Bnr twins on stock setup, doable?
02-13-16, 11:07 AM
#1
Bnr twins on stock setup, doable?
My car has 65K miles and well my stock twins are starting to leak bit of oil. Rather then messing with them I was thinking of picking up a set of low mileage or twins, or, or I could slap on some bar's instead. Car is all stock other than a DP. Question is can I run the bnr's on the stock (93) ecu, stock fuel system etc?
I'd be limiting boost of course
I need a new set of twins soon.
FAQ: have you considered going single? Yes, I have and might later on in life but for now I'm convinced the twins are better than sex.
Aren't you wanting more power? Of course we all like power, but I prefer to not have a peaky engine and yes, I know that a well sized single makes more HP at the same psi.
I'd be limiting boost of course
I need a new set of twins soon.
FAQ: have you considered going single? Yes, I have and might later on in life but for now I'm convinced the twins are better than sex.
Aren't you wanting more power? Of course we all like power, but I prefer to not have a peaky engine and yes, I know that a well sized single makes more HP at the same psi.
02-14-16, 07:37 AM
#2
F'n Newbie...
iTrader: (6)
My car has 65K miles and well my stock twins are starting to leak bit of oil. Rather then messing with them I was thinking of picking up a set of low mileage or twins, or, or I could slap on some bar's instead. Car is all stock other than a DP. Question is can I run the bnr's on the stock (93) ecu, stock fuel system etc?
I'd be limiting boost of course
I need a new set of twins soon.
FAQ: have you considered going single? Yes, I have and might later on in life but for now I'm convinced the twins are better than sex.
Aren't you wanting more power? Of course we all like power, but I prefer to not have a peaky engine and yes, I know that a well sized single makes more HP at the same psi.
I'd be limiting boost of course
I need a new set of twins soon.
FAQ: have you considered going single? Yes, I have and might later on in life but for now I'm convinced the twins are better than sex.
Aren't you wanting more power? Of course we all like power, but I prefer to not have a peaky engine and yes, I know that a well sized single makes more HP at the same psi.
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02-16-16, 11:48 AM
#8
Yeah, but a PFC will give you invaluable data via the commander for diagnosis and prolonging engine life. Best mod I've ever done to a car. Well worth the money for a used one.
02-16-16, 06:44 PM
#9
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Depending on your timeframe the cheaper pettit mod might be wiser than doing nothing -- if it's going to be a while you could resell it then perhaps.
And I would ask if I were doing (I do not know the answers):
(1) are bigger wastegates needed? or not?
(2) is an aftermarket blow off valve needed?
Another thought/question has anyone done parallel turbos? i know it's maybe silly but the car came with two turbos and instead of sequential, it would be very simple to set up. given they would be smaller would that help reduce lag? less but some? perhaps just "low yield" economically? i know these are done on some new production cars, but i guess those are V engines and it may be in part for plumbing reasons. but it would keep a bit of the factory look (2 intakes).
02-16-16, 08:33 PM
#10
It don't recommend it, but you can make it work if you limit the boost to 9 or 10 lbs or so. Get a boost and afr gauge. Or just put around until you are able to get a fuel system and real ecu. I do have a group buy on the BNR Stage 3s right now for $1800.
Last edited by IRPerformance; 02-16-16 at 08:37 PM.
02-16-16, 08:39 PM
#11
Original Gangster/Rotary!
iTrader: (213)
The Pettit ecu is like 1996 technology..... The Power FC is worlds better and the commander gives you a lot of flexibility to monitor things like battery voltage, water temps, and knock readings.
02-17-16, 08:13 AM
#12
hi what is an MBC and a BC? is BC 'boost control'? and why would you bypass it?
I have rebuild OE twins and like you rxmiles, i like the wide powerband and it also of course suits the spirit of the car. so i like your concept. i have a PFC and just bought a datalogit (not yet installed!). I don't know much but without an ECU change, I'd want at least a boost gauge and a wideband AF ratio gauge in front of me.
Depending on your timeframe the cheaper pettit mod might be wiser than doing nothing -- if it's going to be a while you could resell it then perhaps.
And I would ask if I were doing (I do not know the answers):
(1) are bigger wastegates needed? or not?
(2) is an aftermarket blow off valve needed?
Another thought/question has anyone done parallel turbos? i know it's maybe silly but the car came with two turbos and instead of sequential, it would be very simple to set up. given they would be smaller would that help reduce lag? less but some? perhaps just "low yield" economically? i know these are done on some new production cars, but i guess those are V engines and it may be in part for plumbing reasons. but it would keep a bit of the factory look (2 intakes).
I have rebuild OE twins and like you rxmiles, i like the wide powerband and it also of course suits the spirit of the car. so i like your concept. i have a PFC and just bought a datalogit (not yet installed!). I don't know much but without an ECU change, I'd want at least a boost gauge and a wideband AF ratio gauge in front of me.
Depending on your timeframe the cheaper pettit mod might be wiser than doing nothing -- if it's going to be a while you could resell it then perhaps.
And I would ask if I were doing (I do not know the answers):
(1) are bigger wastegates needed? or not?
(2) is an aftermarket blow off valve needed?
Another thought/question has anyone done parallel turbos? i know it's maybe silly but the car came with two turbos and instead of sequential, it would be very simple to set up. given they would be smaller would that help reduce lag? less but some? perhaps just "low yield" economically? i know these are done on some new production cars, but i guess those are V engines and it may be in part for plumbing reasons. but it would keep a bit of the factory look (2 intakes).
I don't know enough about the Pettit ECU to say whether it controls solenoid duty cycles or not.
I have a PFC, but I still use dual MBC's because they just work and I am not relying on yet another solenoid.
Yeah, people do non-sequential castrations. Never have, never will.
02-17-16, 01:34 PM
#14
Rotary Enthusiast
hi what is an MBC and a BC? is BC 'boost control'? and why would you bypass it?
I have rebuild OE twins and like you rxmiles, i like the wide powerband and it also of course suits the spirit of the car. so i like your concept. i have a PFC and just bought a datalogit (not yet installed!). I don't know much but without an ECU change, I'd want at least a boost gauge and a wideband AF ratio gauge in front of me.
Depending on your timeframe the cheaper pettit mod might be wiser than doing nothing -- if it's going to be a while you could resell it then perhaps.
And I would ask if I were doing (I do not know the answers):
(1) are bigger wastegates needed? or not?
(2) is an aftermarket blow off valve needed?
Another thought/question has anyone done parallel turbos? i know it's maybe silly but the car came with two turbos and instead of sequential, it would be very simple to set up. given they would be smaller would that help reduce lag? less but some? perhaps just "low yield" economically? i know these are done on some new production cars, but i guess those are V engines and it may be in part for plumbing reasons. but it would keep a bit of the factory look (2 intakes).
I have rebuild OE twins and like you rxmiles, i like the wide powerband and it also of course suits the spirit of the car. so i like your concept. i have a PFC and just bought a datalogit (not yet installed!). I don't know much but without an ECU change, I'd want at least a boost gauge and a wideband AF ratio gauge in front of me.
Depending on your timeframe the cheaper pettit mod might be wiser than doing nothing -- if it's going to be a while you could resell it then perhaps.
And I would ask if I were doing (I do not know the answers):
(1) are bigger wastegates needed? or not?
(2) is an aftermarket blow off valve needed?
Another thought/question has anyone done parallel turbos? i know it's maybe silly but the car came with two turbos and instead of sequential, it would be very simple to set up. given they would be smaller would that help reduce lag? less but some? perhaps just "low yield" economically? i know these are done on some new production cars, but i guess those are V engines and it may be in part for plumbing reasons. but it would keep a bit of the factory look (2 intakes).
2 - no
3 - when the twins are run in parallel, we call that "non-sequential". search non sequential conversion and you will find multiple how-to's, pro's and cons etc etc. In short it increases lag, but reduces complexity. Maximum power potential is slightly more. Many people go non-sequential due to not being able to fix gremlins with their sequential system, or starting with a car that's not complete.
Not many people go from a properly functioning sequential system to a non-seq system.
02-17-16, 01:50 PM
#15
Just want to chime in
I went from Pettit Unlimited to a PFC and the difference was definitely noticeable. Smoother idle, easier starting, easier on the spark plugs and cat, etc. The stock Pettit ECU is 8bit, and the PFC is 16bit.
No BNRs for me, though. Mine are Pettit turbos, which are just stock ones that have been blueprinted, ceramic coated and port n polished.
I went from Pettit Unlimited to a PFC and the difference was definitely noticeable. Smoother idle, easier starting, easier on the spark plugs and cat, etc. The stock Pettit ECU is 8bit, and the PFC is 16bit.
No BNRs for me, though. Mine are Pettit turbos, which are just stock ones that have been blueprinted, ceramic coated and port n polished.
02-18-16, 11:33 AM
#19
02-18-16, 12:36 PM
#20
$2100 retail for bolt on 400hp+ capable turbos is a steal if you ask me. A solid single turbo kit will run you $3000-4000 unless you buy ebay junk. Turbo, manifold, downpipe, oil and coolant lines, hardware, modified intercooler piping, etc. Adds up. I have the BNRs on sale right now for $1800.
02-18-16, 10:28 PM
#21
$2100 retail for bolt on 400hp+ capable turbos is a steal if you ask me. A solid single turbo kit will run you $3000-4000 unless you buy ebay junk. Turbo, manifold, downpipe, oil and coolant lines, hardware, modified intercooler piping, etc. Adds up. I have the BNRs on sale right now for $1800.
02-19-16, 01:53 AM
#22
As you and ihor mentioned when you go single at a bare minimum you need a DP, exhaust manifold, injectors, wastegate, custom piping leading to the IC, an ECU, and an intake. With the BNRs at a bare minimum all you need is an ECU.
02-19-16, 11:46 AM
#24
Actually they are not if you really think about it. New OEM replacements are like $3k and rebuilt ones (at least back in the day) were $1700 (and are worthless). So a set of BNRs are actually cheaper and superior to OEM.
As you and ihor mentioned when you go single at a bare minimum you need a DP, exhaust manifold, injectors, wastegate, custom piping leading to the IC, an ECU, and an intake. With the BNRs at a bare minimum all you need is an ECU.
As you and ihor mentioned when you go single at a bare minimum you need a DP, exhaust manifold, injectors, wastegate, custom piping leading to the IC, an ECU, and an intake. With the BNRs at a bare minimum all you need is an ECU.
02-20-16, 01:21 PM
#25
What are fuel options for a BNR setup if you're retaining emissions? I was thinking of going with a secondary fuel rail + 1680s/2000s or something, but heard there is a fitment issue with the ACV.. putting 850s in the primary or bored out 850s in the secondary good enough? Any issues with the bored injectors (heard maybe they aren't as 'smooth' or something as a modern unit)?