ColumbusTurboTwo

iTrader: (7)

Do you guys have any tricks to set the timing with no marks on the pulley? There are no marks on it, not even a noticable notch. Does anyone have a method of setting the CAS/timing with no marks?

TIA
Berto

RotaMan99

Remove the main bolt from the shaft pulley. Locate the direction of the keyway slot and turn the pulley so that the keyway is pointing directly toward the passenger side of the motor or the exhaust manifold. You will also notice that 2 bolts on the pulley will line up vertically with the timing pin on the front cover.

Take a marker or somthing to mark the pulley directly under the pin. This is TDC. Now I forget exactly how to do it but you can use a protractor or something to measure the degrees from that mark to find out the degrees of timing. I will do some search to see if I can find that info out again.

Hope this helps.

HAILERS

OR....the bottom of this page: http://www.teamfc3s.org/info/articles/demystifying.html

Deviate from it a touch. It has you remove both Lead and Trail plugs for the rear rotor. You hand turn the motor and view the top hole til you see the apex seal in the middle of the hole (small hole to boot). Then put a mark on a piece of masking tape attached to the pulley rim.

Hand turn the pulley til the same apex seal appears in the lower sparkplug hole. Except this time, do not center the apex seal in the hole. Keep turning til the bottom of the apex seal rests in the bottom of the sparkplug hole. Then make a mark on a piece of masking tape attaached to the pulley rim.

YOu'd be amazed at the difference b/t the marks if marked with the apex seal in the middle of the Lead sparkplug hole vs the bottom of the Lead sparkplug hole.

Between both those marks, is TDC. Measure .198" from TDC to the left to locate five degrees ATDC. That's with looking towards the pulley i.e. aft at the pulley.

YOu don't have to pull the pulley hub off to do this, plus it's pretty accurate IF you put the apex seal in the bottom of the Lead sparkplug hole when measuring.

A good flashlight and an inspection mirror are what you need to do the job. Piece of cake.

FCKing1995

iTrader: (3)

I just went through this myself yesterday and the day before. I had painted over my marks by accident and had to use some laquer thinner to remove my paint. Luckily I could just barely see the remains of the 195k mile paint on the pullies. Tiny yellow spec and about an inch beside it a red speck. Good luck using this method, Im glad I didnt have to

ColumbusTurboTwo

iTrader: (7)

I was doing it wrong then, I read somewhere I had to line up the apex seal in the leading spark plug hole for the front rotor and that was TDC, doh.

Hailer (or anyone) Why do I need to go 5deg ATC is that common practice?

How do I set the timing mark for the trailing spark plug?

HAILERS

No, you go to the rear rotor to find the timing for the FRONT rotor. See the first picture on that thread I gave you. See the front rotor and how it's combustion chamber is opposite the spark plugs and at the same time look at the rear rotor and how it's apex seal is b/t the sparkplug holes. Make sense???

Just follow that fellows procedure BUT when you get the apex seal in the lower hole, make sure the apex seal is at the bottom of the sparkplug hole.

Timing on a RX series four and five is 5 degrees ATDC for the LEAD and 20 degrees ATDC for the Trail.

Memory here: IF you measure 0.196 inches to the left of TDC mark when looking into the front of the pulley, and Trail is 0.7872 to the left of the TDC mark.

All you need to do is set the LEAD mark and the rest will take care of itself.

mightymite

iTrader: (1)

i used the flywheel and its counter weight to find tdc

HAILERS

With the engine in the car????????

MARTIN

the pulleys are notched for the marks.. Take out the pulley and look around for the indentation. These methods are good and all but its easiest just to check the pulley. Even if you paint over it, you should still be able to see the mark.

HAILERS

Attached are two jpg.

The first one shows the REAR rotor and it's position when your viewing the apex seal in the Trail then the Lead holes. I'm showing the rotor in TDC position. See how one sparkplug hole is closer to the apex seal????? I put a small brazing rod thru both sparkplug holes and have an arrow showing them.

The next jpg is of the FRONT rotor and it's position at the same moment the rear rotor is as shown in the first jpg. IT is in the position opposite the sparkplugs and is the combustion *stroke* so to speak.

I only posted these jpg to show, that one sparkplug hole is closer to the apex seal than the other sparkplug hole, when your at TDC. Thru this jpg I'm trying to explain WHY you need to put the apex seal at the bottom of the Lead hole when searching for TDC. If you do that, the TDC mark will be much more accurate than if you put the apex seal in the MIDDLE of the LEAD hole and then marked the pulley.

RotaMan99

I know I wouldn't be able to stick my head down there to see through the spark holes

The keyway idea is a little easier to see and find for me.

If you have the stock ignition, you don't need to worry about that since you can't change it any how.

HAILERS

Flashlight and mirror.

Ever take a front eccentric shaft bolt out before? Ain't all that easy compared to the flashlight and mirror.

The keyway pointing to the right side of the engine isn't all that accurate. How do you know you have it exactly 90 degrees to the right? Close maybe, but not accurate. You could be out over twenty degrees and think its exactly 90 degrees to the right side of the engine.

Trail mark would have been something like .800 inch to the right of the TDC mark. Actually a few thou less than that. But if Lead is set right then trail will be where it should be.

About the keyway.........I've played with that with the engine out, pan off, sitting on a perfectly flat surface, hub off. I measured from the flat surface to the center of the hub and got that measurement. Then turned the eccentric shaft til the middle of the keyway matched the measurement I got above. Trust me, just moving that eccentric shaft a touch makes for a large degree difference at the pin/pulley marks.

I still don't have the perfect answer on finding EXACTLY within an nats ***, TDC.

Actually my car works just fine at the marks that came with the pulley. Just shooting the breeze.

ColumbusTurboTwo

iTrader: (7)

HAILERS:
Have you tried doing this procedure and comparing it with the marks on your pulley?

I had some very faint notches on the pulley. TDC was located about 1 inch to the right of the first notch.

You said to rotate 0.198" to the left to find 5 deg ATDC. Is this clockwise or counter clockwise? I would think that you would need to rotate the pulley counter clockwise, then stab the CAS.


Rotaman99:
For the pulley method I have to remove the 19mm bolt on the end of the eccentric shaft right? From what I understand this could be bad because of a washer/thrust bearing that might be misplaced when removing the bolt.

HAILERS

If you can see the two marks, then I'd use them.

IF you use the method in the link I gave, then five degrees ATDC would be approx 0.198 inch to the left of the mark you made as TDC. That would be looking into the pulley face or if you want looking to the rear of the engine. And Trail should be about 0.8 inch to the left of the mark you made as TDC.

I always turn the engine in the direction that the engine turns when running. Clockwise if your looking aft and anti clockwise if looking fwd.

When I found TDC using the method in the link, I used masking tape on the ridge of the pulley and made the two marks on the tape. Then measured the distance b/t the two marks using a FLEXIBLE scale that reads in 100ths.

ColumbusTurboTwo

iTrader: (7)

I have two marks but I can't remember if my buddy that was helping me with my car saw a faint mark and proceeded to make a notch with a file. I wanted to double check.

If you find TDC and then turn the pulley clockwise and then stabbing the CAS you are retarding the timing. Am i wrong?

regards
Berto

HAILERS

I suppose.

What you should do, is find TDC, then stab the CAS.

THEN with a timing light, and the engine running at a idle speed well below 1000 rpm and a hot engine, turn the cas in it's bore til the LEAD mark on the pulley is opposite the fixed pin.

You turn the cas clockwise to advance the timing and counterclockwise to retard it.

By the way, if you find TDC using the method in the thread I gave you, the two marks will be pretty far apart. That's why I used a flexable scale in 100ths. So it would bend with the circumfurance of the pulley to make an accurate measurement b/t those two points marked on the masking tape.

ColumbusTurboTwo

iTrader: (7)

I used a zip tie, marked both marks on the zip tie then measured half way outside the engine bay. Lined up the marks and drew TDC on the pulley. So just stab the CAS at TDC using the method you gave me and that should be enough to get her to start?

RotaMan99

There are 2 bolts the will line up vertically with the timing pin. This is when you know you are close. Our eyes can only do so much and a straight edge doesn't work all the well when you don't know if the straight edge your using is perfectly vertical I suppose its up to the owner which method to use, but only know that you may not have the exact degree marked.

Yes definatley. You didn't try swapping pulleys did you? For some reason, if you swap only the pulley the timing marks will NOT line up. I don't know why but they don't. I never tried swapping the pulley and hub at the same time though to see if the marks lined up them. Anyone have insight to this?

You only have to worry about the needle bearing if you allow the pulley hub or shaft to to move seporatly of each other. OTher then that you do not have to worry.

You said you have fadded marks. Use those. You will be better off.