Boost Lee

iTrader: (3)

I'm curious why so many people buy N/A cars and spend another 3-5k including time and labor on swapping the car over to turbo. And more often than not, the car never runs right! But when approached with a clean, properly running, emissions passing TII that same person choses to pass it up because it costs $5-6k.

1st7

iTrader: (1)

can you say not enough funds right now????




< NA and staying that way!

EJayCe996

Because some people just need something to do

And why not convert all of the world's NAs over to turbos?

7fold

idk, cuz we are all cheap???

at least the turbo procces is over a period of time and you can space it out a bit... dont have to drip it all at once! haha

N/A all the way!!

ncfc3s

iTrader: (1)

Why buy a TII and not spend all that time getting to know your car? Built, not bought.

Valkyrie

I have WAY too much time, money, and emotions invested in this thing to sell it for a T2. I'd rather do a swap.

My goal is to have about double the power I have now some day (320ish)... not bike fast, but I'm hoping for a strong squirt of power when I hit the throttle.

ncfc3s

iTrader: (1)

Alright....to get away from the pregnant woman at home......you got me

InsomniacFC

iTrader: (4)

Cause you start with a n/a that has 150k miles on it, drive it hard for x amount of years, then oil seals/coolant/apex seals blow out and the motor is gone. now faced with the prospect of a motor swap, be it n/a or turbo, most would rather go turbo instead of going back to the n/a since it is lower power. Problem is, it costs a lot more since u can get your n/a rebuilt for a grand + and buying an imported 13bt is a crap shoot (read the horror stories). I didnt' want to roll the dice so i bought a rebuilt n/a motor.

Turbo II bargains are also harder to find in my area. The $1600 i spent on my n/a was $3400 less then what most were asking for a TII and i could not justify spending that much more for 40hp when I already have fun with 146. That, and the one's on craigslist at the time were bootsy (missing rims, not starting, busted interior, etc...). They are not always bootsy, but during the time i was looking i could not find a decent one.

But, i've owned 3 n/a's and i have to say the next rotary i get is going to be a TII just cause. I've considered the swap as well, but i would just rather start with a TII as a base for making my project instead of making my GXL a turbo. The j-specs are easier to find online compared to the usdm motors (since you have find a totaled TII or one with a blown motor that needs a rebuild).

Tatakai

iTrader: (2)

because clean TII's are a lot harder to find, especially S5's. AND the price.

n/a -> turbo in under $1000 is quite easy, just depends on how much N/A stuff you use.

BASTARD

iTrader: (4)

because you can find base model N/A's with no sunroof

SirCygnus

iTrader: (1)

sun roofs are irrelevant.

i spent tons of money in my t2 swap, and its just soo much more fun to do it that way. i know you can buy a t2 used. but its all ragged on and old and whatever. i went with haltech and all new components. cost me a good bit of dough.

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

This is the way I see it, to restore a 20 year old car you have to pretty much remove the entire powertrain once anyway. Like when you rebuild an engine, change transmissions, replace mounts, etc. The people looking to build it right way prefer the NA cars because they're cheap and readily available and the people that build it eventually just don't want to save for a T2. The extra cost (over the initial cost of a TII, if any) of a TII swap would be equal to the interest I'd pay if I had taken a loan, but without the experience of having done all the work myself and the knowledge of the car I'd gain.

I didn't buy a TII because for a daily driver the only way I'd get any RX-7 is if its been rebuilt recently and S5 TIIs go for 7-8k rebuilt and in good condition, I lived in an area with strict law enforcements (and had too many tickets) so I didn't want to be tempted to street race, I was getting out of drag racing at the time and didn't want to deal with turbo-related engine problems at a driving event or on a "private" course since suspension, wheels, brakes, tires and driving were things I was uneducated and curious about. Also being my first rotary powered car I was discouraged by misinformed friends and family advising against it and wanted to deal with a simpler engine to be on the safe side.

REVERE

I don’t ever think it is the cheaper option. The re-sale of an NA that has been turbocharged compared to a TII will be crap all. That means all the funds divested on the engine swap will be lost should you decide to sell. If you don’t factor is selling it can be a reasonable option

I also think that if you got a TII and spent the hours that a turbo swap would have taken on tuning and driving your car you will have a far better understanding of your car than the guy who had only performed an engine swap.
What do you learn from doing an engine swap that has any relevance to your car? You can’t truly learn anything until the car is running to give feedback.

ZOMG_Camaro

why start with a TII with emissions that you are gunna take off when you can start with a N/A with emissions crap that you are gunna take off while building something faster than a stock TII

InsomniacFC

iTrader: (4)

1. How to replace most engine bay parts like slave cylinder, clutch, motor mounts, tranny mounts, wiring, MOTOR, emissions, filters, et all. I had not done most of those things prior to my engine swap. I think that maintenance and such are very relevant to my car as that is what keeps it going, much like a new motor.

2. If the car does not run you have to learn to fix it.

ZOMG_Camaro

so true...

Plus building a motor is super fun.... the best part of driving the car after is knowing your hands bled to make that happen

ZOMG_Camaro

also motor swaps let you figure out wat is really unneccessary in your engine bay.... the factory has a way of including alot of crap

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

What type of "tuning" would you be doing? And how will you have a better understanding of how your car works by just driving it? Also I wouldn't plan on swapping the engine over and then never starting it, the point is to do so and then drive it...Its also not an engine swap but an entire powertrain, ECU and wiring harness swap. It should be pretty obvious what you learn after doing all that work. The reason I bought a 20 year old car was so that I can slowly (as time and money comes) restore it and rebuild it with the best combination of parts myself and learn by doing it. Buying a rebuilt TII would defeat the purpose and a blown TII was out of the question because I needed transportation.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Besides personal preference, it all comes down to local availability of parts and cars.

REVERE

Tuning- adjustments and modifications…
I usually start with wheels and tyres, then exhaust and intake, followed by suspension components before I touch anything else. A compression test, dyno run and programmable ecu would be my next steps
You can pretty much tune you car in any direction from that point if you catch my drift?

I was approaching the problem from the angle of having your car work perfectly, not learning the basics of how you car works.


In the end the whole point is driving you car is it not? There is a reason why there is such a variety of aftermarket parts available for just about ever aspect of a car, while price is part of it driving style and personal preference it the reason.
You could experiment on break pads alone for months.


Of cause I realize you plan on driving the car after the build, but its at that point that you are “reasonably” close to the TII starting point for comparative reasons

I guess that Resented that your tone seemed to suggest that someone who buys a TII is somehow less technical proficient as they could have bought an inferior car and got it close to the TII standard.
Let’s be realistic most of the guys who do the swap are just after cheap power and will do the minimum required to achieve that often at the detriment of there engine.

cptpain

iTrader: (1)

because there are less turboII's to go around than N/A's... and some of the TII's ive seen for "a really good deal" arent even worth the money needed to repair all the problems to put back on the road and legal.....

AUGieDogie

iTrader: (4)

two words.......Turbo Vert!!!!!

budmanracing

iTrader: (3)

cause we can. thats why. Simple. I don't want to buy someones headache, I want to make my own.

ncfc3s

iTrader: (1)

My gxl came with 4 piston fronts. I had a tII donor car (87) with the clutch type rear end...Picked up my 89 gxl for $600...jdm engine and tranny $1800, I prolly had $400 in the TII which is the hood and rear end drive shaft and misc other parts I needed for swap...so we will say $2800 for a car that is the same as a tII. Plus when I pull up to the next guy I know just about every nut and bolt from front to rear.

Boost Lee

iTrader: (3)

You know, I've done 4 conversions so far. I currently have a turbo vert up for sale on the forum, I just finished a s5 GTU -> TII conversion and for some reason yesterday was wondering... why I just spent so much time doing all that work. Uh oh... I'm reflecting!