which stand alone or chip is a good bang for the buck
01-02-06, 11:39 AM
#26
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Yes I agree the hand held controller is a benifit I was able to get the car to run on the first fire up on the wolf I hear good things about the micotech too how much are they and do they have a user freindly setting up
01-02-06, 11:41 AM
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Yes I agree the hand held controller is a benifit I was able to get the car to run on the first fire up on the wolf I hear good things about the micotech too how much are they and do they have a user freindly setting up also has any one blown there engine with a rtec it seems it probably one of the best chips yet
01-02-06, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by TitosToy
i'm deciding which one to buy, the microtech or the haltech. i've been told that with the microtech you're able to use the stock coils but you cant with the haltech. also i've been told that microtech has 2 settings(1 for load and the other for crusing) but haltech has only the load. can anyone here shed some insight on that?
01-02-06, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by dennis blackstone
Yes I agree the hand held controller is a benifit I was able to get the car to run on the first fire up on the wolf I hear good things about the micotech too how much are they and do they have a user freindly setting up
01-02-06, 01:15 PM
#30
Any of the complexities that have been described about MegaSquirt are truly a bonus. The fact that you have the option to actually build the entire system will only benefit the user for years to come since s/he will not be dependant on anyone else for future repairs tuning etc.
It is impossible to build and install a MS and not end up being more knowledgable about EFI than most of the users on this board. In my eyes this is a great benefit.
But if it is plug and play that you value then I agree that other systems are better in that regard.(for the time being)
I am building my own MS this winter and I am really appreciative of the knowledge that the system is forcing me to acquire.
It is impossible to build and install a MS and not end up being more knowledgable about EFI than most of the users on this board. In my eyes this is a great benefit.
But if it is plug and play that you value then I agree that other systems are better in that regard.(for the time being)
I am building my own MS this winter and I am really appreciative of the knowledge that the system is forcing me to acquire.
01-02-06, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Lawyer's Spirit
Any of the complexities that have been described about MegaSquirt are truly a bonus. The fact that you have the option to actually build the entire system will only benefit the user for years to come since s/he will not be dependant on anyone else for future repairs tuning etc.
It is impossible to build and install a MS and not end up being more knowledgable about EFI than most of the users on this board. In my eyes this is a great benefit.
But if it is plug and play that you value then I agree that other systems are better in that regard.(for the time being)
I am building my own MS this winter and I am really appreciative of the knowledge that the system is forcing me to acquire.
It is impossible to build and install a MS and not end up being more knowledgable about EFI than most of the users on this board. In my eyes this is a great benefit.
But if it is plug and play that you value then I agree that other systems are better in that regard.(for the time being)
I am building my own MS this winter and I am really appreciative of the knowledge that the system is forcing me to acquire.
01-02-06, 01:30 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by MARTIN
Just because you build the system doesnt make you more knowledgeable in EFI tuning... IT will help you out with other projects similiar to that but thats it.
Why are you a hater? I'll grant you that the MT and HT are more professional, but the MS can be just as much.
01-02-06, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Parastie
True, but the MSnS runs fuel/spark, is fully programmable and costs around $300. It uses built in MAP sensor and can use all other stock sensors. You could probably get it to use the stock MAP with a few changes. Tuning is very simple and can datalog with a laptop. The tuning software is also completely free.
Why are you a hater? I'll grant you that the MT and HT are more professional, but the MS can be just as much.
Why are you a hater? I'll grant you that the MT and HT are more professional, but the MS can be just as much.
01-02-06, 08:48 PM
#35
I plan on getting a MS sometime, too. I love the idea that I get to build it all (I want to test out my class 3 soldering skills) plus I love DIY stuff. As for peoples bad experiences, there will always be people with bad experiences with things. I know people that have horror stories about trying to use a computer, but that doesn't mean they are bad. Anyway, it basically comes down to what you want in a standalone. Whats a plus for some is a downpoint for others.
Last edited by Sideways7; 01-02-06 at 08:50 PM.
01-03-06, 12:23 PM
#37
RX-7 Alumni
I'm currently using a Megasquirt for fuel only--it works great. Building the unit was an educational and rewarding experience. Soon I'll be running the stock FC ignition setup also. EGT, rotary ignition, electronic boost control are bonus features, but yes, you have to build them in. Right now MS is on the edge of becoming more and more popular within the rotary community.
The user interface, Megatune, is very good software and rivals anything out there for aftermarket ECU's. Best of all since everything is open source, changes can be made for custom use--much like the rotary ignition is doing right now.
Muythaibxr, the Megasquirt mod, has put in some changes for injector transition to help remove the well-known hesistation (that's really another topic but many ECU's have it also). Soon we'll totally have the hesitation wiped out--more on this later. Try getting Haltech or Microtec to do something like that for your ECU--good luck.
The biggest downside I see for Megasquirt is you need to have descent electronics and computer knowledge and you will need to build or wire the unit unless you have someone to do it for you.
But when it comes down to bang for the buck, Megasquirt is best. If cost is not an issue and you want an easy install, go with a full aftermarket ECU like Haltech, Wolf, or Microtech--all of them, including Megasquirt will need to be tuned.
Best of Luck,
Scott
The user interface, Megatune, is very good software and rivals anything out there for aftermarket ECU's. Best of all since everything is open source, changes can be made for custom use--much like the rotary ignition is doing right now.
Muythaibxr, the Megasquirt mod, has put in some changes for injector transition to help remove the well-known hesistation (that's really another topic but many ECU's have it also). Soon we'll totally have the hesitation wiped out--more on this later. Try getting Haltech or Microtec to do something like that for your ECU--good luck.
The biggest downside I see for Megasquirt is you need to have descent electronics and computer knowledge and you will need to build or wire the unit unless you have someone to do it for you.
But when it comes down to bang for the buck, Megasquirt is best. If cost is not an issue and you want an easy install, go with a full aftermarket ECU like Haltech, Wolf, or Microtech--all of them, including Megasquirt will need to be tuned.
Best of Luck,
Scott
01-03-06, 12:39 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by Rex4Life
I'm currently using a Megasquirt for fuel only--it works great. Building the unit was an educational and rewarding experience. Soon I'll be running the stock FC ignition setup also. EGT, rotary ignition, electronic boost control are bonus features, but yes, you have to build them in. Right now MS is on the edge of becoming more and more popular within the rotary community.
The user interface, Megatune, is very good software and rivals anything out there for aftermarket ECU's. Best of all since everything is open source, changes can be made for custom use--much like the rotary ignition is doing right now.
Muythaibxr, the Megasquirt mod, has put in some changes for injector transition to help remove the well-known hesistation (that's really another topic but many ECU's have it also). Soon we'll totally have the hesitation wiped out--more on this later. Try getting Haltech or Microtec to do something like that for your ECU--good luck.
The biggest downside I see for Megasquirt is you need to have descent electronics and computer knowledge and you will need to build or wire the unit unless you have someone to do it for you.
But when it comes down to bang for the buck, Megasquirt is best. If cost is not an issue and you want an easy install, go with a full aftermarket ECU like Haltech, Wolf, or Microtech--all of them, including Megasquirt will need to be tuned.
Best of Luck,
Scott
The user interface, Megatune, is very good software and rivals anything out there for aftermarket ECU's. Best of all since everything is open source, changes can be made for custom use--much like the rotary ignition is doing right now.
Muythaibxr, the Megasquirt mod, has put in some changes for injector transition to help remove the well-known hesistation (that's really another topic but many ECU's have it also). Soon we'll totally have the hesitation wiped out--more on this later. Try getting Haltech or Microtec to do something like that for your ECU--good luck.
The biggest downside I see for Megasquirt is you need to have descent electronics and computer knowledge and you will need to build or wire the unit unless you have someone to do it for you.
But when it comes down to bang for the buck, Megasquirt is best. If cost is not an issue and you want an easy install, go with a full aftermarket ECU like Haltech, Wolf, or Microtech--all of them, including Megasquirt will need to be tuned.
Best of Luck,
Scott
01-03-06, 01:20 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by MARTIN
Try getting a microtech to do what??? They come with the best basemap I have ever seen..
Originally Posted by MARTIN
If you have stock injectors you will not notice a difference between this and the stock ecu...
.
01-03-06, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by TitosToy
think he means the 3800rpm hesitation
his point was with the megaquirt you can get rid of the hesitation easier as with the MT and others it would be harder.
.
his point was with the megaquirt you can get rid of the hesitation easier as with the MT and others it would be harder.
.
There is no hesitation with the MT.... No need to do anything other than wire it in and crank the car... IF you have bigger injectors just lower the duty cycle.... Simple as that...
01-03-06, 01:59 PM
#41
Originally Posted by TitosToy
i'm deciding which one to buy, the microtech or the haltech. i've been told that with the microtech you're able to use the stock coils but you cant with the haltech. also i've been told that microtech has 2 settings(1 for load and the other for crusing) but haltech has only the load. can anyone here shed some insight on that?
The Haltech E6X has full 3D mapping. 32 load bands, and 16 rpm bands, with interpolation between each point. Depending on what MAP sensor you use, the load bands will be divided differently between vaccuum and boost. You don't need 2 'settings'.
The E11 has even more.
Originally Posted by dennis blackstone
thanks i hear good things about the haltech does it come with anti flooding like the wolf 3d
01-03-06, 02:25 PM
#42
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Originally Posted by MARTIN
Try getting a microtech to do what??? They come with the best basemap I have ever seen.. If you have stock injectors you will not notice a difference between this and the stock ecu...
01-03-06, 02:28 PM
#43
MegaSquirt Mod
Originally Posted by MARTIN
I guess.... BTW just a question on MS... how accurate is the timing??
01-03-06, 02:37 PM
#44
MegaSquirt Mod
Also, my plug 'n play units will be available in the next few days without a base-map, and in maybe a week, I'll have an S4 base-map (for a stock S4). By tonight I'll have about 5 units ready to be custom modified for whatever features people want me to include. In the next week or so I'll have 5 - 7 more... and I'm working on a deal with someone to build the base units for me, so all I have to do is mod them... all that in order to handle more volume.
For now I (and a few friends) plan on selling them for $450 if I provide the stock connector, and $420 if you ship us a dead ECU to use the stock connector from.
We're mainly doing this as a service to people who aren't that electronically inclined.
And all the stuff people have said about the MS making you learn is true. If you just want to plug something in, and have it work, then I'm building the plug 'n play units, but the MS won't be any better/worse than any other ECU (well much better for the price, but that's not the point). IF you want to build one yourself, and learn a whole lot about how EFI works in the process, then you should look into building your own MS.
7 months ago, I didn't even know how to write assembly code, and now I'm adding features that make a noticable difference to the people using them (I fixed some issues with trailing ignition and made it solid and usable, and added support for FD trailing... I'm working on adding rx8 ignition support, and I've added some other features, like the staging transition code)... The point is, you can't do what I've been able to learn and do on any other ECU...
For now I (and a few friends) plan on selling them for $450 if I provide the stock connector, and $420 if you ship us a dead ECU to use the stock connector from.
We're mainly doing this as a service to people who aren't that electronically inclined.
And all the stuff people have said about the MS making you learn is true. If you just want to plug something in, and have it work, then I'm building the plug 'n play units, but the MS won't be any better/worse than any other ECU (well much better for the price, but that's not the point). IF you want to build one yourself, and learn a whole lot about how EFI works in the process, then you should look into building your own MS.
7 months ago, I didn't even know how to write assembly code, and now I'm adding features that make a noticable difference to the people using them (I fixed some issues with trailing ignition and made it solid and usable, and added support for FD trailing... I'm working on adding rx8 ignition support, and I've added some other features, like the staging transition code)... The point is, you can't do what I've been able to learn and do on any other ECU...
01-03-06, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Parastie
Why on Earth would you spend $1000 on an ECU and run stock parts?
01-03-06, 02:50 PM
#46
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Originally Posted by muythaibxr
Also, my plug 'n play units will be available in the next few days without a base-map, and in maybe a week, I'll have an S4 base-map (for a stock S4). By tonight I'll have about 5 units ready to be custom modified for whatever features people want me to include. In the next week or so I'll have 5 - 7 more... and I'm working on a deal with someone to build the base units for me, so all I have to do is mod them... all that in order to handle more volume.
For now I (and a few friends) plan on selling them for $450 if I provide the stock connector, and $420 if you ship us a dead ECU to use the stock connector from.
We're mainly doing this as a service to people who aren't that electronically inclined.
And all the stuff people have said about the MS making you learn is true. If you just want to plug something in, and have it work, then I'm building the plug 'n play units, but the MS won't be any better/worse than any other ECU (well much better for the price, but that's not the point). IF you want to build one yourself, and learn a whole lot about how EFI works in the process, then you should look into building your own MS.
7 months ago, I didn't even know how to write assembly code, and now I'm adding features that make a noticable difference to the people using them (I fixed some issues with trailing ignition and made it solid and usable, and added support for FD trailing... I'm working on adding rx8 ignition support, and I've added some other features, like the staging transition code)... The point is, you can't do what I've been able to learn and do on any other ECU...
For now I (and a few friends) plan on selling them for $450 if I provide the stock connector, and $420 if you ship us a dead ECU to use the stock connector from.
We're mainly doing this as a service to people who aren't that electronically inclined.
And all the stuff people have said about the MS making you learn is true. If you just want to plug something in, and have it work, then I'm building the plug 'n play units, but the MS won't be any better/worse than any other ECU (well much better for the price, but that's not the point). IF you want to build one yourself, and learn a whole lot about how EFI works in the process, then you should look into building your own MS.
7 months ago, I didn't even know how to write assembly code, and now I'm adding features that make a noticable difference to the people using them (I fixed some issues with trailing ignition and made it solid and usable, and added support for FD trailing... I'm working on adding rx8 ignition support, and I've added some other features, like the staging transition code)... The point is, you can't do what I've been able to learn and do on any other ECU...
But I, for one, am not interested in building my own ecu and then writing code just to have my car running right... If I pay $1k for an ecu, its because all that work has been done for me, and I know it has been widely used on many different types of setups, and if I need help I can contact the company or go to an aussie site. But thats just my opinion, im sure you guys have alot of buyers inline and given some time, itll be widely used...
BTW, just for info, the MT is accurate to .2 deg, so if you want to run zero gap, I suggest you dont go lower than 1deg...
01-03-06, 02:58 PM
#47
MegaSquirt Mod
On the MS, the trailing will never fire before leading... you can use 0 deg split and not worry about trailing firing first.
You personally don't have to write any code to get it to work... you can request something from me or from one of the other MS people (like renns or on the msefi forum, jsmcortina), and if it's feasable and someone has time, it'll get done and I believe that the point of one of the other posters on this thread was that most of those other companies won't fix code problems or add features that quickly... they're not as accessible as the megasquirt community. The code as it is now though works very well.
the MS itself is already very widely used, but is just recently gaining popularity on the rotary because of the recent code additions that make it fully able to control all stock parts on a rotary engine. (I fixed and tested the trailing code in Aug, and just recently over the last 2 weeks added the staging transition code... and will be adding a little more to that as well)...
You personally don't have to write any code to get it to work... you can request something from me or from one of the other MS people (like renns or on the msefi forum, jsmcortina), and if it's feasable and someone has time, it'll get done and I believe that the point of one of the other posters on this thread was that most of those other companies won't fix code problems or add features that quickly... they're not as accessible as the megasquirt community. The code as it is now though works very well.
the MS itself is already very widely used, but is just recently gaining popularity on the rotary because of the recent code additions that make it fully able to control all stock parts on a rotary engine. (I fixed and tested the trailing code in Aug, and just recently over the last 2 weeks added the staging transition code... and will be adding a little more to that as well)...
01-03-06, 03:11 PM
#49
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Originally Posted by muythaibxr
On the MS, the trailing will never fire before leading... you can use 0 deg split and not worry about trailing firing first.
You personally don't have to write any code to get it to work... you can request something from me or from one of the other MS people (like renns or on the msefi forum, jsmcortina), and if it's feasable and someone has time, it'll get done and I believe that the point of one of the other posters on this thread was that most of those other companies won't fix code problems or add features that quickly... they're not as accessible as the megasquirt community. The code as it is now though works very well.
the MS itself is already very widely used, but is just recently gaining popularity on the rotary because of the recent code additions that make it fully able to control all stock parts on a rotary engine. (I fixed and tested the trailing code in Aug, and just recently over the last 2 weeks added the staging transition code... and will be adding a little more to that as well)...
You personally don't have to write any code to get it to work... you can request something from me or from one of the other MS people (like renns or on the msefi forum, jsmcortina), and if it's feasable and someone has time, it'll get done and I believe that the point of one of the other posters on this thread was that most of those other companies won't fix code problems or add features that quickly... they're not as accessible as the megasquirt community. The code as it is now though works very well.
the MS itself is already very widely used, but is just recently gaining popularity on the rotary because of the recent code additions that make it fully able to control all stock parts on a rotary engine. (I fixed and tested the trailing code in Aug, and just recently over the last 2 weeks added the staging transition code... and will be adding a little more to that as well)...
But heres the thing... Im giving my opinion as a buyer/user, you are advertising a product that you are selling... But w.e. Im not here to bash on any system... They all have their benefits and the buyer decides which one outweighs the other... There is some good info and opinions on this thread, especially from the ms guys, so I hope he uses it acordingly..
01-03-06, 03:19 PM
#50
MegaSquirt Mod
Well, I'm not really advertising, I'm just saying that a plug 'n play megasquirt option will very soon be available...
My main point is that bang for the buck (the point of this thread) you can't get better than a Megasquirt, especially if you build it yourself (about $190 for the parts, plus maybe $30 for additional parts, and about a day to assemble the MS.... and about a day or 2 to build the wiring harness or splice into the stock one.)
I will agree that no matter what the car, installing a megasquirt on it by yourself can be a trying task... It's been less than a year since support for a lot of cars' ignition systems has become available though... Before that the MS was fuel only unless you wanted to run EDIS or an older distributor-based setup.... so maybe thats the "ignition problem"
The MS is very "bleeding edge" a lot of the time, but honestly, it's a full Standalone EMS for $450 pre-built, and around $220 if you build it yourself.... even if you buy it pre-built it's hard to beat that price..... and if you build it yourself, you literally can't beat that price for a full standalone.
My main point is that bang for the buck (the point of this thread) you can't get better than a Megasquirt, especially if you build it yourself (about $190 for the parts, plus maybe $30 for additional parts, and about a day to assemble the MS.... and about a day or 2 to build the wiring harness or splice into the stock one.)
I will agree that no matter what the car, installing a megasquirt on it by yourself can be a trying task... It's been less than a year since support for a lot of cars' ignition systems has become available though... Before that the MS was fuel only unless you wanted to run EDIS or an older distributor-based setup.... so maybe thats the "ignition problem"
The MS is very "bleeding edge" a lot of the time, but honestly, it's a full Standalone EMS for $450 pre-built, and around $220 if you build it yourself.... even if you buy it pre-built it's hard to beat that price..... and if you build it yourself, you literally can't beat that price for a full standalone.
Last edited by muythaibxr; 01-03-06 at 03:22 PM.