Question for the FC community
02-01-11, 11:37 AM
#1
Question for the FC community
How many of you would be interested in a harness repair/ refurbishment service, and what do you consider a fair price for said service?
Just so it's clear this isn't advertising just market research.
Here are some brief examples of what I'm talking about. these are some pics of a cut and slightly burned FD harness as well as a harness I built from scratch for a 2Jz swap into an FC http://www.flickr.com/photos/51476306@N04/page2/
As far as the service is concerned. harnesses would be de-loomed , Have any any broken or brittle wires are replaced or repaired. Replace up to 4 broken connectors for free ( except the OMP because it's expensive, and sometimes difficult to find ) And any additional broken connectors You would be contacted about in advance of work. Usually, you only have to be concerned about the fuel injectors, coil plugs, or CAS being broken and that's due to heat and old age. At this point the harness is wrapped in heat resistant electrical tape. then add an outer shell of heat resistant looming is added finally it's wrapped in another layer of heat resistant tape. At this point you have what's effectively a brand new harness. ( I can use other forms of loom similar to mesh netting which looks good and does a similar job. However, it's more expensive and I don't think it does as good a job protecting the wires since it's a mesh from dirt, oil or heat) . Any thing that needs to be spliced is either removed from the harness and replaced with fresh wire or spliced crimped then wrapped in heat-shrink to protect the connection from dust and moisture. This depends on the location and severity or the issue. I only use automotive grade wiring in 16- 10 gauge and EM shielded wiring for the o2 sensors and CAS, but these seldom if ever get damaged..
Cut harnesses could also be repaired but those tend to take more time. All that said, turn around would be reasonable All work photo documented with updates emailed to you and there would be a warranty on the work as well.
Just so it's clear this isn't advertising just market research.
Here are some brief examples of what I'm talking about. these are some pics of a cut and slightly burned FD harness as well as a harness I built from scratch for a 2Jz swap into an FC http://www.flickr.com/photos/51476306@N04/page2/
As far as the service is concerned. harnesses would be de-loomed , Have any any broken or brittle wires are replaced or repaired. Replace up to 4 broken connectors for free ( except the OMP because it's expensive, and sometimes difficult to find ) And any additional broken connectors You would be contacted about in advance of work. Usually, you only have to be concerned about the fuel injectors, coil plugs, or CAS being broken and that's due to heat and old age. At this point the harness is wrapped in heat resistant electrical tape. then add an outer shell of heat resistant looming is added finally it's wrapped in another layer of heat resistant tape. At this point you have what's effectively a brand new harness. ( I can use other forms of loom similar to mesh netting which looks good and does a similar job. However, it's more expensive and I don't think it does as good a job protecting the wires since it's a mesh from dirt, oil or heat) . Any thing that needs to be spliced is either removed from the harness and replaced with fresh wire or spliced crimped then wrapped in heat-shrink to protect the connection from dust and moisture. This depends on the location and severity or the issue. I only use automotive grade wiring in 16- 10 gauge and EM shielded wiring for the o2 sensors and CAS, but these seldom if ever get damaged..
Cut harnesses could also be repaired but those tend to take more time. All that said, turn around would be reasonable All work photo documented with updates emailed to you and there would be a warranty on the work as well.
02-01-11, 12:24 PM
#4
I'm sure there would be some interest. But not for $800 like Corksport. Not trying to knock CS or anything. (I actually really like their stuff.) But most FC owners are only FC owners because they're too broke to own an FD. So I'd take that into consideration. I think its pretty much going to come down to cost like 1sweet7 said.
02-01-11, 12:34 PM
#5
I'm sure there would be some interest. But not for $800 like Corksport. Not trying to knock CS or anything. (I actually really like their stuff.) But most FC owners are only FC owners because they're too broke to own an FD. So I'd take that into consideration. I think its pretty much going to come down to cost like 1sweet7 said.
02-01-11, 01:05 PM
#6
when it comes to FCs it really has to be appealing for you to get a response and some interest. you in fact will get tons of interest but it is what i call "fake interest" as you will only have a small percent of people who follow through with purchases. when it comes to FC wiring harnesses, even basically new i would say you will only get interest if you can keep the cost down to around $200-250 for basically a new TII loom and $150ish for an n/a loom. when it comes to FDs they are a little more deep in the pockets when it comes to more important things like electrical issues with the engine management system so $300-500 is feasable for something that is basically like new.
FCs have much less connectors than say an FD does so they aren't so difficult to repair and only a few get damaged often(typically just the injectors, water thermosensor, O2, BAC and ACV connectors are toasty on a TII loom) and those are relatively easy to find new. n/a's really only regularly have internal crimp connection issues which are easy to fix. n/a harnesses usually are in good to excellent condition unless some monkey nuts has been pulling connectors off without any care.
FCs have much less connectors than say an FD does so they aren't so difficult to repair and only a few get damaged often(typically just the injectors, water thermosensor, O2, BAC and ACV connectors are toasty on a TII loom) and those are relatively easy to find new. n/a's really only regularly have internal crimp connection issues which are easy to fix. n/a harnesses usually are in good to excellent condition unless some monkey nuts has been pulling connectors off without any care.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-01-11 at 01:08 PM.
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02-01-11, 01:08 PM
#8
when it comes to FCs it really has to be appealing for you to get a response and some interest. you in fact will get tons of interest but it is what i call "fake interest" as you will only have a small percent of people who follow through with purchases. when it comes to FC wiring harnesses, even basically new i would say you will only get interest if you can keep the cost down to around $200-250 for basically a new TII loom and $150ish for an n/a loom. when it comes to FDs they are a little more deep in the pockets when it comes to more important things like electrical issues with the engine management system so $300-500 is feasable for something that is basically like new.
FCs have much less connectors than say an FD does so they aren't so difficult to repair and only a few get damaged often. n/a's really only regularly have internal crimp connection issues which are easy to fix. n/a harnesses usually are in good to excellent condition unless some monkey nuts has been pulling connectors off without any care.
FCs have much less connectors than say an FD does so they aren't so difficult to repair and only a few get damaged often. n/a's really only regularly have internal crimp connection issues which are easy to fix. n/a harnesses usually are in good to excellent condition unless some monkey nuts has been pulling connectors off without any care.
02-01-11, 01:14 PM
#9
there's usually only about 5 connectors on the TII harnesses that need to be replaced which i edited in that post. the only more specific one is the BAC connector, the injectors and thermosensor are all basic bosch/denso style clips which can be upgraded to various styles to prevent premature future failures. the ACV connectors are basic T junction connectors which are common in just about any electrical industry and should cost no more than about $.50 each in even semi bulk pricing.
just keep in mind that there is more on the S5 wiring harness than the S4 as it uses a 2 step TPS, electronic boost solenoid and 2 EOMP connectors but those rarely fail.
just keep in mind that there is more on the S5 wiring harness than the S4 as it uses a 2 step TPS, electronic boost solenoid and 2 EOMP connectors but those rarely fail.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-01-11 at 01:18 PM.
02-01-11, 03:31 PM
#10
there's usually only about 5 connectors on the TII harnesses that need to be replaced which i edited in that post. the only more specific one is the BAC connector, the injectors and thermosensor are all basic bosch/denso style clips which can be upgraded to various styles to prevent premature future failures. the ACV connectors are basic T junction connectors which are common in just about any electrical industry and should cost no more than about $.50 each in even semi bulk pricing.
just keep in mind that there is more on the S5 wiring harness than the S4 as it uses a 2 step TPS, electronic boost solenoid and 2 EOMP connectors but those rarely fail.
just keep in mind that there is more on the S5 wiring harness than the S4 as it uses a 2 step TPS, electronic boost solenoid and 2 EOMP connectors but those rarely fail.
02-01-11, 05:48 PM
#11
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Now woukd this be the entire harness including all emissions connections and stuff? What if one were to just want the emissions harness rebuilt would the price drop substancially since it is nowhere as big as the entire harness from the ecu onwards.
That is the situation i find myself in. My main harness is in great shape but eberything on top of the engine controlling emissions, water thermk, things like that are shot.
That is the situation i find myself in. My main harness is in great shape but eberything on top of the engine controlling emissions, water thermk, things like that are shot.
02-01-11, 08:22 PM
#12
Now woukd this be the entire harness including all emissions connections and stuff? What if one were to just want the emissions harness rebuilt would the price drop substancially since it is nowhere as big as the entire harness from the ecu onwards.
That is the situation i find myself in. My main harness is in great shape but eberything on top of the engine controlling emissions, water thermk, things like that are shot.
That is the situation i find myself in. My main harness is in great shape but eberything on top of the engine controlling emissions, water thermk, things like that are shot.
02-02-11, 12:48 AM
#13
dark side i sense in him
My FC is a total nightmare. Plan on taking the motor out to rebuild. While it is out, I do want to redo the whole electrical system, having a ready and new harness would cut out half the work, so ya, I would be interested.
02-02-11, 01:30 AM
#15
I've actually been considering doing that. Having S4 and S5 harnesses available would be great, but there would have to be a core charge of some sort.
I'll have to look through my files to see if there are any major differences between the US and JDM harnesses. Off the top of my head I don't remember there being any, but it is 2:30 am. Again great idea, I'll have to keep it in mind.
I'll have to look through my files to see if there are any major differences between the US and JDM harnesses. Off the top of my head I don't remember there being any, but it is 2:30 am. Again great idea, I'll have to keep it in mind.
02-02-11, 01:42 AM
#16
i just used my n/a harness with my jdm swap. however i had to length some wires. mainly the bac. the o2 sensor wire is a little tight. as well as some other wires that i can't think of. however if it is priced right people may buy it to stay cleaner or their n/a harness is worn or broken.
02-02-11, 10:22 AM
#17
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I definitely have an interest! It'll be a little while before I pull everything out... but I've been looking to no avail for new harnesses everywhere! If one were available it'd save me a lot of time...
Soooo count me in in a few months. ^_^
Soooo count me in in a few months. ^_^
02-02-11, 11:24 AM
#18
It seems a system like this would have to be tailored to each consumer. As everyone has a different goal in mind, they are all going to want something different out of their harness. Some will want a complete rebuilt/refurbished stock harness. Others may want a new harness but with all emissions related wires and connectors removed. You may have to have some sort of a la carte pricing, so to speak, if you were to move forward after receiving serious interest.
02-02-11, 11:39 AM
#19
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I am very interested in this. Now that there is the option on running a power FC with the banzi patch harness people should be jumping on this. No more excuses of I don't trust the stock harness because my harness is crap. And if it is priced at $400+ cheeper the CS you would be crazy not to do this. Is there any way you could but FJO injector drivers in the harness so people could use low impedance injectors?
02-02-11, 12:16 PM
#20
I am very interested in this. Now that there is the option on running a power FC with the banzi patch harness people should be jumping on this. No more excuses of I don't trust the stock harness because my harness is crap. And if it is priced at $400+ cheeper the CS you would be crazy not to do this. Is there any way you could but FJO injector drivers in the harness so people could use low impedance injectors?
if its something like 300 then sure why not. cut my work time significantly.
02-03-11, 04:41 PM
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I think the problem is that for many with whom this has been a serious problem have probably already switched to a standalone that will offer more freedom in tuning. I just don't see it being worth it to remove and then re-install a whole harness to fix a few questionable wires that many of us would be content with using crimp connectors and shrink wrap to fix.
As for adapter looms to allow for s4/s5 swaps and easier standalone/piggyback EMS installations, you might actually have something there. In this case people are just trying to get something to work, and this would make life A LOT easier. I had to fabricate a whole new harness to run my EMS, but I would have jumped at the chance of using an adapter loom, but Microtech didn't make one.
As for adapter looms to allow for s4/s5 swaps and easier standalone/piggyback EMS installations, you might actually have something there. In this case people are just trying to get something to work, and this would make life A LOT easier. I had to fabricate a whole new harness to run my EMS, but I would have jumped at the chance of using an adapter loom, but Microtech didn't make one.
02-03-11, 06:57 PM
#25
I think the problem is that for many with whom this has been a serious problem have probably already switched to a standalone that will offer more freedom in tuning. I just don't see it being worth it to remove and then re-install a whole harness to fix a few questionable wires that many of us would be content with using crimp connectors and shrink wrap to fix.
As for adapter looms to allow for s4/s5 swaps and easier standalone/piggyback EMS installations, you might actually have something there. In this case people are just trying to get something to work, and this would make life A LOT easier. I had to fabricate a whole new harness to run my EMS, but I would have jumped at the chance of using an adapter loom, but Microtech didn't make one.
As for adapter looms to allow for s4/s5 swaps and easier standalone/piggyback EMS installations, you might actually have something there. In this case people are just trying to get something to work, and this would make life A LOT easier. I had to fabricate a whole new harness to run my EMS, but I would have jumped at the chance of using an adapter loom, but Microtech didn't make one.