rxse7en

Well, if I unplug the x23 connector that we found I lose continuity between the - and + terminals. With the alternator main discnonnected and trying to start the car I still get the "feels/sounds like all power is cutting out" symptoms and the battery just drains.

HAILERS

Something is a little screwy about that remark about the fuel pump being 3v and then some mv reading. I think its with your technique maybe. You've got the meter on dc volts, the positive lead on or in the back of the large blue wire, and the negative lead is attached where????? Car can't run on some mv reading.

rxse7en

Car's not running. As posted previously, after we figured out the short in the fuel cut switch and I got the car running, I installed the SAFC and now we have a no-start situation again. We have spark, not sure about the fuel pump now and this whacky dying battery (which is brand new.)

rxse7en

<1v is my idle voltage on the blue wire (car in on position, not running) and when trying to start the car I only get 3v on the ble wire. That's with a fully charged battery. After 3–4 attempts trying to turn her over, the battery dies.

rxse7en

HAILErS, at idle (engine not running) should I be getting 9–12v at the circuit opening relay's blue wire? It's actually blue with a red stripe that I believe powers the fuel pump. I'm getting that 4–6mv reading on that wire and a full 12v into the circuit opening relay. Does this give you any clues?

B

HAILERS

That blue/red wire will only have 9-12v if the car is running or the key is HELD to start position. If the car does not start and the key is returned to ON, the 9-12 should not be there.

So when you were talking about a blue wire in the other posts, it was the blue/red wire???

Something is pulling the voltage down to 3v. Pull the plug off the circuit opening relay and see if there is 12v on the large black/white wire with the key on. Also look at that voltage while you turn the key. Does it drop down to 3v also????

We're talking about the relay under the dash on the right side of the steering shaft.

That jpg I posted in the beginning is for a n/a. I'll jpg a turbo. Its a bit different in that it'll show the fuel pump relay and resistor also. Thats why you see a blue wire on the schematic and on the car its a blue/red or L/R. Anyway that blue/red should have closer to 12v when trying to start than the 3v you see. Its either breaking down in the circuit opening relay, or prior to the circuit opening relay or heaven forbid, the fuel pump is pulling it down.

rxse7en

OK. with the circuit opening relay disconnected and the key in "on" position we get ~25mv, when trying to start the voltage starts at ~10–11v then as the starter is cranking the voltage just drops. I can hear the starter "missing" as if it's shorting out or the circuit is shorting and losing power to the starter. After these tests, I pull the cables off to recharge the drained battery and I can feel the positive lead is hot to the touch. Keep in mind that the "short" is only when trying to start the car.

HAILERS

Ewwwwwwwwww. So it has nothing to do with the fuel pump, relay etc. For some reason the starter is drawing the batt voltage down, down, down. Not even enough power to run the fuel pump. Just sitting here I'd say the starter, or the wiring from the positive terminal on the battery to the starter is bad and is causing one heck of a voltage drop.

Really ought to leave the guessing at that. Crawl under the car with it out of gear and check that the large positive lead on the battery isn't touching or coming close to something that it might short to. If not get a piece of insulated wire about at least six inches long and bare on each end. Pull the small spade connector off the starter solenoid. With the car out of gear for darn sure, jumper b/t the small spade ON the solenoid and the large positive lead on the starter. Starter should crank over. Sound any different?

HAILERS

JPG;

HAILERS

JGP:

rxse7en

I'm gonna get under the car tomorrow and have a look-see. Um, when we get this knocked it's not just any porterhouse for you…I see Ruth's Chris Steak House in your future. I saw their porterhouse the other night. 500ş plates. Melted butter. <drool>

rxse7en

OK. We're on to something! I got under there today and did like you asked. When I jumped the starter it cranked normally with no drain on the battery! The starter sounded normal and powerful. So, we are looking at the circuit that leads to that spade connector?

HAILERS

Actually that confuses me even more. Sorry. Have you tried to connect everything up i.e. the relay etc and turned the key on while doing the jumper job under the car??????? Be real sure the car is out of gear, please.

Hey. Normally do you have to push the clutch in while starting your car? Or is that feature disabled?

rxse7en

I put everything back together. I did a search on the inter lock switch and jumpered that to take that out of the loop. That seemed to fix the "shorting" starter issue but we're still left with ~6v at the fuel pump when cranking. The battery drained a little slower this time so it's out there recharging as I type this. When the battery is full, I'll go ahead put the car in "on" position and try jumpering the starter. Since we're working out way up the ignition circuit I feel I have to mention that the cylinder was recently replaced and I suppose I'll have to check that next?

rxse7en

OK. I turned the key on, jumpered the starter and same thing. The starter spins the engine, the battery drains. Ugh.

rxse7en

At least we solved te stuttering starter. I guess we're down to the ignition switch, starter cut relay, starter and the wiring in that circuit?

I keep forgetting to say that I've only driven this car once and can't remember if I had to press the clutch to start it!

HAILERS

Sooooo......you just said that as long as the key was not turned on, and you jumpered the starter down below, that the starter acted normal???


But doing the same thing as above, but with the exception of having the key to on, that it pulls the battery down and the starter sounds not as good?

And when we say the key to *on*, you mean just that, not turning it to *start*. Right?

rxse7en

Yes, not turning it to start. When I fist jumpered the starter the battery was fully charged and after I hooked everything back up and turned the key to start the battery would drain. Just jumpering with the key out of the ignition seems to not pull as much juice.

HAILERS

Almost sounds like the starter is not the problem if it turns good without the key being in the on position. Only you who are there can tell for sure. I'd go under there again and without the key to on, jumper it again and think about it. Is it really turning better or not.

If it really is turning better and showing none of the problems associated with having the key turned to the on position.......................cheeeeez. I dunno. Indicates a bad ignition switch maybe. Maybe not. I'll think about it for the night.

OK. WHERE'S ICEMARK WHEN YOU NEED HIM????????????????????????? HEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLP.

rxse7en

Hailers, I got under the car again and jumpered the starter. After 4 or 5 jumps the battery DOES drain, just like starting with the ignition switch. I've bypassed the interlock switch and the starter cut relay and still get some hiccups. I'm starting to think it's a combo of bad starter and ignition switch. Any thoughts?

B

HAILERS

I'd say starter. You did this without the key being on and it still drove the battery down. How much confidence do you have in the battery????? Sure its not just a dead cell? I've been told that you can take a battery to some auto stores and they can tell you if it has a bad cell, for free. Never did that myself. I've been assuming the battery is in good shape.

rxse7en

I just bought the battery new last month. I'll try a new ignition switch and starter. If that doesn't work I'll check the wiring. If then we still have this problem I will mail you airline tix to come visit!

B

rxse7en

HAILERS, I'm not sure if this was it, BUT, I went back to the X23 connector and followed it to the harness. It was spliced onto the main with a big metal crimp. It was all corroded. I cut the wire at the crimp and respliced and soldered further up the wire. The car is running. I've set the idle and it's all holding well. I've shut it down and was able to restart it three times in a row. No flooding. Wow. This thread has been going every day for two weeks. What a horrible experience. Not fun like a diff mount or an upgrade The worst part is I'm not really sure what caused the problem or how I fixed it. At least I now know that the main relay, starter, ignition switch, circuit opening relay, fuel pump relay, battery, ECU, fuel pump and starter cut relay are all functional. I owe you the porterhouse—I won't forget.

Brian

rxse7en

Hailers-- I still haven't forgotten