2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992) 1986-1992 Discussion including performance modifications and technical support sections.
Sponsored by:

Timing and NOx

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 09-16-11, 10:39 AM
  #1  
Moderator

Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
 
j9fd3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: https://www2.mazda.com/en/100th/
Posts: 30,792
Received 2,571 Likes on 1,828 Posts
Timing and NOx

as a little background, i live in CA, and end up smogging 6-8 cars a year, most of them Rx7's.

i took my friends FC and it failed with high NOx, which is odd. it turns out it passed last time, but in the 2 years they actually tightened the NOx standard from like 880ish to 566.

the car is totally stock, its an S4 GXL. the only problem is that one of the ACV solenoids doesn't get triggered by the ecu, so i use a plug in the ACV vent line.

i checked the timing, and it was about 10 degrees advanced over stock, i set the timing to stock, and the NOX went from 850ish to 600. HC and CO came down too, but HC went from like 26ppm to 20ppm, and Co went to like .002 instead of .003, small change.

600 still isn't good enough to pass (usually Rx7's have low Nox), but the timing had a HUGE impact on the NOX numbers.
Old 09-16-11, 10:47 AM
  #2  
rotorhead

iTrader: (3)
 
arghx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: cold
Posts: 16,182
Received 429 Likes on 263 Posts
I bet something wasn't burning correctly in the trailing portion of the combustion chamber.
Old 09-16-11, 10:47 AM
  #3  
Full Member
 
Vdub2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
So what do you want from us?

Or is this an informational post?
Old 09-16-11, 11:02 AM
  #4  
Displacement Replacement

iTrader: (5)
 
FC3Sdrift's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: St. Thomas
Posts: 1,502
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
nox is usually something with the cat
Old 09-16-11, 11:05 AM
  #5  
Moderator

Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
 
j9fd3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: https://www2.mazda.com/en/100th/
Posts: 30,792
Received 2,571 Likes on 1,828 Posts
Originally Posted by Vdub2002
So what do you want from us?

Or is this an informational post?
information. timing has a big influence on NOX, and a small impact on HC/CO

you see a lot of smog advice being posted by people who have never actually had to smog a car before (because they live in a place with more sane governance)
Old 09-16-11, 11:16 AM
  #6  
Theoretical Tinkerer

iTrader: (41)
 
RXSpeed16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Norcal/Bay Area, CA
Posts: 1,589
Received 46 Likes on 32 Posts
I bet you could sneak it by if you retard the timing a little more to lower combustion temps. HC's look good though. I smogged my car a couple years ago and hit ~1300 NOX because of one broken vac line. I fixed it and singlehandedly prevented my car from melting the polar ice caps. My point being that anything raising combustion temps (unmetered air, advanced timing) has a big effect on the NOX reading. I'm surprised more people don't have issues with NOX, but then again, most people don't live in Cali. And the smart ones don't register their cars here.
Old 09-16-11, 11:47 AM
  #7  
Full Member
 
Vdub2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
My car wouldn't be let into cali. No cat, just straight exhaust...
Old 09-16-11, 11:50 AM
  #8  
Moderator

Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
 
j9fd3s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: https://www2.mazda.com/en/100th/
Posts: 30,792
Received 2,571 Likes on 1,828 Posts
interesting, the rotary is usually high in HC's, that's always been the hard part. this specific car has always had high NOX, its just that CA didn't care until this time.

i might go check it for vacuum leaks now.... but yeah its close enough it might pass on a retest, just because its so close anyways
Old 09-16-11, 04:04 PM
  #9  
Sharp Claws

iTrader: (30)
 
RotaryEvolution's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 5,107
Likes: 0
Received 41 Likes on 40 Posts
try doing a water treatment and retest. large amounts of carbon can also increase NOx. coolant temp also plays a big role in NOx levels, if the engine is baking hot, that is. invertly a clogged oil cooler could be increasing rotor surface temps, raising NOx levels.

Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 09-16-11 at 04:06 PM.
Old 09-16-11, 04:23 PM
  #10  
Theoretical Tinkerer

iTrader: (41)
 
RXSpeed16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Norcal/Bay Area, CA
Posts: 1,589
Received 46 Likes on 32 Posts
I think I finally found a use for the cold start system. Water injection during the smog test FTW!
Old 09-16-11, 04:35 PM
  #11  
10th Mazda - 10th A.E.
iTrader: (2)
 
Wms10th's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 215
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I was a smog tech(smog mechanic, back then) in 1973, when California introduced those NOX retrofit kits to install on 1966 t0 1972 cars to reduce NOX('73 and newer cars now had EGR valves from the factory). One of the kits only consisted of 2 rubber plugs to plug the vacume advance and vacume port and backing the timing off 5 degrees.

Needles to say the retro kits were outlawed about 5 years later due to the damage done from poorly designed kits or bad installation or both.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
stickmantijuana
Microtech
30
04-23-16 06:37 PM
stickmantijuana
Engine Management Forum
11
11-09-15 01:15 PM
incubuseva
2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992)
14
09-03-15 12:37 PM
stickmantijuana
20B Forum
10
08-19-15 01:47 PM



Quick Reply: Timing and NOx



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:57 AM.