1,500 miles on my LS1 powered '93 RX7
#76
Pilots are hot!
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Originally posted by stokedxiv
really this is exactly how i feel about it, after reading Jimlab's thread i was very accepting of the LS1 in the FD, but this thread now is kind of starting to frighten me... i'm afraid that in 3 years when someone comes to this forum and asks a question about the 13B everyone will respond like "well if you were smart and did the LS1 conversion like everyone else... blah blah..." and i dont think that this is really what this board is all about. i guess i'm just afraid of this idea catching on, and i mean really really catching on... with these guys in this thread offering their 13B engine for sale on the spot, it does upset me just a little to see so many people "giving up" on the rotary just because something easier came along... but i guess thats just me... or does anyone else feel this way too? i hope i'm not alone and that the 13B will not soon be a thing of the past in the FD
really this is exactly how i feel about it, after reading Jimlab's thread i was very accepting of the LS1 in the FD, but this thread now is kind of starting to frighten me... i'm afraid that in 3 years when someone comes to this forum and asks a question about the 13B everyone will respond like "well if you were smart and did the LS1 conversion like everyone else... blah blah..." and i dont think that this is really what this board is all about. i guess i'm just afraid of this idea catching on, and i mean really really catching on... with these guys in this thread offering their 13B engine for sale on the spot, it does upset me just a little to see so many people "giving up" on the rotary just because something easier came along... but i guess thats just me... or does anyone else feel this way too? i hope i'm not alone and that the 13B will not soon be a thing of the past in the FD
i feel exactly the same. dont get me wrong the conversion is amazing and i cant believe how inexpensive it is, but i dont think i could ever get used to an fd sounding a v8. i definatly perfer the sound of the rotary over a v8 anyday. that sound, imo, doesnt fit the look of the rx7.
#77
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Originally posted by pomanferrari
I'm seriously thinking about doing an LS1 conversion myself: tired of coolant buzzer, the heart stopping feeling every time I see a puddle on the ground and the heat related fatigue on hoses, the 2 gears downshift (5th to 3rd) just so I can eat up a Cobra feeling ...
I'm seriously thinking about doing an LS1 conversion myself: tired of coolant buzzer, the heart stopping feeling every time I see a puddle on the ground and the heat related fatigue on hoses, the 2 gears downshift (5th to 3rd) just so I can eat up a Cobra feeling ...
I dont understand your comment about not liking to shift from 5th to 3rd to eat up a Cobra since its a 2 gear downshift.
Do you think making a 3gear downshift with a 6 speed would be better??? The only thing you get with a 6 speed is an extra overdrive to help with fuel economy on the street.
Why would you rather drop down 3 gears than 2?????
I dont get it???
STEPHEN
#78
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Also, whats the big deal with running 11's??? You can run 11's with the stock engine and turbos much cheaper than doing a LS1 conversion. The difference I see is that with all the low end tq your V8 is going to spin like mad on the street so I'd imagine a mid 11 sec rotary powered car would eat up a mid 11 sec LS1 on the street. Gobs of tq make it hard to gun it from a street light.
Also, the main downfall to the rotary is tuning, with SOOO many people now having single turbos and standalong computers tuning has come A LONG way in the past year or so. Hell, everyday people are advancing further and further with the rotary tuning. I would much rather see a shop with a mobile dyno and a expert rotary tuner than a shop for V8 conversions because no one has the drive to learn how to tune a rotary. ErnieT just ran 10's on a BONE STOCK MAZDA REMAN WITH NO PROBS.
Done get me wrong, I'm a fan of business and development and everyone has the right to do what ever they want to thier cars and I totally respect that. It just seems like a step back to the people that care about learning the rotary and how to tune it.
STEPHEN
Also, the main downfall to the rotary is tuning, with SOOO many people now having single turbos and standalong computers tuning has come A LONG way in the past year or so. Hell, everyday people are advancing further and further with the rotary tuning. I would much rather see a shop with a mobile dyno and a expert rotary tuner than a shop for V8 conversions because no one has the drive to learn how to tune a rotary. ErnieT just ran 10's on a BONE STOCK MAZDA REMAN WITH NO PROBS.
Done get me wrong, I'm a fan of business and development and everyone has the right to do what ever they want to thier cars and I totally respect that. It just seems like a step back to the people that care about learning the rotary and how to tune it.
STEPHEN
#79
Originally posted by SPOautos
Also, whats the big deal with running 11's??? You can run 11's with the stock engine and turbos much cheaper than doing a LS1 conversion. The difference I see is that with all the low end tq your V8 is going to spin like mad on the street so I'd imagine a mid 11 sec rotary powered car would eat up a mid 11 sec LS1 on the street. Gobs of tq make it hard to gun it from a street light.
Also, whats the big deal with running 11's??? You can run 11's with the stock engine and turbos much cheaper than doing a LS1 conversion. The difference I see is that with all the low end tq your V8 is going to spin like mad on the street so I'd imagine a mid 11 sec rotary powered car would eat up a mid 11 sec LS1 on the street. Gobs of tq make it hard to gun it from a street light.
Oh yeah, you won't "spin like mad" if you know how to control your torque. Of course if you spin your tires, you're gonna let off the throttle not give it more
#81
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Originally posted by RedTT
Hum... I don't know about that. With all that low end torque you don't have to have a perfect launch to win a race. Imagine a 5mph roll. A rotary will have a hell of a time trying to play catch up when the V8 has a huge jump on you. Turbo lag is a bitch!!
Oh yeah, you won't "spin like mad" if you know how to control your torque. Of course if you spin your tires, you're gonna let off the throttle not give it more
Hum... I don't know about that. With all that low end torque you don't have to have a perfect launch to win a race. Imagine a 5mph roll. A rotary will have a hell of a time trying to play catch up when the V8 has a huge jump on you. Turbo lag is a bitch!!
Oh yeah, you won't "spin like mad" if you know how to control your torque. Of course if you spin your tires, you're gonna let off the throttle not give it more
RIGHT!!!!! and it is hard to accelerate fast when your getting off the throttle
FOR ME, its much easier to launch at a little higher rpm so I have less tq but since its at a higher rpm it creates more hp which means more accelleration.
Tq doesnt make your car fast, the frequency of tq makes it fast which means 250lbs of tq at 5000rpms will make a lot more acceleration than 500lbs of tq at 2000 rpms......EVENTHOUGH the 500 at 2000rpms will shred your tires all day long.
STEPHEN
Last edited by SPOautos; 12-05-02 at 10:37 AM.
#82
i like rotors
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Originally posted by Snook
to all you chevy fans:
send me info about your rotaries for sale
to all you chevy fans:
send me info about your rotaries for sale
#83
apeiron
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Anyone want my 13b?
Ive recently saved up enough money to get a new engine and a single turbo conv. Now that this v8 swap into 7 idea has been brought to my attention I am VERY interested.
I will sacrafice the weight factor for a NA 350+ horsepower engine. I love turbos but NA is much more dependable(in any case), and it is undoubtly more responsive when it comes to the speed factor.
To all those haters out there, who feel they have the right to put down what v8lover has done they have no right. This is his art, if you dont like the exibit then just walk out, no need to put in the comments. What he has done as many have said before in this thread, is far and beyond what many could acheive or even comprehend being possible.
My question to this conversion though, is... when finished will I still have my A/C?!?!?! I live in Texas and although I like the idea, if I have no A/C in the summer I'll just have to keep with the origional plan and have Marcus Williams the Houston 7 specialst go to shop on my baby.
Having to get a new diff is not a prob, thats why Kaaz is here, 1.5 street or 2 way. Those lsds could easily handle the torqe given from an ls1.
To v8lover, hurry up and get the pricing for a drop off drive off operation!!! I have the car waiting to be hauled off and the money waiting to be invested in a very good alternative to the 13b TT setup.
I will sacrafice the weight factor for a NA 350+ horsepower engine. I love turbos but NA is much more dependable(in any case), and it is undoubtly more responsive when it comes to the speed factor.
To all those haters out there, who feel they have the right to put down what v8lover has done they have no right. This is his art, if you dont like the exibit then just walk out, no need to put in the comments. What he has done as many have said before in this thread, is far and beyond what many could acheive or even comprehend being possible.
My question to this conversion though, is... when finished will I still have my A/C?!?!?! I live in Texas and although I like the idea, if I have no A/C in the summer I'll just have to keep with the origional plan and have Marcus Williams the Houston 7 specialst go to shop on my baby.
Having to get a new diff is not a prob, thats why Kaaz is here, 1.5 street or 2 way. Those lsds could easily handle the torqe given from an ls1.
To v8lover, hurry up and get the pricing for a drop off drive off operation!!! I have the car waiting to be hauled off and the money waiting to be invested in a very good alternative to the 13b TT setup.
#84
Rotary Freak
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Originally posted by SPOautos
I dont understand your comment about not liking to shift from 5th to 3rd to eat up a Cobra since its a 2 gear downshift.
Do you think making a 3gear downshift with a 6 speed would be better??? The only thing you get with a 6 speed is an extra overdrive to help with fuel economy on the street.
Why would you rather drop down 3 gears than 2?????
I dont get it???
STEPHEN
I dont understand your comment about not liking to shift from 5th to 3rd to eat up a Cobra since its a 2 gear downshift.
Do you think making a 3gear downshift with a 6 speed would be better??? The only thing you get with a 6 speed is an extra overdrive to help with fuel economy on the street.
Why would you rather drop down 3 gears than 2?????
I dont get it???
STEPHEN
Don't get me wrong, I love the simple concept of the rotary; I don't like the downsides.
I don't like pistons with all the reciprocating parts but they're more reliable.
#85
Rotary Freak
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Tq doesnt make your car fast, the frequency of tq makes it fast which means 250lbs of tq at 5000rpms will make a lot more acceleration than 500lbs of tq at 2000 rpms......EVENTHOUGH the 500 at 2000rpms will shred your tires all day long.
#90
The Ricer Eliminator
This is a tough topic. Although I don't think I could ever make my 7 a V8, I have no doubt that the LS1 will perform well. I fully understand the frustration of the rotary engine(unreliability, ease of working on, etc...) For some people, the conversion makes sense. They love the look of the car, but don't want to deal with the rotary for whatever reason. You're not going to be able to predict a winner when it comes to performance until you see the two engines side by side. The LS-1 is a kickass motor. The rotary has it's strenghts as well.
The only point I can't get with is someone prefering the sound of a rotary over a V8. I gotta hand it to that person, as they are a true rotary head. I just think a V8 sounds better. I guess it's all opinion. I do like the rotary's sound though, just not as much.
The only point I can't get with is someone prefering the sound of a rotary over a V8. I gotta hand it to that person, as they are a true rotary head. I just think a V8 sounds better. I guess it's all opinion. I do like the rotary's sound though, just not as much.
#91
apeiron
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No comparison on sound
Rx7 with an upgraded hiflow cat and exaust may sound pretty good, a purr at idle and pretty good sound at high rpms...
But a v8 at idle is a big growling bear and an A bomb at high rpms.
The sound of the car really has no influence on my choice when I get my new engine weather its the ls1 or new rotary...
BUt it cant hurt be heard afew miles away as you drop the pedal.
But a v8 at idle is a big growling bear and an A bomb at high rpms.
The sound of the car really has no influence on my choice when I get my new engine weather its the ls1 or new rotary...
BUt it cant hurt be heard afew miles away as you drop the pedal.
#92
i like rotors
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hey, i am in no way hating on what he did. Hopefully no one was saying i was. Regardless, i own my...see...MY (mine, not his or theres, but mine) RX-7 because, and mainly because, i am fascinated by wankel and what he has engineered. I give credit when credit is due. Nice Job!! (to V8Lover)
I just think it takes more ingeniuty (ok maybe money t oo) to have a daily driven rotary engine car, with turbo. I think its the whole point in an "RX-7". Again just my thought!
Oh and a SVT Mustang..? C'mon, i play with my buddy's roush all day and he wish he could keep up!! and i have stock motor and turbo's?
I just think it takes more ingeniuty (ok maybe money t oo) to have a daily driven rotary engine car, with turbo. I think its the whole point in an "RX-7". Again just my thought!
Oh and a SVT Mustang..? C'mon, i play with my buddy's roush all day and he wish he could keep up!! and i have stock motor and turbo's?
Last edited by Verbal; 12-05-02 at 12:07 PM.
#93
V8Lover,
I think you did something very commendable here and it's a great accomplishment. I would have never thought the RX7 could have gone from 1.3L to 5.7L, not lose much weight over it, and be fast as fawk.
But to me personally, i like the RX7 b/c of it's rotary motor. As some others have pointed out, it kind of scares me that possibly in a few years, the fastest/most modified FD3Ss will be V8 powered. Good luck to you on this continuing project!
Danny
I think you did something very commendable here and it's a great accomplishment. I would have never thought the RX7 could have gone from 1.3L to 5.7L, not lose much weight over it, and be fast as fawk.
But to me personally, i like the RX7 b/c of it's rotary motor. As some others have pointed out, it kind of scares me that possibly in a few years, the fastest/most modified FD3Ss will be V8 powered. Good luck to you on this continuing project!
Danny
#94
Super Snuggles
Originally posted by SERIES7
So wait, I don't get it. Who's the first to do this V8 swap? V8lover finished the swap, from what I'm reading. Where does Jimlab fit in this picture? Isn't he the one who came up with the idea? I dunno anymore
So wait, I don't get it. Who's the first to do this V8 swap? V8lover finished the swap, from what I'm reading. Where does Jimlab fit in this picture? Isn't he the one who came up with the idea? I dunno anymore
Bill Hagen was the first to complete an FD LT1 conversion in the summer of 2000, using an engine cradle from Grant. MY engine cradle, actually, but that's another story...
Brian, to the best of my knowledge, is the first to successfully complete an FD LS1 conversion, with his own cradle.
Grant's "LS1" cradle is nothing more than the LT1 cradle with different mounting provisions for an FC manual steering rack and extra brackets which are supposed to adapt an LS1 to the cradle. Apparently they don't work, hence Brian's pioneering of an "alternative method".
#95
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Originally posted by paw140
The amount of horsepower you put to the wheels is what will determine acceleration.
The amount of horsepower you put to the wheels is what will determine acceleration.
Originally posted by paw140
The fact that a V8 makes much more torque and hp at low rpms just makes it a lot easier to drive in most situations. 250 ft-lbs at 5000 rpm and 500 ft-lbs at 2500 rpm will give you the exact same hp. Just because you are revving at a higher rpm and are making less torque doesn't mean you are going to smoke the tires any less.
The fact that a V8 makes much more torque and hp at low rpms just makes it a lot easier to drive in most situations. 250 ft-lbs at 5000 rpm and 500 ft-lbs at 2500 rpm will give you the exact same hp. Just because you are revving at a higher rpm and are making less torque doesn't mean you are going to smoke the tires any less.
Also why a Stang or SS can do a much better burn out than me eventhough I can bust thier *** thru the 1/4.
STEPHEN
Last edited by SPOautos; 12-05-02 at 03:48 PM.
#96
Rotary Freak
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Yes it does in my example, I didnt use the same rpms, I used 250@5000 = 238rwhp and 500@2000 = 190rwhp. The tq is what breaks your tires loose.
#97
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Maybe after you launch, and the rpms start to drop, the higher torque engine will have more of a tendency to lose traction than the lower torque engine. But thats not really what we're talking about.
#98
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the initial force of high torqe breaks the tires loose. The tires are spinning with much more force due to the high tq eventhough they are spinning at a slower rpm.
This is getting hard to explain, its like I know what I want to say but I'm not sure how to word it.
Everytime the V8's tire turns its doing so with 400lbs of tq....or force. Evertime my cars tire turns its doing so with 250lbs of tq...its just that its turning more cause I'm running higher rpms.
Does that make more since??? About as clear as mud huh haha
STEPHEN
This is getting hard to explain, its like I know what I want to say but I'm not sure how to word it.
Everytime the V8's tire turns its doing so with 400lbs of tq....or force. Evertime my cars tire turns its doing so with 250lbs of tq...its just that its turning more cause I'm running higher rpms.
Does that make more since??? About as clear as mud huh haha
STEPHEN
#99
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I have to give props to the skill it must have required to do this V8 swap, but.........if you want an LS1, then go and buy a Vette. If you want the reliability of a Vette, then go buy a Vette. It's hard for me to comprehend why people do things like this.
#100
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That doesn't make to me. If you put two different configurations on a dyno, the one with 238 hp of torque is going to accelerate faster (i.e., it is making more power an pushing against the dyno drums with more force). The 190 hp is going to push against the dyno with less force. You would be more likely to have traction problems with the higher horsepower car, assuming both engines stay in their respective horsepower ranges.
I think we need a knowledgable third party person to agree with one of us. The way I see it, power is power. Whether it comes from a low torque or high torque engine seems irrelevant.
I think we need a knowledgable third party person to agree with one of us. The way I see it, power is power. Whether it comes from a low torque or high torque engine seems irrelevant.