j200pruf

iTrader: (4)

And also can anyone make a suggestiong on what aftermarket radiators provide the best cooling.
And lastly is a question about e-fans. Everyone seems to rave about the black magic HD unit. But I here the ppl that like the stock clutch (which I do this is just for when it fails), that 2800cfm. is not as much as the stock fan. Well if you were to use two smaller fans that pulled 1650cfm each and gave them one half of the radiator to cool, would this be like having one 3300 CFM fan? I am pretty sure that I am wrong and this is a stupid idea, but I though it would be neat to have two smaller fans with their own ducts to a vented hood that looked like the later GT40's.

RoninAutoBoX

On my brother's Mazda Protege, i installed a 16" fan that pulled 2950 cfm, and a 12" that pulled 1650. I think that certainly equals or beats the stock fan. This type of setup is exactly what I am working on right now. I just have to get the shroud together, lest I overheat like a ****. I'll have some pics and a writeup once I am finished.

adamlewis

I have a Koyo radiator with a Black Magic 2800CFM fan. Im also missing the undertray ( the thing everyone says you NEED to have or else your car will run really hot... ).

My car rarely sees 190+°F

RoninAutoBoX

Put the undertray back on. Seriously. It may not make life or death of your engine, but you are so reducing the amount of air that your radiator sees at high speeds, and increasing your front end lift at those speeds as well. It will make your fan work less hard. Being that you have an E-Fan, it can compensate for just about any speed situation, however, I found that the E-Fans run a lot less often if you have radiator ducting in place.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

I have been very impressed with my Fluidyne rad, but be prepared to pay for it.

As for the efan, I only suggest you convert IF the stock fan fails. There is no advantage otherwise (save for space in the engine bay). Adding an efan will reduce airflow, and stress an already overstressed electrical system. Plus, efans are MUCH less reliable (more points of failure) then the stock clutch fam.

j200pruf

iTrader: (4)

Yeah, I will be switching when the clutch fan fails, or possibly when I will be needing more space in the engine compartment.

$150FC

I just don't like seeing the fan shroud. With an FD alternator, is there a problem running an electric fan?

j200pruf

iTrader: (4)

I am actually just going to have my alt. reqired, so I will have an insane amount power (electrical power that is).

Slammedblk7

iTrader: (7)

bah, just put it on if you've got the fan..i have mine running all the time at night i dont notice a difference, im running the fiero efan, it opens up room to work on everything, altough it may not cool as well but it does the job.

Rx-7Blazin

Sure it adds a little more stress on the electrical system but takes alot of stress off the engine. Stock fans work good to a point because you can have more air than the fan cal pull in coming in and all the fan is doing is slowing that air down(the fan cant spin fast enugh for how much air is hitting it putting strain on your engine). You can still use the stock fan clutch with a flex fan that will flex and make the blades get flat so there is not alot of stress on the engine trying to pull that air through

NZConvertible

You need to think about what you can actually fit onto the radiator. IIRC the radiator core is about 17" high, so you can fit one 16" fan, and 22" wide, so you could run two 10" fans. A 16" fan pulls a lot more air than two 10" ones, plus covers a much greater percentage of the core's area. Due to it's proportions, you should always run one big fan on an FC radiator. You're wrong. What do you think drives the alternator? That's right, the engine! Why do you think engine speed drops when the headlights or brakelights are switched on? It's because the engine has to work harder to drive the alternator when it's providing more current. You don't get nothing for free. Wrong again. As airflow through the radiator increases with road speed, the clutch disengages due to the lower air temp, so it's pretty much freewheeling and not putting any load on the engine. It also won't spin any faster once the engine's above ~3000rpm.

Rx-7Blazin

dude stock fans put drag on your engine thats why they made flex fans to reduce the amountt of stress on the engine when it is no longer needed. And YES it does rop power what do you think turns the fan? The engine, without the fan the engine doesnt have to turn the fan making less drag on the engine. I know that the alt. works off the engine just like the fan does so your trying to tell me that the alt. robs power but the fan doesnt? Dude that makes no sence anything run off the pullys from the eccentric shaft Wiich turns the rotors robs engine power(make sence), removing them frees up power, why do you think racers/autocrossers remove there stock fan replace it with an e-fan, remove the air pump ac and power stearing? to free up lost power being robbed from these systems so im sorry man your the one thats wrong.

c-squared

Clutch fans work far better than flex fans, and without the risk. They made flex fans because they are cheap to manufacture, basic to use, and easy to install.

Clutch fans respond to the air temperature they are subjected to, whereas a flex fan repsonds only according to engine rpm.

When the clutch fan system is not engaged, it free-wheels on a bearing system, making almost no friction, and thus robbing very little power. It is the same effect as the a/c compressor only being engaged when the a/c system is turned on, and thus only causing parasitic hp loss when the a/c system is turned on.

The cost of hp from running a free-wheeling pulley has been calculated and measured to be below 0.1 of a hp.

Autocrossers and circuit track racers remove the associated pumps for engine simplicity and lighter weight, as well as the constant parasytic loss from the power steering pump.

You are thinking of parasitic engine loss, which does not occur when the clutch fan is free-wheeling. Power is directly proportional to force. With your car cold, go out and spin the stock fan. Notice it takes almost no force to spin it, and it does not quickly slow down. Since it requires such little force, we know that it must use very little power.

The only reason to convert to an electric fan is for more room in the engine bay. There are no power gains. We have proved this through calculation and through extensive dyno testing. Please support your argument with engineered proof as I have provided, otherwise please retract your statement about which person is wrong.

*our dyno graphs actually show a COST of hp by switching to the electric fan, but this evidence is somewhat moot as the difference is well within the range of error between dyno readings.

Rx-7Blazin

I didnt say loss of hp i sayd drag on your engine, when you take all the accesories off you feel a difference in acceleration and throttle responce dont you? you may not see segnificant hp gains but you will be able to lanch better. its like lightning your flywheel less strain on you drive terrain. do you get what im saying.

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

Hey NZ knows what he's talking about.
Gees, I wish people would post if they KNOW what they're talking about. A clutch fan is not by FAR better than flex fans.
The stock clutch fans is often tossed in favor of electric fans. In reality this may not be such a good idea. A factory clutch fan and shroud flows more air than just about any electric fan set up. I have seen many people go out a buy electric fans because they had over heating problems. Then find out the problem is worse. If your car is running hot, find out the cause, the fan is probably no it. A new fan clutch is a whole lot cheaper than an electric fan. If the problem is a clogged, or too small radiator, buying a new fan is no solution. Bottom line here is that the factory did a lot of research and development on cooling systems and they use a belt driven clutch fan and shroud because it flows the most air. In turn, this allowed them to run slightly smaller radiators. I have not problem with using electric fans, but they do not move as much air as a stock clutch fan and shroud set up. Set up your whole cooling system with this in mind and you'll be fine, but just put one on your car and plan on loosing some cooling. If your cooling system was border line adequate before, an electric fan might just push it over the line. If you are having an over heating problem, don't even concede an electric fan until you find the problem.

My opinion on flex fans is, they are next to worthless. They can be better than a solid (no clutch) stock fan, and that is the only good thing I have to say about them. They are noisy, and offer little to no benefit over the factory clutch fan. They claim to move a lot of air at low-speeds and flatten out at high speeds to cause little drag. The air hitting the blades is what flattens them out and that takes power to do, so they must have some drag. Maybe not a lot, but certainly more than a clutch fan that is near free wheeling. I personally just do not like them. Flex fans are popular in certain race classes that require an engine driven fan due to the fact that they are light and can take very high rpm. The were popular for a while on the street, probablaby because they are so cheap and poeple always insist on buying the "race" parts for a street car. It is very important to do research on these kinds of parts.

Rx-7Blazin

well accualy flex fans flatten because of the rotating force not the air. Yall are trying to make me looks stupid read my last post where i clarify what im saying. Or tell me what is wrong with what i sayd. I am not saying anything is better than anything, i may have been mis informed on the fact that flex fans are not as good as stock(in cooling the engine). but they do have less drag on em reducing the amount of drag on the engine.

Icemark

as mentioned above, flex fans do not have less drag than a clutch type. You are mis-informed if you think so.

they have considerably more drag all the time and are not influenced by engine temps (as the better electric and clutch type fans are controlled by)

Rx-7Blazin

ok then i was misinformed but i mainly wanted to get the point across that a stock clutch type fan does create drag on your engine just like any other accessorie thats belt driven on your car and if remoed it provides less drag on your engine increasing accelleration times and engine responce times.

NZConvertible

Nobody's trying to make you look stupid, just point out that you're incorrect in your understanding of how the different types of fan work. Listen and learn. And use full stops.

Rx-7Blazin

i got the point about the flex fans its just you told me that taking a stock fan off does nothing to prevent drag on your engine thats why yall where trying to make me look stupid. Yes yall told me correcly on how a flex fan is compared to a stock fan i admit that.

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

Listen, no one here is making you look stupid especially NZ and Icemark. I respect their opinions and have NEVER seen them use the word "stupid" or make someone feel they are stupid in any of their posts. We are just stating that your interpretation of a flax fan and clutch fan is wrong. You need to lighten up a little .

Rx-7Blazin

Dude i told you i know that my interpritation of the flex fan and clutch fan was wrong I sayd that in my last post. Im not refering to that in revering to the fact of taking Accesories off your car is common knowlege that it will take stress off your driveline. see now yall are makin me look like a fool when i have explained more than once what im talking about and admitted to having something wrong and yall are bringing up that like i didnt say that i was wrong(which i sayd that i was) Read my other post before you tell me to lighten up dude

rx7raca

o man looks like things are getting hot in hereee, but what u say about the drag that a stock clutch makes is almost nothing. like someone said be4 its almost like .01 hp meaning very little to none. everybody in this thread is repeating what everyone is saying over and over, lets jus get the point across rite now.

stock fan- is good, almost NO drag
flex fan--- is cheap but still ok
e-fan----- reason for buying is to free up space, NOT to help make engine cooler.

now does everyone understand the difference?

...GOOD

geoff
by the way im keeping the stock fan!!maybe because im cheap i dunno

Dan H

Just curious, if I were to relocate the battery, will I be able to use the stock fan/shroud with an FMIC setup? Does anybody make any IC kits with the correct piping to do this?

I'd really like to keep the stock fan/shroud setup but if I have to, I will go with an E-fan.

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

You know what? I went through 3 electric fans and finally am using the Fiero fan but nothing comes close to a stock clutch fan. I *think* the new Greddy IC kit is able to go around the shroud.
The IC I'm using now is impossible to use the shroud.
There are pics of people who have installed the new Greddy kits. Try the search.