Best USA rx-7 FD3S Tuner
01-08-18, 05:49 PM
#1
RX-7 FD3S R-1
Thread Starter
Best USA rx-7 FD3S Tuner
Hi guys,
I bet this has been asked over and over again.
I live outside the USA and want to select the best tuner/modifier for my RX-7 FD. Please help me out with your comments and suggestions.
I might move to Texas soon, but this is not yet confirmed. So, anywhere in the US will be good for me to go there and check out their facilities and experience.
Thanks guys.
I bet this has been asked over and over again.
I live outside the USA and want to select the best tuner/modifier for my RX-7 FD. Please help me out with your comments and suggestions.
I might move to Texas soon, but this is not yet confirmed. So, anywhere in the US will be good for me to go there and check out their facilities and experience.
Thanks guys.
Last edited by Duc852; 01-08-18 at 05:51 PM. Reason: added for clarification
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Duc852 (01-09-18)
01-08-18, 07:57 PM
#3
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What makes a tune good. What makes it good isn't the credibility of the tuner themself, it deals more with the time spent on the tune, knowledge of the tuner and also the conditions the car was driven under.
I like street tuning the best. It loads the car the way its supposed to be loaded.
Someone who knows the ECU software you are using
a good ballpark ignition timing, not too aggressive and not too retarded both have issues.
Time spent on the tune driving it in a way to tune it well.
A good wideband for logging and ensure it read accurately.
You will not get a great tune on a DYNO IMO as you won't spend enough time fine tuning the tune, no way you are going to make 100 passes to dial everything in like you can street tuning. It also loads the car differently.
I like street tuning the best. It loads the car the way its supposed to be loaded.
Someone who knows the ECU software you are using
a good ballpark ignition timing, not too aggressive and not too retarded both have issues.
Time spent on the tune driving it in a way to tune it well.
A good wideband for logging and ensure it read accurately.
You will not get a great tune on a DYNO IMO as you won't spend enough time fine tuning the tune, no way you are going to make 100 passes to dial everything in like you can street tuning. It also loads the car differently.
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Duc852 (01-09-18)
01-09-18, 07:08 AM
#4
I street tuned for many years, the best tuning is done on a dyno, it must be a load bearing dyno however. Driving customers cars at 140+ mph is not only illegal it is very dangerous. It also requires 2 people. Having a car in a controlled environment is ideal, small changes in characteristics can be identified immediately, and are not effected by oncoming traffic, animals, corners etc. Having real time data available without the distraction of having to actually drive the car give a far superior tune and prevents costly accidents or blown engines. Example: You do not want to be 2 miles away from the shop and have a hose blow off.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the person's car.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the person's car.
Last edited by Banzai-Racing; 01-09-18 at 09:33 AM.
01-09-18, 09:34 AM
#6
I street tuned for many years, the best tuning is done on a dyno, it must be a load bearing dyno however. Driving customers cars at 140+ mph is not only illegal it is very dangerous. It also requires 2 people. Having a car in a controlled environment is ideal, small changes in characteristics can be identified immediately, and are not effected by oncoming traffic, animals, corners etc. Having real time data available without the distraction of having to actually drive the car give a far superior tune and prevents costly accidents or blown engines. Example: You do not want to be 2 miles away from the shop and have a hose blow off.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the owners car.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the owners car.
Last edited by IRPerformance; 01-09-18 at 09:38 AM.
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bajaman (01-13-18)
01-09-18, 09:43 AM
#7
Definitely agree, I did back to back tuning on mustang and then dynojet. Car made 2psi more boost at same duty cycles/gear on mustang dyno with the load turned on vs dyno jet. I found that on the street, the boost curve certainly mimicked the mustang dyno alot closer. Street seemed to have just a tad bit more load in 4th, vs the mustang but overalll a huge difference from the dynojet. I would not trust a dynojet for a tune on the edge without going back and checking / adjusting for street load. The vehicle simulation mode is awesome too.
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01-09-18, 10:11 AM
#8
RX-7 FD3S R-1
Thread Starter
I kept the first car and then I moved to Mexico and drove the car for a while. I stopped the car because I did not have time to take care of it, and about 2 years ago I decided to put it back in shape. It has actually has only 40,000 original miles on it.
Although the engine was running ok when I stopped it (2007) I sent the engine to Cam for a complete overhaul but when I got it back, it only lasted 100 miles !! So I sent it back to Cam under warranty. It arrived back and it blew again after only 3000 miles. I opened the engine here in Mexico and it does not look good, probably need to get one new rotor and one new housing.
Now I would like to rebuild the engine (at first) and if I get a good shop, make some other mods.
What about REC? or Defined autoworks? or Kilo? and any comments of Pettit?
01-09-18, 10:27 AM
#9
RX-7 FD3S R-1
Thread Starter
I street tuned for many years, the best tuning is done on a dyno, it must be a load bearing dyno however. Driving customers cars at 140+ mph is not only illegal it is very dangerous. It also requires 2 people. Having a car in a controlled environment is ideal, small changes in characteristics can be identified immediately, and are not effected by oncoming traffic, animals, corners etc. Having real time data available without the distraction of having to actually drive the car give a far superior tune and prevents costly accidents or blown engines. Example: You do not want to be 2 miles away from the shop and have a hose blow off.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the person's car.
We own our Mustang dyno, so if 100 runs are needed, so be it. Driving the car at normal neighborhood and highway speeds is easily achievable and we spend just as much time (or more) in those areas of the map as we do pulling WOT. I tell everyone that show up for tuning with 10 of their friends "This is going to be very boring for the next few hours, the 20 second videos you see on the internet are the very last thing that happens". Throttle tip in from a dead stop is verified in the parking lot.
Duc852, If you are moving to TX, Steve is down there as well as RX7.com. If they can't help you we can provide you with any level of modifications you are looking for. For the best drivability the car should be tuned in the climate/elevation that you plan to drive the car. A car tuned at sea level will not perform the same at high elevation.
Like all threads that start out "What/Who is the Best.....________?", this thread will quickly devolve into a list of people/shops that last worked on the person's car.
Ok... so I will look at RX7.com, but who is Steve? (Sorry for being a newbie in here)
01-09-18, 11:50 AM
#10
Steve Kan owns PRT Performance. Steve has built a good reputation for tuning ability. The shop accepts multiple makes.
Chris Ott own Rotary Performance. Chris has been in the game since 1988. He operates below the noise but is highly regarded by those that know him. The shop only works on rotary vehicles.
Both are DFW (Dallas/Forth Worth) based shops.
Chris Ott own Rotary Performance. Chris has been in the game since 1988. He operates below the noise but is highly regarded by those that know him. The shop only works on rotary vehicles.
Both are DFW (Dallas/Forth Worth) based shops.
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Duc852 (01-09-18)
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Duc852 (01-13-18)
01-13-18, 10:42 PM
#12
Full Member
Definitely agree, I did back to back tuning on mustang and then dynojet. Car made 2psi more boost at same duty cycles/gear on mustang dyno with the load turned on vs dyno jet. I found that on the street, the boost curve certainly mimicked the mustang dyno alot closer. Street seemed to have just a tad bit more load in 4th, vs the mustang but overalll a huge difference from the dynojet. I would not trust a dynojet for a tune on the edge without going back and checking / adjusting for street load. The vehicle simulation mode is awesome too.
01-13-18, 11:22 PM
#13
Take it from someone who has been screwed in the US many of times. For motor hands down Kilo Racing. For tuning microtech once again Kilo Racing. For tuning any other ecu i am not sure. For suspension brakes and cooling systems Pettit Racing. I have been a owner since 1998. This is how i get it done and these guys are top notch at the things i mentioned. Jesus Padilla of Kilo Racing is in the genous world record for his three rotor and Cam from Pettit Racing has the track record at pbir. I am sure they wished that they would be the soul mechanic for my car but depending on what my car needs is depending on which one of them it goes to.
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Duc852 (01-13-18)
01-13-18, 11:52 PM
#14
RX-7 FD3S R-1
Thread Starter
Take it from someone who has been screwed in the US many of times. For motor hands down Kilo Racing. For tuning microtech once again Kilo Racing. For tuning any other ecu i am not sure. For suspension brakes and cooling systems Pettit Racing. I have been a owner since 1998. This is how i get it done and these guys are top notch at the things i mentioned. Jesus Padilla of Kilo Racing is in the genous world record for his three rotor and Cam from Pettit Racing has the track record at pbir. I am sure they wished that they would be the soul mechanic for my car but depending on what my car needs is depending on which one of them it goes to.
01-15-18, 08:36 AM
#16
Several of the better tuners have been listed here. There are more. Part of it is that often tuners specialize in tuning a particular engine management system. Kilo does Microtech for instance and is very good with them. Silvera is very good with Haltech. Some may be good at more than one, but each EMS has its own features and quirks and they have become very complex. I would think that you need to think both of what EMS you want, need, or like and simultaneously what tuners are known to be good with the EMS you favor. There are certainly some tuners or shops who know multiple EMS's, but many specialize.
-M
01-15-18, 09:36 AM
#17
rotorhole
steve khan does sloppy and quickly thrown together tunes, he has a reputation because he does so many tunes and most of the time they work somewhat ok. does that make him a good tuner? i don't necessarily think that makes a person a 'good' tuner, just a tuner. now keep in mind i'm not saying he's a bad tuner either, and there is a difference there. the same could be said of many of the others who are listed here, because a good tune can't be rushed and takes a bit more than an hour or 2, but when you are paying $125+ per hour for the tune plus dyno fees(that's how much i used to charge, most tuners are actually closer to $200+ per hour), the tuners know they will lose customers if they need to take twice as long so most will rush through your tune to get it close enough to good.
of course Steve got put up as an example because he does more tunes than any other rotary tuner, so it's given me a chance to see more of his maps than anyone elses and more often than not i wasn't very impressed with the work when someone who received it paid ~$500 for the work, and more often than not i was checking the maps to find out why a motor decided to liberate itself of its apex seals.
and with any tuner, if you value your investment, do not do a remote tune... you wind up being the safety limiter for your own car, even if you lack the experience to see the signs needed to protect your investment.
what does that really all mean? well there is enough information out there to teach anyone to tune their own rotary engine now, so in some cases the best tuner is the owner of their own car. ideally you do a road tune for your cruise, light load and economy mapping and then you step onto the dyno for when it gets a little too hairy for high power tuning portion of the map, though you actually do it in the reverse order because there's no point tuning the low end if there is issues up top that need to be sorted out. but do you really think most tuners spend much time on your economy and light load mapping after doing the power mapping? nope, they got you the numbers and they know you have your wallet open and ready to pay at that point already so the bottom end of the map gets little to no attention to detail.
of course Steve got put up as an example because he does more tunes than any other rotary tuner, so it's given me a chance to see more of his maps than anyone elses and more often than not i wasn't very impressed with the work when someone who received it paid ~$500 for the work, and more often than not i was checking the maps to find out why a motor decided to liberate itself of its apex seals.
and with any tuner, if you value your investment, do not do a remote tune... you wind up being the safety limiter for your own car, even if you lack the experience to see the signs needed to protect your investment.
what does that really all mean? well there is enough information out there to teach anyone to tune their own rotary engine now, so in some cases the best tuner is the owner of their own car. ideally you do a road tune for your cruise, light load and economy mapping and then you step onto the dyno for when it gets a little too hairy for high power tuning portion of the map, though you actually do it in the reverse order because there's no point tuning the low end if there is issues up top that need to be sorted out. but do you really think most tuners spend much time on your economy and light load mapping after doing the power mapping? nope, they got you the numbers and they know you have your wallet open and ready to pay at that point already so the bottom end of the map gets little to no attention to detail.
Last edited by insightful; 01-15-18 at 10:40 AM.
01-15-18, 10:30 AM
#18
RX-7 FD3S R-1
Thread Starter
Several of the better tuners have been listed here. There are more. Part of it is that often tuners specialize in tuning a particular engine management system. Kilo does Microtech for instance and is very good with them. Silvera is very good with Haltech. Some may be good at more than one, but each EMS has its own features and quirks and they have become very complex. I would think that you need to think both of what EMS you want, need, or like and simultaneously what tuners are known to be good with the EMS you favor. There are certainly some tuners or shops who know multiple EMS's, but many specialize.
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