CantGoStraight

The temperature gauge at normal position does NOT mean the car is fully warmed up. There is a large temperature swing from cold to over heated (where the temperature gauge will remain in the normal position) without moving. If you had an aftermarket gauge to compare with the stock one you would see this.

wolfman

iTrader: (2)

You make an interesting point about the oil pressure recommendation. I'm guessing you're referring to the owner's manual? I'll have to look at mine now.

I typically warm mine up about 30secs to a minute then drive about 5-10 minutes keeping the rpms & boost low. Luckily mine drives about the same when it's still cold with the exception that the 3k rpm hesitation is more prevalent at lower temps. I have not yet fixed the 3k rpm problem, but other than that no problems.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

No, im referring to the general sense of engines.

IIRC, all oil pressure readings will be different according to car. If you have a stock oil pressure gauge, all you have to do is look up in your manual and see where is operating reading for you to start driving. Usually theres 4 ticks all together. Between the 1 and 2, is where you would be at at idle when oil pressure is normal. Between 2 and 3 is where it would be at when you first start the car (or accelerating). And at 4 is at highest, something they caution you to look for.

Usually if you run a thicker oil, it will take UPON start up, for your engine to build oil pressure. THIS IS THE TIME where you REALLY need to let the car idle a bit. Especially if you are in colder climates.

If your oil pressure is on a constant low, or below normal, it might be smart to switch to a thicker oil.

moconnor

iTrader: (14)

Every single car user manual that I have looked at suggests starting the car and driving it. I challenge anyone to find a manual anywhere that suggests waiting for the car to warm up or waiting for some period of time. The time taken to clip on the seat belt should be about right.

TheWoganSleeve

As soon as my car starts i bounce it off the rev limiter for ten minutes before i set off. This works well especially well when its a cold morning -02 degrees. Gets rid of all the cobwebs/ sludge and condensation that has built up over night.

Whatever doesnt kill the engine can only make it stronger.... right?

latinFD

iTrader: (5)

30sec to 1min for me then drive off-boost until i see 80c on the pfc

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Of course it will tell you that, they dont unnecessary pollution.

But if you look up oil pressure, they contradict themselves.

Your oil level should be at "X" which is operating level. Well how can it be there if i dont let it idle? Sure it will get there after a while on its own but how safe is it driving with the oil pressure that high?

Honestly, this is a never ending discussion. People have different ways of operating their car. There is NO right or wrong.

I know my car runs better if i let it idle a bit. The car accelerates more smooth, and so does the tranny (when normal driving).

This goes for everything mechanical. **** the forklift at my friends shop doesnt move until you let it run for 5 minutes. IF you start and go, you can have your foot planted on the throttle and it goes nowhere, all it does is make noise.

moconnor

iTrader: (14)

Since most cars made in the last decade don't even have a true analog oil pressure gauge, I'm not sure how this could be true. Even my 1995 Miata has a 'gauge' that has only two real states: off and on.

Engine internals almost never fail on (stock) modern cars (we will ignore FDs ) so I suspect that short of redlining your car on startup it barely matters what you do. However, there are better ways of passing time.

jdhuegel1

When I FIRST bought my car, I took it to Peter Ferell to look at before driving it across country. It sat in the parkinglot for a few hours while he showed me around and helped a few customers. He took the keys, started the car, revved it a few times and tore off sideways through the lot. It was 35degrees out.

I never had any issues until I started modding the car. I did drive it relatively easily until warm, but other than that I beat the **** out of it.

I also run the absolute cheapest 10W 30 I can find. Just as Peter told me was fine to do.

It's not a BAD thing to be careful, but it's not needed.

I think break-in is somewhat extensive here too - although I assume mainly for warranty reasons - but that's a WHOLE other discussion.

kaisar1

that could be a faulty guage.

and why would a car manufacturer like Mazda would install a temp guage that will show false reading i-e as you said show normal temp while motor is toasted?

mrb63083

iTrader: (4)

In the winter I'll get it started and go back inside and finish up the rest of my morning routine. Letting it idle down and running at safe operating temps.

In the summer it does not seem to take as long, I'll just get ready and go start it up and wait in the car listening to some music until it idle's down.

DaveW

Mazda, and most other manufacturers, do that so that drivers/owners do not get upset when seeing "normal" temperature variations. Unfortunately this leads to repeated mild overheating and repeated driving the car hard before it is properly warmed up.

The attached chart shows what the stock FD gauge really means, along with what linearized (requires some modification and additional wiring) stock gauges will show.

In other words, the stock gauge shows the same mid-range temperature reading all the way from ~65C to 90C.

moconnor

iTrader: (14)

Most modern stock automotive gauges have three states: off, normal, and you're screwed. Or for the FD coolant gauge: off, normal, rebuild.

DaveW

Hyperbole is allowed!

Dave

arghx

iTrader: (3)

.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Same with me.

I make sure i have to do something while the car is warming up so i wont wait anxiously to leave.

If im driving the FD, i start it immediately and it let idle, then fully take off the cover, fold it, put it away, clean windows if i have to, walk 70 feet to open my gate etc etc lol.

For my DD which is an 06, i know it doesnt need all that fancy attention since its still a new car but i still let it warm up, maybe not as long as the FD but i still let it idle. I think one time when i was in a rush to leave my house, i let it idle for about 40 seconds and i left. Car ran like ****.

moconnor

iTrader: (14)

Then there is something wrong with the car. Of the ten or so cars I have owned, only one behaved like this - and it was a 150k miles beater that I was driving into the ground; I'm not sure if I ever even replaced the spark plugs on that thing.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Nope, def nothing wrong with the car, it only has 17k miles on it.

When i say run like ****, i dont mean sputtering, poor idle etc etc. I mean when i accelerate, you can hear metal to metal contact, i dont know what that is. Then the tranny obviously didnt shift smooth. Felt like the car was having a hard time revving.

I can understand, it was 38 degrees that morning and i let it idle for 40 seconds.

All the other times i have warmed it up, i never had that problem. It sounded quiet as all hell, accelerated and shifted smooth. Like it just rolled off the showroom floor.

Anyway, this thread isnt about whos right or wrong, the question of the thread was is 3 min long enough.

I say sure, but i do at least 5, depend on extreme coldness.

4CN A1R

iTrader: (6)

i just drive away and stay off boost for about 2 min

t-von

iTrader: (8)

All this means is your car was in terrible running condition to begin. My fd lasted over 108k with it's original engine and never had these kinds of problems. Hell I let my car sit up for 3 months in winter and tried to intentionally flood it by starting it repeatedly 5 times in less than 2mins in 40degree weather. It fired up every time...no hesitation....no flooding.... no nothing. If you cant treat your car like any other normal car, then you have problems.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Why would you intentionally flood your car?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

You wouldn't need proof if you understood how thermally inefficient rotary's are in fully burning the fuel/air mixture. The proof is how much more carbon your engine builds at low rpms and low temperatures. Cold starts dump extra fuel into the combustion chamber. All the fuel doesn't burn off. Heavy carbon deposits "WILL" be left behind. The key to fighting carbon in rotary's is warming up the engine AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. You do that by driving it. Here's a test for you, go warm up your car while letting it idle, then once you are certain it's safe to drive, red line it and watch the wonderful black cloud of smoke exit your tail pipe. That my firiend is carbon. I guarantee you if you do this everyday, you will have a same cloud of black smoke exit your tail pipe. Now if you go out and start the car and drive it(like your suppose to). Redline it when it's warmed up and you will get far less black smoke out the tail pipe.

That my friend is a real world test and comming somesome who had an orginal engine last over 100k.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Perfect example! If you had any ideal how much more carbon builds in rotary's, you wouldn't let it idle at all. Carbon deposits don't effect piston engines like they do rotary's. You can let a piston engine idle all day long and have really no ill effects. Doing this to a rotary is the start of a slow death sentence. You foul your plugs sooner which leads to ignition breakup, poor fuel economy, hesitation, and overall shitty performance. Plus you also have the increased tendency to flood the engine once this built up carbon deposits starts effecting your compression. That's your long term effects. I've owned far too many generations of rotary powered cars to know these facts.

Anyway it's your car, do what you want. I'm telling you and everyone on this thread that it's better for the rotary engine to be driven and warmed up normally. You need the heat generated to help keep the engine cleaner.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

To prove that a well maintained rotary wont flood it properly maintained.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Very interesting but let me ask you something.

Ok now i understand and it make sense that carbon buildup will be severe for a person who just warms up their car (rx7, rotary whatever) during the winter since thats what they feel they need to do to get through the winter.

Now you say carbon buildup "WILL" be left behind. ANd you need to drive it to prevent that.

So when you're driving it after the little extra time of warming it up wont take away some of that carbon?? I would assume so, your driving it. The car was continously on, like you said, heat plays a part here.

When you're driving it, rpm's vary. I dont see what difference does it make between 30 seconds upon initial startup and 3-5 minutes.

And IIRC, all cars run rich upon initial startup/cold startup.