FD from R1

for how long? how has it worked for you? http://www.carcarepros.com/CarCarePr...terWetter.html

it's just a simple corrosion inhibitor from what I understand, others have said you need commercial glycol antifreeze to lubricate the water pump

ManGaZeRo

iTrader: (1)

How much do we need of it if we are running 65 water 35 coolant or do we include the amount like it is water?

FD from R1

you don't use it if you are running 50% glycol

Savington

Look up "Project M3" on europeancarweb.com, European Car Magazine's website. Pablo Mazlumian, the author and owner of that car, uses it and I think he likes it. You don't use it if you are running antifreeze, however; it's mixed with distilled or tap water.

Assud

I run about 70/30 water/antifreeze with 1 bottle of water wetter.

ManGaZeRo

iTrader: (1)

The water wetter will still give me some cooling effect even if I use some antifreeze right?

SpeedKing

iTrader: (4)

Water Wetter is bullshit. Just do the fan mod or install a Miata Thermoswitch and forget about it.

tt2323

I am currently running water wetter. Its made to add to your coolant/distilled water mix. DO NOT use just water and water wetter

scratchjunkie

just like an aftermarket radiator, you wouldnt be able to tell your running water wetter .

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

I have a stock rad and I started using WW recently. I see no change in average or peak temps.

mad_7tist

it's not about average or peaks but the reaction time. ww will respond to cooling faster. in my observations.

Rhode_Dog

Didn't someone a while back make a lot of noise about water wettter being bad for the seals.

macdaddy

I have no experience with water wetter vs. glycol in my FD, yet, but I do in other cars. I (and many racers) run water and water wetter without glycol. NASA doesn't even allow glycol at its events (spilled coolant is slippery enough - with glycol it's even worse.) Glycol raises the boiling point and lowers the freezing point. Though you certainly don't want localized boiling within your cooling system, you can raise the boiling point with pressure, as well - that's why you've got a pressurized cooling system. The freezing point is only an issue if ambient temps get below freezing where you store your car. I don't know if it's viscosity, or heat exchange, or both, but 50/50 water/glycol don't cool as well as plain water - both my Spec Miata and my 66 Mustang run 5-15 degrees cooler with water/water wetter than they do with 50/50 water/glycol. I don't know if I believe the Redline ads about improved heat transfer with water wetter - I use it for lubrication and corrosion inhibition when I'm running without glycol. (I use 50/50 water/glycol over the winter.) I think the proper comparison is not 50/50 water/glycol with and without ww, but water/ww vs. 50/50 water/glycol. I don't see any point in running water wetter if you are running any significant amount of glycol in your coolant - the commercial antifreezes have plenty of lubrication, corrosion inhibitors, etc.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

I've been thinking about this ever since you posted it. Based on my understanding of heat transfer, fluid dynamics, etc I can't see this being true.

And yes, it is about the peaks - that's where your engine will tend to warp, and the average has a lot to do with engine life. Ideally the engine and coolant temps are rock steady all the time.

Dave

alberto_mg

do a search on water wetter and you will see just how many people here use it. especially a lot of track guys.

Savington

It says on the bottle not to use it if you're using glycol. =P

FD from R1

I've been thinking about this ever since you posted it. Based on my understanding of heat transfer, fluid dynamics, etc I can't see this being true

glycol is 5-10% less efficient than water in transferring heat

couple of interesting links

http://www.raypak.com/afreeze.htm
http://www.jcna.com/library/tech/tech0011.html

mad_7tist

dave, yea the peaks matter when you are look at a specific hot spot. but "our" , rx owners, numbers are from a t-stat controlled spot. i have timed my car at idle let it get to 100c hit the fan mod and timed the cool down to 90c. this was right before a coolant change so it seemed like a good idea. i replaced the coolant put in the ww and it was faster to cool. it changes the surface tension of the coolant and its ability to transfer heat. i will have to look for the actual times soeveryone wont tell me i dont know what i am talking about it's in the car book

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

OK, I see what you mean by 'faster to respond' (responding to turning on the fans). That's a clever way to measure if it's working any better than original.

Dave

fdeeznutz

Or do it the right way and buy a PFC. Then you don't have to dick around with fan switches

macdaddy

From the Mazdaspeed Tech site (see last paragraph on "fluid"):
Cooling
See Pulleys - Water Pump - Radiator - RX7's - Pressure - Fluid
A common problem with the rotary engine when used in sustained, high rpm use (road racing) is that of overheating. The following recommended modifications are intended for racing use ONLY. Unfortunately, a single modification usually will not solve an overheating problem. It generally takes a few (if not all) modifications to solve a serious overheating problem, depending on the conditions (temperature, etc.) you race under.

Pulleys
Changing to competition drive and water pump pulleys will significantly reduce, if not eliminate, water pump cavitation. Water pump cavitation on a rotary engine (with stock pulleys) is unavoidable at rpms above 6500-7000 and is a significant contributor to engine overheating. Cavitation is defined as a disruption of the water/coolant flow through the water pump. It is created when the water pump impeller spins at such a high speed that it is actually churning instead of pushing the coolant through the pump. Changing to a larger water pump pulley and a smaller drive pulley, allows the water pump to spin at lower rpms, effectively transporting the fluid through the pump.
NOTE: An alternate size alternator pulley is available that reduces the speed at which your alternator spins, providing longer alternator life.


Water Pump
Water Pump/Thermostat
If you are using a stock (cast-iron) water pump, we recommend "gutting" the stock thermostat, leaving just the thermostat casing. Because some "restriction" is helpful, generally removing the thermostat is not as effective as using a gutted thermostat or restrictor. It is also important to plug the thermostat housing's water bypass. This can be done very easily by tapping the hole (1/2" pipe tap) and installing a plug.

Radiator
In general, we have found that for road racing, rotaries need a heavy duty radiator and oil cooler to improve engine cooling. We offer competition aluminum radiators, heavy duty oil coolers and water/oil heat exchangers for rotary applications.
A water/oil heat exchanger can be used with, or in place of an oil cooler. They are very effective in bringing down oil temperatures.


RX7's
The oil cooler on these RX7s is mounted under the oil filter. It should not be used for competition purposes. Early model (1979-82 RX7s) use a shorter radiator than the 1983-1985 RX7s that allows room for the oil cooler to be mounted underneath. Although an oil cooler can be mounted in front of the 1983-1985 RX7 full length radiator this set-up seems to significantly restrict air flow to the radiator, which can cause overheating.

Pressure
Increasing the cooling system pressure by changing the cap will raise the boiling point of the fluid and will also keep the fluid from being expelled into the overflow tank. We recommend use of a radiator cap with a pressure rating no higher than 17-18 lbs.

Fluid
We recommend using a 90% water to 10% glycol mix. Water has superior heat transfer properties (2-1/2 times better) than glycol-based coolant products. Using distilled or purified water will reduce scale build-up.
It's important to remember to change back to a 50/50 water/glycol mix when storing the car, especially if you live in severe winter climates.

gnx7

iTrader: (10)

you guys should also give RMI-25 a try. Distilled water with a bottle of this stuff is supposed to work great. Buick GN's with front mount intercoolers in the AZ heat use this with great success. I know a few people that use it and they have no complaints.... noticeable temperature difference.

http://arizonagn.com/cooling_systems.htm

technical info:


http://arizonagn.com/how_to.htm

Hope that helps some!

-Mark

ichibandan

iTrader: (1)

If you're serious about coolant, you can convert from the coolant/water/ww/whatever combo that you currenly have circulating to NPG instead. http://www.evanscooling.com has more info on it. Basically it's a non-water-based coolant, so you'll need to flush out everything from your current system to replace with NPG.