Rotary Resurrection
07-12-11, 05:01 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Rotary Resurrection
Has anyone ever used rotary resurrection for a re-build? I'd like some feed back on his work and what not. I might be sending my motor in since I'm running out of time to re-build it myself. Thanks in advance guys.
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07-13-11, 01:12 PM
#9
I had my engine rebuilt by him a few years ago as well. Its a good deal, but now oil is leaking from my rear iron and I have only put about 1000 miles on it. Not sure what the issue is, but i'm told my rear plate could be cracked. I can't really blame him if that's the case, but I would have hoped he'd catch it...
07-13-11, 01:22 PM
#10
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Thread Starter
So what I'm getting from this thread is that there have been some hit and miss projects that he's done? Is that okay to assume? I don't want to start an all-out war on the thread lol, I'd just like some info before I ship my engine off to Tennessee.
07-13-11, 01:22 PM
#11
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I had my engine rebuilt by him a few years ago as well. Its a good deal, but now oil is leaking from my rear iron and I have only put about 1000 miles on it. Not sure what the issue is, but i'm told my rear plate could be cracked. I can't really blame him if that's the case, but I would have hoped he'd catch it...
(Just asking... Not looking to start anything.)
07-13-11, 01:26 PM
#12
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I shipped mine in small-block form. I think this is preferred. I sent it from a place of business... (A lumber yard that I used to work at) and had it shipped back there when the engine returned. I think you can get better shipping rates if shipped to a business address.
07-13-11, 02:01 PM
#13
Rotary Enthusiast
I drove mine down, sat around and shot the **** with him for a while. He's an alright guy. He can be pretty straight forward sometimes haha.
If the rear iron was cracked, I say it happened after running a bit. If it was cracked prior then oil would have leaked sooner than that.
If the rear iron was cracked, I say it happened after running a bit. If it was cracked prior then oil would have leaked sooner than that.
07-13-11, 02:23 PM
#14
One guy posts up that he has an oil leak in a Landers rebuild that has sat for several years with little use. Some one told him it could be a cracked iron. It could be lot's of things.
Keven Landers does good work. He rebuilds lots of engines. He was an early proponent of reusing used rotor housings and irons. By reusing parts he was able to do a lower cost rebuild. This caused lots of controversy: Criticism from other rebuilders who honestly thought it was a bad idea (and who were getting undercut on price), criticism from 'bench racers' who didn't know sic-em from c-mere, etc.
Keven has a no nonsense attitude that is refreshing, irritating or appalling, depending on your view.
If I was paying for a rebuild, I would have no doubt about the quality of his work or about his integrity. My only concern would be the additional cost of shipping to Tennessee.
That said, there are local Dallas guys who rebuild engines. You won't have to eat the freight costs, so you can spend more on the engine and nothing on freight. You also get to deal with a local guy.
Good Luck on your decision.
07-13-11, 02:29 PM
#15
Ban Peak
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www.*************.com He's active on that forum.
I never heard anything bad about his work. He and the mods here just got in many pissing and big dick contests and it ended up in him being banned. He got too worked up in the drama here.
Edit: WOW! I didn't know it was like that, if you post a link for the "other site" it does that.
That would be www.Rota/ryca/rclub.com Take out the /'s and that's the address.
I never heard anything bad about his work. He and the mods here just got in many pissing and big dick contests and it ended up in him being banned. He got too worked up in the drama here.
Edit: WOW! I didn't know it was like that, if you post a link for the "other site" it does that.
That would be www.Rota/ryca/rclub.com Take out the /'s and that's the address.
07-13-11, 02:37 PM
#16
Nothing to see here.
+1 for Kevin. He is an honest and good person on top of being an excellent builder. Many years ago, I drove my FC to his house in Tenn. from Florida. I spent the weekend at the house as we tore down and he rebuilt my engine over two days. Started it back up on a Sunday and drove her home for the break-in period 
07-13-11, 04:29 PM
#17
Alright, let me be a bit more clear. The leak is small, and it is leaking out from near the bottom of the oil pedestal, but the pedestal IS NOT CAUSING IT. That being said, what else is there? rear iron. Also, I was not told this buy "some guy" I was told this by the owner of Banzai Racing after he did some other work on my car. This leak developed at around 1000 miles, but there are almost 2000 on it now and it hasn't got any worse.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
07-13-11, 05:05 PM
#18
Alright, let me be a bit more clear. The leak is small, and it is leaking out from near the bottom of the oil pedestal, but the pedestal IS NOT CAUSING IT. That being said, what else is there? rear iron. Also, I was not told this buy "some guy" I was told this by the owner of Banzai Racing after he did some other work on my car. This leak developed at around 1000 miles, but there are almost 2000 on it now and it hasn't got any worse.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
S4 or S5?
Not that it matters, you feel bad about the situation, I understand you don't think the deal worked out for you.
Just thinking out loud though: if Landers says you have a bad part, he gets to sell you a better part. You will be happier with a part that works than one that doesn't work and makes you happy. So everyone wins if he replaces a part. At this point, it seems that the key issue is whether you think Kevin has the skills and the integrity to rebuild the engine.
If you search this forum, you will find someone upset at any of the engine rebuilders-Adkin, Pineapple, even a recent thread regarding Mazda Authorized Remans.
Healthy discussion here.
07-13-11, 06:05 PM
#19
Well see here's how it goes.
Customer says "I have x dollars to spend" Kevin says "ok to meet that budget the best I can do is reuse [whatever parts], but you know it's not going to last as long as new parts right?" Customer says "ok.". Well, engine doesn't meet the customer's [optimistic] expectations and he gets blamed. However the parts he used met the factory specs, generally speaking.
The thing you have to realize is that there are wide acceptable tolerances for parts and competent engine builders can disagree on whether they would reuse something. A part can be "in spec" and thus usable, but it's not going to last as long something at near-new condition. Kevin may chooses to reuse the part to meet a customer's budget and then he gets blamed when the customer never paid for nice parts in the first place.
Kevin's other option would be to go "upmarket" and say "I will only build the motor if you replace these parts even though they are technically usable" and then he would lose part of his business. It's not an easy choice from a business perspective. He definitely got hit with a lot of internet trash-talking as a result of serving some of the lower-budget customers.
As far as his problems with the site operators, it had to do with rules requiring you to pay vendor fees. He is still active on rx8club and I can tell he is mindful about avoiding conflicts over such matters.
Customer says "I have x dollars to spend" Kevin says "ok to meet that budget the best I can do is reuse [whatever parts], but you know it's not going to last as long as new parts right?" Customer says "ok.". Well, engine doesn't meet the customer's [optimistic] expectations and he gets blamed. However the parts he used met the factory specs, generally speaking.
The thing you have to realize is that there are wide acceptable tolerances for parts and competent engine builders can disagree on whether they would reuse something. A part can be "in spec" and thus usable, but it's not going to last as long something at near-new condition. Kevin may chooses to reuse the part to meet a customer's budget and then he gets blamed when the customer never paid for nice parts in the first place.
Kevin's other option would be to go "upmarket" and say "I will only build the motor if you replace these parts even though they are technically usable" and then he would lose part of his business. It's not an easy choice from a business perspective. He definitely got hit with a lot of internet trash-talking as a result of serving some of the lower-budget customers.
As far as his problems with the site operators, it had to do with rules requiring you to pay vendor fees. He is still active on rx8club and I can tell he is mindful about avoiding conflicts over such matters.
07-13-11, 07:42 PM
#20
Alright, let me be a bit more clear. The leak is small, and it is leaking out from near the bottom of the oil pedestal, but the pedestal IS NOT CAUSING IT. That being said, what else is there? rear iron. Also, I was not told this buy "some guy" I was told this by the owner of Banzai Racing after he did some other work on my car. This leak developed at around 1000 miles, but there are almost 2000 on it now and it hasn't got any worse.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
In any case, I had an overall positive experience working with Kevin, but the overall premise of his business is more of the issue here. You use substandard (i.e. USED) parts and you will get unreliable results.
Yes he rebuilt my engine at a very low cost by reusing most of the parts, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that even if everything goes perfectly and the engine runs fine at his shop it could still break down in 1000 miles because your rear iron is still 20 years old and it decided to die right after a rebuild.
If I were to do another rebuild (and I will have to do one eventually if that rear iron is any indicator) I won't do a "budget rebuild" and I'll use new parts where possible. just my opinion but there you have it.
If you're not happy with someone's work, learn to do it yourself.
07-14-11, 08:28 AM
#22
I wouldn't call used parts substandard. Everything man made has a service life which is sometimes measured in miles. The easiest way to tell how much life a part has left in it is to measure it and inspect it for signs of failure. It's really hard/impossible to find a failure like the one causing your leak until it starts leaking. There is probably a hairline crack on the rear housing just under the oil pedestal. If you remove the filter and pedestal, clean and degrease the area, throw some baby powder on the spot and start the car...you'll see it. You can grind the crack with a cut off wheel or file and seal it with JB weld.
My point is simply this: you get what you pay for.
Kevin will do the rebuild using parts that other builders wont. The problem is not whether or not he does a good job. The problem is that by using old parts to conform to a lower budget some quality and reliability is inevitably sacrificed. There is no question about this, it is simply a fact.
Yes he's a great guy, and he even powdercoated some of my stuff for super cheap while I was getting my engine rebuilt. NO I would not get my engine rebuilt by him again UNLESS I used new parts. HOWEVER if I was going to do that I'd just skip the hassle of freight and do it somewhere locally.
That is the stupidest thing I've heard in a while. Do you think other companies live by this motto?
"oh my pipe exploded so I'll call the plumber. Plumber comes and does a shitty job then and the pipe breaks again in a week. Oh well, it's not the plumber's fault, its my own for not doing it myself" Yea.... that seems reasonable.
07-14-11, 09:12 AM
#23
Originally Posted by Osirus9
NO I would not get my engine rebuilt by him again UNLESS I used new parts. HOWEVER if I was going to do that I'd just skip the hassle of freight and do it somewhere locally.
But what does that have to do with the skill of the builder? They're not miracle workers you know. One valid point of discussion is how the used parts he sells compares to used parts sold by other builders, in terms of quality vs. price. If he is offering a motor where you pay for used housings, and the housings are noticeably worse than competitors housings but at the same cost, you would have more of a valid argument. But that is such a tough thing to compare.
Last edited by arghx; 07-14-11 at 09:20 AM. Reason: used parts
07-14-11, 09:14 AM
#24
That is the stupidest thing I've heard in a while. Do you think other companies live by this motto?
"oh my pipe exploded so I'll call the plumber. Plumber comes and does a shitty job then and the pipe breaks again in a week. Oh well, it's not the plumber's fault, its my own for not doing it myself" Yea.... that seems reasonable.
"oh my pipe exploded so I'll call the plumber. Plumber comes and does a shitty job then and the pipe breaks again in a week. Oh well, it's not the plumber's fault, its my own for not doing it myself" Yea.... that seems reasonable.
You could buy all new engine parts and still build an engine that doesn't run. Rotary Resurrection has a lot of experience and that's mainly what you're paying for.
07-14-11, 09:45 AM
#25
How is this any different from shipping your motor to any other builder? I fail to see how this is an issue specific to Rotary Resurrection. He is providing the labor, you are providing the parts one way or another. If you give him a motor that had 150k on it and pay for only the minimum parts needed to make it run again (apex seals and soft seals), of course it's going to last a fraction of its original life.
But what does that have to do with the skill of the builder? They're not miracle workers you know. One valid point of discussion is how the used parts he sells compares to used parts sold by other builders, in terms of quality vs. price. If he is offering a motor where you pay for used housings, and the housings are noticeably worse than competitors housings but at the same cost, you would have more of a valid argument. But that is such a tough thing to compare.
But what does that have to do with the skill of the builder? They're not miracle workers you know. One valid point of discussion is how the used parts he sells compares to used parts sold by other builders, in terms of quality vs. price. If he is offering a motor where you pay for used housings, and the housings are noticeably worse than competitors housings but at the same cost, you would have more of a valid argument. But that is such a tough thing to compare.
All I'm saying is simply that using USED parts in a rebuild is a stupid idea. I've done it twice now with shitty results both times and it's just not worth it.
Also, the only reason I said I wouldn't use Kevin again is because of WHERE he is, not the quality of work he does. If I'm buying new parts anyway then I don't need to have Kevin do my rebuild do I? So why not save on shipping (which was about $150 each way for me, so not an insignificant expense) and do it local.
no
Last edited by Osirus9; 07-14-11 at 09:47 AM. Reason: added response