Which is the Best Single Turbo Upgrade for the FD3S?
09-30-02, 02:29 AM
#26
Ghost Ride the Whip
I went with the RX6 because I was afraid of lag, so I was looking for the most lag free turbo on the market. What I got was a turbo with only a little bit of lag more than stock but a lot more high end. However, if I could do it over again I would have gotten a bigger turbo like a T04r or a t04s. Many road racers in japan use the T78 such as the C-west FD. other such as pan speed use a T04S. On the road course you are always in between 5000-8000rpms anyways so you really don't need to fear the lag. If you want to drag race, get the XS t04s kit, if you want to road race you may want to think about putting together your own kit. Lag is overrated especially in road racing. As long as the boost comes in with a smooth delivery and doesn't just kick in really hard and sudden at a certain rpm it is ok
09-30-02, 02:30 AM
#27
The yellow One Lap car was very successful with a T78.
I like single or parallel for road racing because it gets rid of the transition. With the sequential setup, you have to use less throttle coming out of corners sometimes so you don't lose traction and spin when the second turbo hits (yuk).
In my opinion, the only reasons to use bigger twins is to stay sequential or pass the visual SMOG inspection. And I don't think sequential is good for road racing. The SMOG thing is a good reason, but if you don't face that challenge, a single is the best way to go.
I have the RX6 and it works nicely. It takes a good driver to make use of all the power it provides. It it a much faster car than I can really make use of, but I enjoy wrenching on it, too, so I got the single turbo. It is nice to be free of the transition. I think the fact that it is a "dry" turbo might help keep the coolant temps down, too. It doesn't run any hotter at 370 RWHP with the single than it did at 330 RWHP with the twins. And the power is more consistent -- it stays strong longer and it does the same thing every time you hit the gas (the control system never gets confused or sluggish). I did have to replace the wastegate, though, after it started sticking on track days. Even with the sticking wastegate, though, it was still more consistent than the sequential system.
I wouldn't get a HUGE turbo like a T51Kai or the T88, though. They might be too peaky.
-Max
I like single or parallel for road racing because it gets rid of the transition. With the sequential setup, you have to use less throttle coming out of corners sometimes so you don't lose traction and spin when the second turbo hits (yuk).
In my opinion, the only reasons to use bigger twins is to stay sequential or pass the visual SMOG inspection. And I don't think sequential is good for road racing. The SMOG thing is a good reason, but if you don't face that challenge, a single is the best way to go.
I have the RX6 and it works nicely. It takes a good driver to make use of all the power it provides. It it a much faster car than I can really make use of, but I enjoy wrenching on it, too, so I got the single turbo. It is nice to be free of the transition. I think the fact that it is a "dry" turbo might help keep the coolant temps down, too. It doesn't run any hotter at 370 RWHP with the single than it did at 330 RWHP with the twins. And the power is more consistent -- it stays strong longer and it does the same thing every time you hit the gas (the control system never gets confused or sluggish). I did have to replace the wastegate, though, after it started sticking on track days. Even with the sticking wastegate, though, it was still more consistent than the sequential system.
I wouldn't get a HUGE turbo like a T51Kai or the T88, though. They might be too peaky.
-Max
Last edited by maxcooper; 09-30-02 at 02:59 AM.
09-30-02, 04:38 PM
#30
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I like the gt 35/40 setup, nocab posted a pic a while ago that showed the boost gauge and tach boosting 15 psi @ 3500 rpm. The thing has great top end, ihor got 430 rwhp @ 15 psi, but most people think the sweet spot is around 19-20 psi....and if you were running that much boost you would spool even faster, because the wastegate is venting air later.
kyle
kyle
09-30-02, 05:12 PM
#31
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Originally posted by maxcooper
The yellow One Lap car was very successful with a T78.
I like single or parallel for road racing because it gets rid of the transition. With the sequential setup, you have to use less throttle coming out of corners sometimes so you don't lose traction and spin when the second turbo hits (yuk).
In my opinion, the only reasons to use bigger twins is to stay sequential or pass the visual SMOG inspection. And I don't think sequential is good for road racing. The SMOG thing is a good reason, but if you don't face that challenge, a single is the best way to go.
I have the RX6 and it works nicely. It takes a good driver to make use of all the power it provides. It it a much faster car than I can really make use of, but I enjoy wrenching on it, too, so I got the single turbo. It is nice to be free of the transition. I think the fact that it is a "dry" turbo might help keep the coolant temps down, too. It doesn't run any hotter at 370 RWHP with the single than it did at 330 RWHP with the twins. And the power is more consistent -- it stays strong longer and it does the same thing every time you hit the gas (the control system never gets confused or sluggish). I did have to replace the wastegate, though, after it started sticking on track days. Even with the sticking wastegate, though, it was still more consistent than the sequential system.
I wouldn't get a HUGE turbo like a T51Kai or the T88, though. They might be too peaky.
-Max
The yellow One Lap car was very successful with a T78.
I like single or parallel for road racing because it gets rid of the transition. With the sequential setup, you have to use less throttle coming out of corners sometimes so you don't lose traction and spin when the second turbo hits (yuk).
In my opinion, the only reasons to use bigger twins is to stay sequential or pass the visual SMOG inspection. And I don't think sequential is good for road racing. The SMOG thing is a good reason, but if you don't face that challenge, a single is the best way to go.
I have the RX6 and it works nicely. It takes a good driver to make use of all the power it provides. It it a much faster car than I can really make use of, but I enjoy wrenching on it, too, so I got the single turbo. It is nice to be free of the transition. I think the fact that it is a "dry" turbo might help keep the coolant temps down, too. It doesn't run any hotter at 370 RWHP with the single than it did at 330 RWHP with the twins. And the power is more consistent -- it stays strong longer and it does the same thing every time you hit the gas (the control system never gets confused or sluggish). I did have to replace the wastegate, though, after it started sticking on track days. Even with the sticking wastegate, though, it was still more consistent than the sequential system.
I wouldn't get a HUGE turbo like a T51Kai or the T88, though. They might be too peaky.
-Max
The One Lap car (Rick Potter) has a 60-1 p-trim...
09-30-02, 05:45 PM
#32
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Originally posted by ttpowerd
How come no one mentioned the gt 35/40? Is this not the turbo to go with? Is the T04S ball bearing?
How come no one mentioned the gt 35/40? Is this not the turbo to go with? Is the T04S ball bearing?
The T-04s is NOT ball bearing. I've heard comparisons between the two(flow charts) and from previous discussions, the 35/40 is essentially a t-04S ball bearing.
10-02-02, 01:59 AM
#35
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If you want a car not for 1/4 and more for twisties I would consider following the route Max took.. The Rx6 is a great turbo and though you won't get the huge HP bragging rights....hey that's more for 1/4 racing anyways.
I ran a XS T04S kit daily driven and had no problems. There was very little lag though at times i wish i had quicker spoolup.
If you can afford it you can try to go with a BB turbo...As far as kits I know for a fact the HKS does not sell any kits for the FD that utilize their GT turbos.
In Japan they do run HKS GT turbos but those are custom kits. And hell if you have the money you could always try to build one. GT3240 is almost like a bb TO4R and the GT3037 is awsome also.
I almost forgot that a T04E would be a great turbo for your needs...out that on to a well built motor and you have a great responsive car.
Chris
I ran a XS T04S kit daily driven and had no problems. There was very little lag though at times i wish i had quicker spoolup.
If you can afford it you can try to go with a BB turbo...As far as kits I know for a fact the HKS does not sell any kits for the FD that utilize their GT turbos.
In Japan they do run HKS GT turbos but those are custom kits. And hell if you have the money you could always try to build one. GT3240 is almost like a bb TO4R and the GT3037 is awsome also.
I almost forgot that a T04E would be a great turbo for your needs...out that on to a well built motor and you have a great responsive car.
Chris
10-02-02, 03:59 AM
#36
Originally posted by forcefed7
The One Lap car (Rick Potter) has a 60-1 p-trim...
The One Lap car (Rick Potter) has a 60-1 p-trim...
-Max
02-12-13, 05:42 AM
#37
Work in Progress
Hi Guys,
I was pretty down today to find out the following from my local mechanic.
Even though i have read people reaching >330bhp on stock twins, he has said there is no way mine could achieve that.
I have the standard mods, FMI, CB, Power FC, it makes a modest 270hp, last time i was in he saif the only restriction now was fuel.
So i took it in and requested fuel pump upgrade and injectors, he now says there is no point and that if want more the 270 i need to go single....
So pretty annoyed at that im looking for a turbo to suit my needs, or a new mechanic, but there is none where i live.
What would be a good turbo for 400+hp and quick spooling? more importantly a good kit that is an easy install.
Thanks guys
I was pretty down today to find out the following from my local mechanic.
Even though i have read people reaching >330bhp on stock twins, he has said there is no way mine could achieve that.
I have the standard mods, FMI, CB, Power FC, it makes a modest 270hp, last time i was in he saif the only restriction now was fuel.
So i took it in and requested fuel pump upgrade and injectors, he now says there is no point and that if want more the 270 i need to go single....
So pretty annoyed at that im looking for a turbo to suit my needs, or a new mechanic, but there is none where i live.
What would be a good turbo for 400+hp and quick spooling? more importantly a good kit that is an easy install.
Thanks guys
02-12-13, 09:17 AM
#41
Hi Guys,
I was pretty down today to find out the following from my local mechanic.
Even though i have read people reaching >330bhp on stock twins, he has said there is no way mine could achieve that.
I have the standard mods, FMI, CB, Power FC, it makes a modest 270hp, last time i was in he saif the only restriction now was fuel.
So i took it in and requested fuel pump upgrade and injectors, he now says there is no point and that if want more the 270 i need to go single....
So pretty annoyed at that im looking for a turbo to suit my needs, or a new mechanic, but there is none where i live.
What would be a good turbo for 400+hp and quick spooling? more importantly a good kit that is an easy install.
Thanks guys
I was pretty down today to find out the following from my local mechanic.
Even though i have read people reaching >330bhp on stock twins, he has said there is no way mine could achieve that.
I have the standard mods, FMI, CB, Power FC, it makes a modest 270hp, last time i was in he saif the only restriction now was fuel.
So i took it in and requested fuel pump upgrade and injectors, he now says there is no point and that if want more the 270 i need to go single....
So pretty annoyed at that im looking for a turbo to suit my needs, or a new mechanic, but there is none where i live.
What would be a good turbo for 400+hp and quick spooling? more importantly a good kit that is an easy install.
Thanks guys
02-12-13, 09:31 AM
#42
Staying sequential, BNR Stage 3's can get you close to 400whp.
If you have no attachment to the sequentials (I do have a strange attachment to them) then go single. The next thing to do is pick a turbo that will not be too big or too small for your goals. I always laugh when you see someone with a t88 and then they say "I'm running 8 lbs of boost and it spools at 5000 rpm". Good sign they didn't need that size of a turbo.
If you have no attachment to the sequentials (I do have a strange attachment to them) then go single. The next thing to do is pick a turbo that will not be too big or too small for your goals. I always laugh when you see someone with a t88 and then they say "I'm running 8 lbs of boost and it spools at 5000 rpm". Good sign they didn't need that size of a turbo.
02-12-13, 03:38 PM
#43
Work in Progress
I have pretty much all your standard mods, Front mount intercooler, Greddy intake elbow, Exhaust system (No CAT) and Power FC.
Originally he said the only restriction for me was fuel, so that's when i decided fuel pump and injectors where the next thing on the cards for me. but now he has changed his tune.
It ruined my day when i dropped it off
Originally he said the only restriction for me was fuel, so that's when i decided fuel pump and injectors where the next thing on the cards for me. but now he has changed his tune.
It ruined my day when i dropped it off
02-12-13, 03:40 PM
#44
Work in Progress
I have looked into BNR Stage 3's, unfortunately the owner before me totally gutted the sequential setup so single would make more sense, well to me it sounds like the preferred step, however i don't believe any turbo change is required at the moment.
02-13-13, 05:14 AM
#45
Work in Progress
Ok, more to the story, i phoned another garage in the city and discussed my circumstances, first thing he said is the garage i go to uses a dynamics dyno bed which apparently reads low results, as much -12% then other dyno beds.
Any how he also said that even with fuel pump and injectors i wouldnt see a improvement worth while, so im going to go single and attempt the install myself.
I am deciding between the T04Z or the GT35R, can you guys list the pro's and con's between them?..
Any how he also said that even with fuel pump and injectors i wouldnt see a improvement worth while, so im going to go single and attempt the install myself.
I am deciding between the T04Z or the GT35R, can you guys list the pro's and con's between them?..
02-13-13, 11:03 AM
#46
Very different turbos-
T04Z is a well sized turbo for the rotary for a broad powerband *at the track*. Many Japanese time attack cars use this turbo with street port to semi-peripheral port set ups. It will feel a little lazy on the street.
GT35R is about the smallest single turbo you would bother replacing the stock twins with. Very good powerband for the street, but will require higher boost levels to make more power than the stock turbos power potential. Different specs (T3/T4 exhaust housings) are available for this turbo and will effect its performance greatly on a rotary.
What boost levels are you planning on running? Pump gas or race gas? Use on the street or track?
T04Z is a well sized turbo for the rotary for a broad powerband *at the track*. Many Japanese time attack cars use this turbo with street port to semi-peripheral port set ups. It will feel a little lazy on the street.
GT35R is about the smallest single turbo you would bother replacing the stock twins with. Very good powerband for the street, but will require higher boost levels to make more power than the stock turbos power potential. Different specs (T3/T4 exhaust housings) are available for this turbo and will effect its performance greatly on a rotary.
What boost levels are you planning on running? Pump gas or race gas? Use on the street or track?
02-13-13, 12:40 PM
#48
Very different turbos-
T04Z is a well sized turbo for the rotary for a broad powerband *at the track*. Many Japanese time attack cars use this turbo with street port to semi-peripheral port set ups. It will feel a little lazy on the street.
GT35R is about the smallest single turbo you would bother replacing the stock twins with. Very good powerband for the street, but will require higher boost levels to make more power than the stock turbos power potential. Different specs (T3/T4 exhaust housings) are available for this turbo and will effect its performance greatly on a rotary.
What boost levels are you planning on running? Pump gas or race gas? Use on the street or track?
T04Z is a well sized turbo for the rotary for a broad powerband *at the track*. Many Japanese time attack cars use this turbo with street port to semi-peripheral port set ups. It will feel a little lazy on the street.
GT35R is about the smallest single turbo you would bother replacing the stock twins with. Very good powerband for the street, but will require higher boost levels to make more power than the stock turbos power potential. Different specs (T3/T4 exhaust housings) are available for this turbo and will effect its performance greatly on a rotary.
What boost levels are you planning on running? Pump gas or race gas? Use on the street or track?
02-13-13, 01:51 PM
#49
The T04E compressor cover is smaller than GT35R compressor cover.
The biggest GT3582R has 56mm/82mm compressor wheel and 68mm exhaust wheel.
The biggest T04E 60rim has 58mm/75mm compressor wheel and 74mm (P trim) exhaust wheel.
So its up to you which you call larger.
The main thing is the old T04 turbos are more efficient at lower pressure ratios and the newer GT line more efficient at higher pressure ratios.
The old T04E or T04B 60 trim turbos are still a great turbo for 400RWHP at 14psi boost, but the newer GT line will make more power at higher boost levels.
The biggest GT3582R has 56mm/82mm compressor wheel and 68mm exhaust wheel.
The biggest T04E 60rim has 58mm/75mm compressor wheel and 74mm (P trim) exhaust wheel.
So its up to you which you call larger.
The main thing is the old T04 turbos are more efficient at lower pressure ratios and the newer GT line more efficient at higher pressure ratios.
The old T04E or T04B 60 trim turbos are still a great turbo for 400RWHP at 14psi boost, but the newer GT line will make more power at higher boost levels.
02-13-13, 03:25 PM
#50
Original Gangster/Rotary!
iTrader: (213)
Garrett GT35R has a 61.4mm compressor inducer..... it also will definitely make more power than stock twins for a given boost level. I think you're selling it a little short 