $480 to have anything like that done.. let me know.

oh and my FPD if for sale. $50.00 plus shipping.

 

oh and only took 3hrs cuz i had to go look for something.. other than that.. i would say at the most 2hrs and half. at the most..

 

what about tapping using a banjo bolt like the fc then run an aftermarket fpr with built in pd on the inlet to the injectors then leaving the stock fpr to maintain the proper pressure on your system just leave the aftermarket set at max psi that your car would see then the stock would regulate it accordingly?


oh and sorry for getting involved in the 3rd gen disscussion i just thought that might be helpful

 

yep, I just installed an Aeromotive FPR and gas filter with new braided line, it's practically a mandatory upgrade on these cars if you ask me, with the potential engine fire issues and critical nature of reliable fuel delivery

the FPD is in the garbage can

 

was he friends with the same loon who designed the sequential turbo control system, the AST, and the IC?

 

I haven't read all of this thread, but I did read up to DamonB and Dale. I am totally in agreement with them. When I upgraded my fuel system to 1600 secondary and 850 primaries I also upgraded the fuel pulsation damper. You can buy an aftermarket one made by marren for around $120. This will eliminate the so called faulty factory PFD.

HERE

 

here ya go http://www.matronics.com/fuelchec/dampener.html

interesting that you don't hear about "fuel pulsation dampners" on anything except these early 90s cars like the Supras and RX-7s

I just sent Aeromotive an email about it, I believe it is integrated into their FPRs, as they don't sell one

these guys aren't too worried about it! http://www.powerhouseracing.com/file...ystem+Upgrades

if you have hard lines, it is likely more of an issue, because there is no "give" in the system....if you have an aftermarket system, the lines should flex enough to take up the minor "water hammer" effect