msilvia

Couple thoughts

- On one hand I think that if these cars were going to start exploding in value they'd have already done so. Look at the Supra for the last 15 years or so. Or the NSX which has been climbing now for a while. FDs seem to be demanding a small premium vs their contenporaries like the 300zx or 3000GT, but not near the level of the Supra.

- On the other hand, like all markets, people don't really know where values are going or they would already have been priced in. Air cooled porsches were relatively cheap for a long time and have exploded only recently, for reasons that are only partly demographic. A big part of it was just that the car caught on in the consciousness of the collector market in a big way, and folks like Singer and Magnus have been moving things along with their own significant PR pushes.

- People are acting on here as though high price is a natural outgrowth of rarity plus good car. I don't think that's always true. Consider the Lotus Esprit, which is a true exotic but sells for not much more than FDs do now. The problem? Everyone agrees it is beautiful, fast, handles well, and has historic value, but it also has a reputation as a bit of a reliability basketcase. Sound familiar?

- On the last point, I think its funny when the rotary fans gleefully warn that LS swapped cars will miss out on the rising values. No. It solves the issues with the car (the way a lot of people see it at least) and even now commands a significant premium. Take a nice high-mileage FD, do a $15k LS swap, or do $15 of single-turbo mods, and for sure you're going to recoup more of that money when you sell the LS vs the rotary. Yes, the sub 30k mi stock cars will keep the highest value, but those are so rare anyway that it's mostly an academic point.

- Finally, we all want to think our cars are desireable and that we got in early on a future classic, but I personally hope this car doesn't go the way of the air-cooled porsches. I plan to keep my car forever, and I want to enjoy it, not worry that i'm devaluing a $100k asset every time the odometer clicks up or I make a modification.

RX7 RAGE

iTrader: (22)

America in general hates the rotary engine.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i recall in about 2001 i was considering selling my FD, and adding in $5-7k to get a Ferrari 308 (and a pair of OP shorts, and a tigers hat). about 15 years ago, the 308 was an 18-26k car, and i guess now they are a 100k car.

the funny part is that i balked on the thing because the 308 is so slow, and the 30,000mile service is $6,000, as the engine needs to come out.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

I bought my FD in Jan 07 for $6k. 140k, Smogged, pretty clean and running fine.
Sure it puffed a little white smoke at start-up and had some key scratches from earlier in it's life, but I haven't even seen a ROLLER for under 7 these days.

Someone left a note on my car offering me 12.5k about a month ago...I just crumpled it up and tossed it. That kinda showed me that my FD is worth over twice what I bought it for..to me anyway.
I gotta admit tho, it crossed my mind to sell it, scrape up a couple grand, and hit up allrotor or Fritz for an under 100k miles car.

When I bought it:
http://www.mazdas247.com/members/Natey/RX-7/FD1.JPG
Now:
http://www.mazdas247.com/members/Nat...mudguards2.jpg

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

here's your flood ?????:??48? ??????GT-R ?????@???.com - ??????????? - ????!

buy it now for $252,263.10

RiceFx306

iTrader: (7)

Like was said earlier clean low mileage stockish examples have gone up. The rest have stayed kind of stagnant for the most part. Then again many of us realize that a low mileage isn't FD isn't necessarily a good one. The parts have continuously gone up in price. Other cars it's being compared to are significant for a number of reasons. Air-cool Porshes. E30 M3s spiked dramatically over the past decade, but is a favorite driver's car of many and is classic BMW with some mechanical simplicity. The NSX sat stagnant for years falling to low 20s and just staying there, and has started to go back up. Supras are an anomaly and probably one of the platforms where you can modify and still get a decent amount of money back out if done professionally. Stock examples though have become rare. The FD is what it is. I think overall it's held it's value well and they make for overpriced shells, but the mostly stock low mileage examples have been enjoying a bump. I will probably be importing an RX7 in the upcoming years. The prices of them are really cheap. A Supra is another viable import. I don't like the RHD, but the bang for the buck is there.

Montego

iTrader: (1)

As I said the gtr is not the only car to import so my point still stands. Sometimes I truly believe that this forum is full of undiagnosed autism cases... That or are you just trying to be difficult? Because at this point its one or the other.

http://www.japan-partner.com/Auto/24872/Nissan/SKYLINE/car-for-sale.html

$43k is not bad for a classic car that was never offered in the states. I would totally buy it if it wasn't rhd.

Or this one 1989 (past the 25 year mark)
http://www.japan-partner.com/Auto/24897/Nissan/SKYLINE/car-for-sale.html

$8k

So again pick any [insert whatever cool car] importable vehicle and show us how they are roaming the streets.

MattGold

iTrader: (109)

If you're buying that Hakosuka - you're a collector and probably wouldn't be turned off by RHD. I know I wouldn't!


...oh, and RB20's don't count!

That's the equivalent of the automatic, non-turbo FD.

Montego

iTrader: (1)

Then where is the influx? I'm turned off by it and so are most otherwise you'd see much more of them.


yes it does count. But again it does not change what I said. People are NOT importing in droves...

dude did you read this:

You get what I am saying... I know that you do. Why you are focusing on insignificant details is beyond me. Hence the autism comment.

MattGold

iTrader: (109)

I just don't think there's a big collectors market in the US for pre 1980s Japanese cars. You see a big of it in SoCal... But people here are sinking their money into old Mustangs, old Cobras, old Porsches and old Italian cars. I just don't think it's a big market period. If I had the money - would I want a old GT-R in the stable? Sure. I'd like a Toyota 2000GT too, but I don't have any illusions that it would happen.

As far as citing a RB20DET as a benchmark for the Skyline market - it just isn't. GT-Rs are desirable... the rest are ho-hum. No one goes out looking for a RB20 or RB25 - they settle for one.

That said, I don't think that in 2017/2018 droves of RHD FDs are going to show up and tank the market... so... I think we agree?

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i'm pretty much agreeing with you. RHD is a big deterrent. the part where we disagree, is choice of a 69 GTR, its a rare car to start with, and as you see the round eye price is a quarter million dollars, so there isn't going to be a flood.

there will be some RHD FD's making it over here, as they are just so much cheaper than a LHD FD its hard to pass up.

you can look at Canada as well, as they were able to bring in FD's a few years ago, and they seem to be quite numerous, but LHD cars are worth more

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Currently nice FDs are selling for 25k and up

That's because you can't find one

Please find one for me

Eventually they will be 30k and up because people want to own it and are willing to pay for it.

Also in 10 years even the rust buckets will be worth a decent amount because of supply and demand

It's one of the best looking cars ever made AND it's fun to drive. It's easy to work on blah blah blah

IT'S A COLLECTORS CAR. No it's not going to compete with 911s but it will continue to go up in value.

I just bought a 996 GT3 and the value of all the water cooled mezger engine p cars is going through the roof as I type

Whitetiger777

iTrader: (1)

I agree with a lot of what some of you have said. Seeing the wonder and awe on peoples faces when you pull into a gas stations and they know what it is makes you believe the car should be worth a lot. However those same people are scared to own this car because of all the rotary horror stories they've heard. Hence why the value of this car is as it is.
On the other hand I sold a 805 hp MKIV Supra about 4 years ago (I know, never should have sold it) for around 28k. Now you can't find a tt 6-speed for less then 33k. This is because that 2zj engine can handle anything and still start reliable every morning. Will all the work I did to mine the only thing that ever broke was the starter. Also it's so easy to get a MIV Supra up over 1000 hp where as the 13B would probably explode at that amount of hp

BryanDowns

iTrader: (2)

Hah, me too. Though I opted for a 996T instead. Sounds like our garages might be similar

Natey

iTrader: (19)

Check out my aunt's car. She bought it new in 1974. I mean, speaking of Porsches that are gaining value..

TRISPEEDFD3S

iTrader: (26)

I miss my FD. I sold my second FD to a guy who made it his fourth FD. I will probably buy my third FD later, if I don't succumb to new technology.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

I think the new technology is what's making all these relative new sports cars fast collectors especially the 996 and 997 GT3s. Enthusiast don't want a sports car with a bunch of bells and whistles/electronic gadgets that drive the car for them.

NICE

Yep currently have 4 FDs and the GT3. One of the 4 though is going to a good home tomorrow

I now have my eye on the GT4

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

my dad, and a couple of his buddies have decided that cars newer than about 2003, get really expensive to buy, but don't actually offer any improvements.

he just bought a 2003 Jaguar XJ8 with 11k miles on the clock. he paid 10K for it. i lack a more modern comparison, but i'm about to sell a 1980 MGB for $5k! the Jag is WAY more car for the $$.

the other reason these things are skyrocketing is because people have money and no place to invest, and old cars have an attractive tax situation compared to most other things.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

stupid me! i mentioned my dads conclusion, without the funny story on the way to the conclusion, which is the best part.

my dad's first encounter with a "new technology" car was a new 2007 Audi A6. the first clue something was wrong was Audi's i drive system. changing the radio station was buried in a submenu somewhere, but changing the time the headlights were on after you've stopped was front page.

the second clue something was amiss was the check engine light. it came on @10k miles, and the dealer reflashed it. it came on again shortly after that, and this time the fix was to take the engine apart and clean it. i will point out that my 1958 Triumph Tr3 has a service interval for the same job, but while the Audi only went 20k before it needs a decarbon, the Triumph's interval was 50k.

the second piece of news was that at 20k miles, its under warranty, but the next time it needs its engine cleaned out, its customer pay. after he got it back, gas mileage dropped by almost 10mpg, so it was very quickly sold.

his next brush with modern automotive technology was a 2009 BMW 5 series. one night in the garage it decided to leave its lights on. think about that for a second. this killed the battery. the BMW has a "smart battery" controller, which is typical of BMW, its smart enough to need an hour of shop labor to program, but not smart enough to cut power and save the battery. battery lists for something like $500, total cost to replace a battery was over $700, not under warranty of course.

the replacement Jaguar, just takes a normal battery, has a normal radio, doesn't need its engine taken apart fortnightly, and it was pennies on the dollar.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

Tell your dad to prepare his anus. Jags are notorious. Beautiful, quick and soo nice inside, but notorious.

Here's the latest from my neck of the woods: My mom's auto-aiming headlights on her 2006 Jag S-Type R started acting weird. After about 1800 dollars of the Jag techs playing grab ***, she just gave it up and drives with her lights aimed directly at the ground in front of her. Not under warranty and they can't fix it even if it was.
She's near 70, lives in the Santa Cruz mountains, has no fkn headlights, and will never buy anything but a Jaguar.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i dunno if thats better of worse than the Porsche guys spending $1800 (under warranty), trying to get the starter motor to operate with the key on a 2003 Boxster....

lOOkatme

iTrader: (19)

I laugh at these last posts because it describes me to the T. I don't like the new cars because they have too much crap on them that can go wrong. I like the mechanical stuff which really needs to go wrong for it not to be usable.

I drive the rx7 and I also drive a stripped down 2005 chevy aveo with literally nothing on it. super cheap.....and the weird part about it is.....I don't mind driving it. I did redo the entire suspension at about 100K, blown shocks, worn out swaybar endlinks, bushings gone, total cost for everything was $200. haha

Narfle

iTrader: (16)

Someone sell me a stock-ish 94+ base/R2 in not-red. Right now.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

This listing is a great example of where things are headed in 5 years. Or even high mileage clean R1/R2s will be 20k plus

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mazda-RX-7-R1-/171736925217?forcerrptr=true&hash=item27fc518421&item=171736925217

Montego

iTrader: (1)

Double post