djseven

iTrader: (56)

Huge problem with the Mcoupes(z3 M edition), somewhat common on really high mileage e36 and e46 standard 3 series. Rare on the e46 m3. Kinda messed up though since the problem spanned from the late 80s up until 2006 ish and BMW refused to address it. I've owned a lot of cars and worked for a compamy for 5 years where the group of salesmen owned about every car under the sun. Audi and BMW took the cake for overall shittyness once mileage was north of 75k. With that said the e46 m3 is actually a really solid car.

Porsches and Mercedes actually seemed to hold up surprisingly well with higher mileage compared to BMW, Audi, Range Rover and VW.

Drifted88

iTrader: (3)

The one I had experience with was an early 2000's the guy beat the **** out of the thing too tho.

HiWire

I read that the rear chassis/floor pan would come apart in E36 cars. Some people weld them or otherwise reinforce them to prevent problems.

I've also read that the E36 drives really well, to balance against some of the technical problems.

rx7 SE

iTrader: (5)

Yes the rear subframe tearing is probably the most common problem in the 3 series chassis since the 90's. A lot of them have been fixed from the recalls. The handling between the e36 and e46 is very similar, but the e36 gives a LOT more driver feedback which is my main complaint with my e46 m3.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the E36 does drive well, even the shitty ones where its literally falling apart as your driving it, drive really well.

so in 1977 BMW introduced the E21 3 series, and for the rear suspension, it has a banana shaped rear subframe, and semi trailing arms, the FC is very similar. the FC has the subframe bolted to a HUGE frame rail structure, BMW literally just bolts the thing to the trunk floor.

fast forward to the E36, and the same subframe/rear suspension is bolted to the same floor pan stamping, but the car is heavier, and can generate much larger chassis forces (it accelerates and corners harder), so the result is that the bolts pull through the sheet metal floor.

the initial fix was to blame the customers, then when BMW lost in court BMW added big washers.

the E46, has a new rear suspension design, although it uses the same trunk floor stamping, the highlight of the E46 is that it uses 4 bolts to attach, so this means the average one stays intact, however if you drive it hard, it'll still fail.

the E46 also is big enough that the front strut towers, which are also carried over from the E21 bend/fail.

this is puzzling, as we've had CAD design long enough, that they had to know the E46 was going to have problems. yet these fundamental flaws go unaddressed until they get hauled into court.

Spirit-RE

iTrader: (25)

As a tech, I cannot understand why people buy used audi's. Parts are unnecessarily expensive and they're the biggest mechanical messes(in close second is Land Rover and most of the Euro brands from my experience.) There's nothing substantially good about them compared to any of their competition. Sure they drive nice and have good materials in the interior, but the "quality" ends there. By nature a complicated luxury car is going to be higher maintenance, but I rarely see a lexus having near the issues the typical Audi has.


Imo the older bmw's were pretty good cars(before they went to hell and complicated them with electronics). They still did a lot of stuff differently(backwards) though. My E36 M3 has been incredibly solid at nearly 190xxx, besides for the interior falling apart.
I had a e60 in recently, and the waterpump(over $1k job) is an electric pump that's a common failure(go figure). Why? Why does your passenger sedan need an electric water pump? And the bolts throughout the engine, aluminum. One time use. Why? What possible backwards reason do you have for designing things so backwards?


One of the local Audi enthusiasts told it to me pretty good: Stick a German engineer in a hole, and give him a ladder, he'll craft that ladder into a shovel and dig his way out.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

That is flat out ridiculous that they would engineer the car that way.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i'm sorry you're wrong, its the ultimate driving machine.

feel free to poke your head under a BMW, compare with the FC, and come up with your own conclusions.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

our E36 vert wore out the rear control arm spring bases(used to center the springs), the spring loved to sit at the edge of the hole in the trailing arm and make a "nails on chalkboard" sound when going over certain bumps. i would shove a prybar in there periodically to re-center the damn things, taking the springs out didn't look like a fun job and i'm sure the flimsy rubber pieces were probably $200 each.

to get to the blower motor just blew me away, i felt like i was getting ready to pull the engine out after i had taken the whole wiper cowling assembly and engine harness apart just to get enough room to squeeze it out of a hole barely large enough to get it through(the plastic fans on the motor were still tweaking close enough to breaking them). add in that the motor alone costs $350 and i had enough of that car after just one job.

it did drive nicely, got good mileage and was fun enough to drive even for a vert but fixing even the most minor thing turned into a full day adventure. not a car/brand i would own again. at least with the mercedes it rarely broke, but fixing anything on that car was also a pain. but even after half a million miles it hardly needed any special attention(probably because it was slower than a geo metro).

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Based on these issues??? Ultimate my ***. Lol!

I will say this, most of my repairs have been fairly easy on the e39 M5.

Fuel pump
Both rear window regulators
Blower resister
Intake cam sensor was kinda of a bitch
So was replacing the shifter bushings
Exterior door handles (once I figured them out)
The front lower control arm thrust bushings weren't that hard.

The funny thing is, other than the shifter bushings, I never had any of those kinds of problems with my fd.

djseven

iTrader: (56)

Yea, you were just fortunate enough to blow an engine, need new pillowballs, new wiring harness ETC with a FD with 108k miles. While I believe BMWs and Audis are utter pieces of **** comparing the long term quality of any car to the FD with equal mileage is laughable. The FD has a much worse rep than it deserves but at the same time it isnt winning any build quality awards.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

So are we nit picking my post again? You have zero clue of the condition of my 94fd and how it was cared for. I have made no such claims about quality and only stated my facts.

My engine blowing was self inflicted. New wiring harness??? Don't assume you know every single Fd's condition just because of it's mileage. It was still very soft because I know how to properly cool my car down after driving it (it's called no turbo timers). The person I sold the harness to couldn't believe it's condition. You got me on the pillow *****. I forgot about those! Either way, other than normal maintenance, my fd was far less problematic than my BMW and NEVER left me stranded like that BMW did when the fuel pump went out at 70k.


My M5 was 75+k brand new. Do I think a car of that value should have components that should last a considerable amount of time when compared to my fd which was more than half that price? I think it should. I shouldn't have to be replacing those basic components so early. Again, the above failures happened on the Bimmer not so much on the 7. Why is that ??? You tell me since your the know it all expert!

MisterX

The stresses on the components must be magnified by x times due to the large difference in mass, no?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

I'm just talking about basic components. I have NEVER had to replace a fuel pump, window regulator, or heater blower components on any rx7 I've owned (and I've owned all 3 generations). When those simple things started failing on the M5, I started getting pissed. When the blower resister went out, the blower wouldn't turn off. The window regulators are cheaply made. And the fuel pump mechanism is complete junk.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I was surprised how many problems my dad's 3-series had, and it was super low mileage and well cared for. Stuff I would consider very "un-BMW like" based on perceived reputation. Repeated electrical issues, odd noises and rattles, mechanical ancillary parts like pumps and such going bad. Dad traded it in on a C5, which has it's own issues. Too many gadgety electronics in cars now. Do I really need doors to automatically close themselves the last half inch, or mirrors to re-aim themselves when I put it in reverse?! Time was when a man could back his ******* car up without GPS assistance.

That's fairly consistent among the modern German cars I know of, and I remember all of our old Volkswagens being legendarily hard to work on, because things were engineered such that you had to take half the car apart or use a "special tool" to get at things. And the parts were expensive.

I'd have to have a real good reason not to buy a Japanese car.

djseven

iTrader: (56)

My wife's rx330 has been a great SUV but it lacks the looks, handling and power of the X5 and Q7. The German luxury cars are really great at making you forget you are driving a 5000lb car or SUV. However, the problems are well documented once out of warranty phase. Can't deny the looks of the new Audis though and the Turbo cayenne s are beautiful as well

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Used to be, German cars were known for understated "Teutonic" styling and appointment, and superior engineering/quality. Now they're all big hair, fake ****, and press-on finger nails.

Agreed though, Japanese makes could use could use some help in the styling department these days. Modern cars generally all look very angry and aggressive. I wonder what that says about buyers.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

LOL

Yep at 100k miles you MAY need:
engine
turbos
wiring harness
bushings and pillow *****
possibly front ball joints and definitely new tie rod outers
solenoids
engine harness
etc...etc...

The interior is a complete joke but it's designed around cutting weight so I can forgive any problems there

The twin turbo system is unreliable without question

The FD isn't for fools. If you drive like a jack *** you'll need a trans in a hurry, turbos if you boost over 12 psi along with an engine. You must change the oil at normal intervals or you'll need bearings etc..... the oil is probably 25% gas after 3k miles. The coolant must be flushed no less than every 3 years and done properly as in draining both the radiator and the block etc.... You cannot over heat the car or over boost because either one may kill the engine. You cannot run it lean (change your fuel filter every 20k miles) so if you start having hesitation issues when taking left hand turns FAST without much fuel in the tank DON"T do that LOL.... or get a fuel tank baffle thingy and upgrade to a supra pump. There are hundreds of little things you can do to keep this car going reliably and when those things are done it truly is an extremely tough enjoyable sports car. The FD is designed for people who love to tinker (this car will reward the tinkerer like no other if they aren't trying to reinvent the wheel then God help those that over tinker) with cars if you aren't one of those people get a honda S2k and don't look back.

BOTTOMLINE: Do the little reliability things (they are posted all over this forum), keep up w/ the maintenance, garage it and you'll have smooth sailing for 100k miles. After that it's just in the cards. It may go another 100k or blow up any day JUST LIKE ANY OTHER TURBO SPORTS CAR.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

LMAO. That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. And yet there prices keep going up.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the 5 series suspension (like the 3) was designed in the mid 70's for a car that was smaller and lighter (E12), than the E39. my dad had an E34 and the brochure said the suspension was "all new", you think this means an all new design, but it was recently manufactured.

i have a friend with an E39, and he goes through a window regulator or two a year, he's up to 14.

my yoga teacher has an 05 Rx3something, and i really like it (although it feels i should be blasting 80's madonna or something). i did drive a new Rxwhatever, and i totally agree, it looks bad, drives bad, and it smells bad.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Pete is FUNNY!!!!!

The dude is full of good material.

I like "there was a time when a man could back up his car with out GPS"

t-von

iTrader: (8)

You hit the nail on that one. This kind of maintenance is the #1 reason my fd was so reliable. Having owned several rotary powered vehicles, I knew that there were certain things that needed to be done sooner than later. I did everything to make sure it never ran lean or hot. I replaced the fuel filter and plugs once a year or at 12k. I also did the water steam cleaning every 6 months to fight carbon. Carbon build-up is what killed my previous rotarys so I was determined to not let that happen to the fd. Coolant was flushed every 2 years. Also finding a non abused model really helps. The 2 previous owners babied the car and always kept it garaged so my interior is flawless. The only reason the engine blew was because I added a manuel boost controller after installing a down pipe. Well over time, the boost would slowly creep and I would have to readjust. Well I failed to do this on a cold day with 87 octane in the tank. Boost spiked over 11psi and pop (zero compression rear rotor). Nice thing though, at 108k there was still enough compression on the front rotor to still start the car and drive it the 10 miles back to my shop. So even with a blown engine, my fd has never left me stranded.

MisterX

Antiquated & proven technology, that still breaks . . . .that could be their ad slogans. MacPherson struts, combined with the cutting edge recirculating ball steering, and along with it somewhat-reliable-well-ok-maybe-not-at-all electronics. But damnit, they've got the all-important 4 ring/3 pointed star/ roundel affixed to the body.
One thing about the RXs. . . . the ride quality when sitting in the back seat (vs in any of the 2 front ones) is awesome - the firmness of the damping while still being supple, it's just spot on.

Julian

iTrader: (14)

Only if the design was in error

ZoomZoom

iTrader: (2)

I would take those problems you had with your BMW over major driveline and power plant component failures any day.
Just the fact you think the BMW brand is junk and were so unhappy with your M5 ownership experience over those niggily things makes me wonder why you chose an RX-7 which is arguably worse.

While a fuel pump can easily leave you stranded most everything else that failed on your BMW wouldn't.

I've never had to tow any car I've ever owned more often then my FD. Its also the car I've put the least mileage on and spent the most money fixing (by exponentially higher amounts) then any car by far.
I've owned probably 20 cars of all differing makes and models.

The FD makes a Range Rover look reliable. BMW/Audi have thier issues but for what you get in ride quality, luxury, amenities, performance and fun factor in a practical form factor for daily driving then I say most of those issues you stated are livable.

Because seriously, who wants to drive a Lexus?

Disclaimer- LFA excluded.