SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

Hey guys, my name is Matty. I'm from Birmingham, AL. I'm in the process of restoring and modifying my 1988 FC with 265k ORIGINAL miles! I have a spare 6port keg in need of a rebuild so I'm going to have a friend help with that but my goal is to pull the EFI out and de-clutter the engine bay as much as possible. I'm hoping with the Weber DCOE and a 7 or 9" supercharger I'll make in the 250+whp range.

Does anyone in this section have any experience with their draw-through Weber system? I've seen good things from their Holley kits but I want the look of the Weber in my engine bay.

Thanks,
Matty

SirCygnus

iTrader: (1)

nitrous. use it.

Craiger

iTrader: (1)

You'll probably find more information in the first gen section or in the race car section of the form for a carb setup.

jjwalker

Agreed, lots of guys there with carbed 13b's.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Is there any specific reason you want to go with this somewhat weird setup instead of just a TII swap?

I'd suggest a search on the key word "camden" to get some idea of how past setups with these superchargers have worked out. In general, fairly poorly.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the camden is not very well matched to the engine. the supercharger works @low rpm, but the engine works @high rpm.

they have dyno charts posted on their website, they get something like 160RWHP on an FC motor, which is um about what you'd get without the s/c....

Tessai76086

iTrader: (3)

thought about the supercharger idea myself for a while. did a bunch of reading on the forums and quickly decided against it. Aaron and j9fd3s hit the nail on the head.

SirCygnus is onto something but by the time you get the kit, throttle switch, rpm window switch, ignition retard box, and get the bottle filled your going to be getting close to what a used turbo setup would cost, if not more.

a mildly ported TII engine and turbo should be able to get you close to what you want.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

thanks for the opinions. I've always been a supercharger guy and thought it would be nice to design my own centrifugal kit for my FC but was persuaded by a friend (who has a camden) to give them a shot instead. I did searches and saw people weren't happy with them.

I'm not sticking EFI with my build. My #1 concern is removing clutter from the engine bay. My #2 concern is that I want 250+whp or so. #3 concern is that it falls within a reasonable budget.

I'm not fond of the TII set-ups and don't desire those power levels. I'm fairly certain a well built NA 13b with a nice DCOE will get me where I want to go and a solid nitrous kit will give me anything else I may need.

Thanks for the time.

Hazard15301

iTrader: (5)

Please post results.

Evil Aviator

A supercharger ADDS clutter to the engine bay.

You are looking at a minimum of $2,400 for a new Camden supercharger. Then you will need the carb, adapter plate, jet kit, air filter kit, throttle and choke linkage, fuel pressure regulator, fuel filter, fuel pump, 3/8" fuel lines, and boost gauge. In addition, you will either need to get an aftermarket EMS to run the ignition, or downgrade to a distributor. Then also factor in that you will need to use premium unleaded fuel. You will probably also want to add engine porting, an upgraded radiator, upgraded exhaust system, and maybe ADI. That is a rather expensive and time-consuming path to 250whp, so you may want to read more of this forum prior to making a decision on upgrades.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

The main issue is that the Camden isn't sized very well to the engine. Then the necessity to wire open the aux ports to run the manifold ends up reducing torque down low. The factory uses a staged throttle system to keep the secondary ports closed at low loads. The Camden manifold removes this, so the idle must be jacked up to stay even and support the additional load of the supercharger.

Look into Megasquirt, if you are the DIY type. EFI is only a few more wires and you can easily declutter an engine bay once all the wiring and solenoids for the factory emission equipment is out of the picture.

You said that you want 250HP or so, in which case, a TII swap with the stock turbo is exactly what you want. Just add an FCD, larger secondaries, and turn up the boost to 12 PSI and have done with it. The torque curve will be vastly superior to a carbureted NA anyway.

Tessai76086

iTrader: (3)

I second the MegaSquirt.

a few pics of my install
(if they work)

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

Again, I appreciate the comments but my question has been answered. I am not going EFI and I'm not putting a turbo on it. This is just play car for me and I was toying with the idea of the Camden.

Thanks.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Make sure to post back in 6 months with how well the project turned out.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

I will, and the sarcasm is noted and appreciated. I feel very welcome so far.

Tessai76086

iTrader: (3)

were not trying to be sarcastic. your not taking the advice of the board that you came to for exactly that. the supercharger is a HORRIBLE idea on a rotary. a propperly tuned EFI system will always out perform a carb. not to mention when the weather changes you dont have to retune it.

were trying to look out for you and help you out. i really would suggest you at least listen before you make a very expensive mistake.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

I'm sorry. I wasn't wanting you people to tell me what to do. I wanted opinions and advice. Neither are binding contracts as far as I knew.

I have local friends with very similar set-ups (carbs and SC's) and I was merely asking around for additional input.

My mind is 100% made - up about the no EFI and no turbo thing. I don't care if it's less powerful or means I can't drive it in winter without some adjustment. I want something that will be fun to drive and look like the show cars I've seen that have impressed.

Tessai, I have listened to everything everyone has said and it's noted. I'm not going to be convinced otherwise though. I was only asking about one specific product and my question was answered.

What I find most interesting is everyone is so quick to tell me what to do without asking me first what I want out of my car. That should be the first comment anyone makes.

killalot13601

iTrader: (5)

Care to make an educated statement about why you wish to run a carb and not EFI? I am just curious, you must have a good reason right?

"What I find most interesting is everyone is so quick to tell me what to do without asking me first what I want out of my car. That should be the first comment anyone makes."
Well, you did not make it a point to tell us in your original post.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Don't mind my sarcasm. It doesn't mean I want to be hostile, I'm just a really sarcastic person.

Is that not the same as opinions and advice? I'm just giving this advice because I have built damn near everything rotary related and know what works well.

If that is what you enjoy, then go for it.

Many of us have a lot experience and know what both works and doesn't. If someone proposes an idea that isn't going to work well, there isn't much point in then asking what they want out of a car. Then again, if you are building a show car that will be on a trailer most of the time, I guess it doesn't matter what is under the hood as long as it is shiny.

He told us he wanted a nearly empty engine bay. Though I guess if I was going for the same effect and someone put a gun to my head and told me I had to use a Camden, I'd run EFI and a nice set of ITBs. Or take the bullet and choose death. Either way.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

Yes, it's not complex. I like the way it looks and I like the idea of being able to gut the engine bay almost entirely. I've seen numerous builds like this in other RX vehicles and have always loved the look.

As I've said earlier I'm not looking for all-out power. I want something clean, simple and tasteful. I was suggested the SC from a friend who has one with a carb and loves it. I was simply asking around about it. I hadn't put any eggs in my basket yet.

mikeric

iTrader: (20)

He said it above. He wants to go to car shows and thinks it looks cool. I find it interesting that he wants 250 horses, but does not want the power of a turbo. How many horses does he think stock turbos make? S4 TII are rated at 182hp, S5 TII at 200hp. That is about 160whp and 175whp respectively.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

I think you've hit the nail on the head here. It won't be a trailer queen but it's just a fun little project for me to take to shows and have something different.

rotordad

Hey if you want to go carb or supercharger than that's your decision, Some info on here is helpful & some is not. Alot of what you hear on here maybe complete ****, but in the end you can find very useful info when looking. First I would like to say that I will not join in on any disputes on the supercharger subject it has been done too many times already, second I would like to say that going to Camdens site & looking at the dyno's is foolish. They did not make the kit they bought it & IMO don't know a whole lot. Any time I talked to them they didn't know anything & if I remember right I had EFI on my set-up way before the made thier little EFI pile. They knocked me back in the day, I just laughed. When I originally got my kit it was offered by Rotary Performance in Garland, Tx. No I do not have any dyno sheets & the car is not running as of now. Lost the old sheets over the years & currently unemployed so getting the car back together may take awhile, but it made right at 285whp on a dynojet on a big street ported 13bt with 9.4:1 rotors, EFI & exhaust (ect). I would not suggest this route as far as cost effiecient, nor would I say this would be a good idea over a simple Turbo II swap. If you have friends with similar set-ups get your own idea of how thier cars respond to see if that's what you want. Good luck in what ever you decide.

SuperMattyP

iTrader: (1)

^^ I appreciate the response.

The build I'm looking at doing is almost identical to my friends. converted EFI to carb 13B with a DCOE and 100hp shot. His car was a monster. Not because of the power but because of the weight, suspension, etc. This is more what I'm going for. But it has to be clean and simple and look nice.

rotordad

Yeah I have a 150 shot on mine for that little extra punch, my car is by far no monster nor is it some perfect machine, but it's mine & I had alot fun before my electrical problems. Now on the other hand a good turbo build will be the more backed way to go with all the aftermarket support. My other 7 is turbo & so far has less involved (money & time). Not to take anything away from anyone here, but EvilAviator, Aaroncake & j9fd3s are very informative IMO so take any suggestions into mind.