BLKTOPTRVL

You know, I wonder if I were to take the pulley hub to a machinist and have him insert a plug into the bore hole and keyway, and then cut splines into it?

TonyD89

iTrader: (10)

Is the diameter the right size? If it is, it might work anyways. If the fit is good on the diameter, the grooves won't really matter.

BLKTOPTRVL

Diameter is good, but now way to lock the pulley with the keyway.

TonyD89

iTrader: (10)

Ahhh, no key way, my bad.

I edited to say a keyway is most likely cheaper than splines. Splines are very expensive..

BLKTOPTRVL

Agreed. Which is why I find it interesting that newer pumps are splined when the don't really need to be. A key would do just as well.

Anyway.

I just spoke to a sales engineer at a gear company. (I was looking for a inside geared collar that could go over the splined shaft, and fit inside the pulley hub.

The salesman suggest that instead, I just look for an oilite (soft bronze) collar that will fit inside the pulley and can be pressed over the splines. The splines would cut into the bronze and make a locked fit.

Unfortunately, it might take a couple tries to find the right thickness bushing and in the meantime the shaft might be damaged. But it is still anther option of all others fail.

professionalpyroman

The problem with pressing that bushing on like that is the difficulty in getting the pulley to run truly perpendicular with the shaft. Might get a case of the wobbles, then your bearing and seals get worn out too quickly. Plus then you would still have to have a keyway cut through the brass and the steel shaft. Might cost you more than it's worth

professionalpyroman

Just had a thought. After replacing any o-rings and such, you could lap the mating surfaces of your old pump housing and then potentially seal it with a type-2 sealer or equivalent anaerobic. Then you wouldn't necessarily need the gasket set. Don't know if that helps

BLKTOPTRVL

Yea, I thought of that one too.

My goal right now if I have to machine is to make no changes to the pump at all, but to the pulley hub.

I am currently taking a mold of the space between the shaft and the pulley to take to a local machine shop to see what can or can't be done on a press.

It's funny, other than the fact that I am not able to drive my car, I am enjoying this research and fab project.

You know if lead (or something not toxic dried/cooled to something that could provide just enough grip on the splined shaft without being deformed by the heat/torque, it would be easy to loosely mate the hub to the shaft - and then pour in that filer material.

TonyD89

iTrader: (10)

If the pulley hole is larger than the shaft diameter, have bushing machined that you can cut a keyway in. No need for a pour or lead. Measure shaft, measure hole, you're done (let the machinist do this, he will be able to precision measure the stuff).

Also, look close at this key. If it's a Woodruff key, there doesn't need to be a full length slot (if there is one now). This key could be used instead of a standard straight key if that is what's in there now. A machinist will know where you're going with this if you talk to him. A Woodruff key won't cut your newly machined bushing in half. I'd try to make the keyseat deep enough to hit the old keymay, locking it all together. A good machinist should not have a problem getting the whole shebang done right.

Might cost a bit though unless you know someone.

I think they might have gone to the splines because of the weight of the vehicle it was put in. Even if they didn't up the pressure of the pump, I bet the heavy MPV puts a greater load on the pump to just turn the wheels as compared to the light front end of the RX7. In fact, after thinking more on it, the only thing different might be the pressure relief valve. That might be something to think about.

BLKTOPTRVL

OK, I have received my rebuild kit, so I am going to document the process.

1. Cleaning the inside of the housing.
   1. While cleaning the housing I noticed small bits of something. Not sure if it was rubber, metal, or whatever, but I cleaned them out.
   2. I also sprayed the inside of the housing with a little brake cleaner.
   3. Wiped the whole thing down.
   
   
2. I drifted the new bearing to the shaft.
   
   1. I put the shaft into the freezer overnight.
   2. I heated the bearing to 175 in a toaster oven.
   3. This only got the bearing so far onto the shaft, so I used a socket the size of the inner race of the bearing and a hammer to get the bearing seated.
   4. Unfortunately I was not careful enough to choose a long enough socket and put a few burrs into the end of the shaft before the nut threads.
3. I removed all striations and burrs from the shaft.
   
   1. I inserted the non-bearing end of the shaft into the chuck of my drill press. (hand tightened only with paper around the shaft to protect it.)
   2. I then stapled a strip of emery cloth to a 1"x 3/4" x 5" block of wood.
   3. I set the press to low speed.
   4. I squirted a bit of oil onto the strip of emery cloth.
   5. As the shaft turned in the press, I lightly pressed the block of wood to the shaft until all burrs were removed and the pulley hub could easily go over the shaft again.
4. I fitted the new rubber seal into the pump housing
   
   1. This time I was more careful about the size sockets I selected and the seal went in without damaging anything else.
5. Getting the shaft and bearing into the housing
   1. Trying heat differential again, I am heating the pump body up to 200 degrees.
   2. The shaft - with the bearing attached is back in the freezer.
   3. I will try to get them to mate. Again, I have chosen a good size socket in case drifting will be needed.
   4. Note: At this differential, the bearing dropped right into the housing, no hammering needed. If I were to do it again, I would try at 190 degrees because I don't know how much heat the rubber seal can handle.
6. Letting the housing cool down
   
7. Inserted a new o-ring seal into the housing
   1. Removed the old outer o-ring. It was rather hard and flattened to the side next to the housing.
   At this point I want to note that I purchased EDELMANN 8831 PS Rebuild Kit. It has a lot of little parts that are not for my pump. In addition it is missing the 14mm (ID), 18mm (OD) O-Ring needed for under the "Side Plate" (O-Ring" Inner) The only other O-rings in the kit are either too big or too small. I've gone to Northern Tool to get a variety pack of rings. My recommendation: if you can find the seal (Part number #AEO-816G) and the Case Gasket independently, you are probably better off just buying them and getting the other parts separably.
8. Letting the housing cool down
   
9. Closing the pump.
   1. Inserted all the o-rings.
   2. Inserted the main spring.
   3. Inserted the plates.
   4. Inserted the rotor and all the vanes (flat side out).
   5. Inserted the cam ring.
   6. New gasket on and bolts in.

I have a few concerns, for those of you who know vane pumps... I guess I will find out if I did OK tomorrow when I run it.

1. When I took it apart and was turning the rotor, I could see the vanes moving in and out. I don't see it doing that anymore. I am hoping that is because it is not as highly lubricated as when it first came apart and the movement I saw was due to gravity? Does centripetal force alone drive the vanes?
2. The case was pretty far apart when I first started tightening the bolts (seemed to be about 3 or 4 mm, but as I tightened the bolts, the gap closed easily and without needing force.
3. The shaft is just about as hard to turn as the shaft on the professionally rebuilt pump I have, but I attribute that to the fact there is no lube in there. Maybe I should actually pour some ATF into one of the ports before I put the accessories back onto the pump tomorrow.

TonyD89

iTrader: (10)

Congrats and I am hoping for complete success. I don't think you hurt anything at 200 degrees. I guess I misunderstood your problem when I made my last post.

BLKTOPTRVL

All input is welcome.

BLKTOPTRVL

WTF...

I get the pump together, put all the accessories back on. Install it back into the car... And then when putting the Power Solenoid back onto the pump I snapped the threaded head off the solenoid!

I can't believe this crap! I thought I was being careful, but the solenoid takes a 17mm wrench and what seemed to be the slightest tightening and it's gone!

Now I have to try to find a solenoid.

Apparently these threads are not part of the body, but brazed on?I may try some of that Devcon Weldit.


EDIT:

Looks like I am not missing anything with the Solenoid not attached... I put it on my bench tester and unless it is not the simple positive/negative voltage it appears to be (two wires) is does not do anything any way. Tomorrow I will buy a bolt to put in it's place and see how the car drives.

professionalpyroman

hey bud,

you may want to look at the FSM on that solenoid. Its a control item. Check out the section on fuel and emissions for your car. It got lumped in with all the sensors at the end of that section. Probably want to take a look. You can probably see if one of these guys with a junked pump can send one to you for $20 or so...

BLKTOPTRVL

A M14x1.5 Oil Drain Plug Fits perfectly.

TonyD89

iTrader: (10)

The piece the threads broke off of looks like a cap of some sort. Do you think you can get it off? Maybe you could tap it M14 X 1.5, get a smallpiece of metric threaded rod from McMaster, drill a hole in it, cut it to proper length, and now you're done (maybe a little loctite on the solenoid side).

Be very careful (which I think you will be) messing with the "cap", do everything possible to see if there is a spring under it. I don't want you unscrewing it and then boing! Parts go flying (been there before).

Yeah, seeing the o-ring that makes the seal, probably pretty low torque.

BLKTOPTRVL

I believe you are right, that it is a cap... I was going to (I still might) put it in my vise and torque the head off to see what is inside, but with the oil drain plug I put in place, I don't think I need it (although I would like to keep the car as original as possible.)

The car drives just as it did before. I get the feeling that over the 30 years I have owned the car, the Speed Adjusting feature of the PS failed and I didn't notice. And as I said, that module does nothing now and is not really needed.

For now, I will see how long this rebuilt pump lasts while I continue my search for another to rebuild (to have as a spare).

I am not sure yet if I did a good job rebuilding - but it did survive it startup and a 25 mile trip today. It pumps and so far it doesn't leak. The only thing I don't like is that there seems to be a rubbing noise coming from the rubber seal under the new bearing (I didn't lube it when I put it in, I would have thought that the PS fluid would lubricate it... Guess I may have been wrong about that, but I am learning).

I really feel that any maintenance I need to do in the future will require that I rebuild more parts myself; so this has been a good experience.