edomund

I bought a 87 TII for 400 bucks that had caught fire. The bad (and kinda good) thing is that someone started to fix it. The good thing is that it seems they replaced the engine wiring harness among other things. The problem is they have everthing unplugged.

Now I can't tell where some things are suppsed to be plugged in. I'm sure I can figure out things that have different types of plugs. However some things like the primary and secondary injector wiring look the same. I'm wondering if anyone has any pics or good diagrams for where everthing plugs in?

Thanks in advace, Ed

any help would be greatly appreciated

edomund

Sorry I just thought of two more questions.

My other problem is, someone bought used injectors for it. I don't know how to tell the primary from the secondary. One pair has the # 195500-1370 and the other has # 195500-3350. Are these even the correct injectors?

I'm also going to premix and get rid of the omp. I need to know which vaccum line on the intake I need to plug up (which one does the vacuum spider hook up to). All the vaccuum lines in that area are badly burned so I can't tell where the oil injector vacuum spider hooked up on the engine. I think it's either the one right next to the oil injector closest to the intake or the line on the intake sticking out horizontally.

Hope that made sense,
Thanks, Ed

hypntyz7

ITs easy to figure out the 4 injector leads: primaries are shorter...youll have 2 very short wires, and 2 much longer wires. The harnesses are sort of divided...one has a short and a long, and one has a short and a long, along with a green aquare plug. The ones on teh same harness with teh green plug are rotor number 1, front, the green plug is water thermo sensor, back of water pump. Then youre only left with one short and one long, and those are pretty obvious and can only go one way.

For an 87 turbo, they used low impedance, tan top injectors, that had a notch int eh middle of the inejctor. I can get a part number if need be, but the color and plug shape/notch location tell teh story. IF you have access to a voltmeter, they should ohm out at 2.5-3 ohms. Primary and 2ndary injectors on all FC's are the same thing; on a turbo, they are 4 550cc of the same inpedance all around, on a nonturbo, they are 4 460cc. SO, on a given car there are 4 of the same injector, and those 4 can be switched around if need be. I *think* those 1370's are na injectors, but I dont remember...na injectors are red top.

88 turbo injecotrs are purple top, similar to red na injectors, but their notch is offset to one side, meaning theyre high impedance...about 13 ohms.

Let me know if you need those t2 injector part numbers.


Well, you realy only have to have 3 vacuum lines to make that engine run:

boost sensor
BOV
fuel pressure regulator

YOu also might want to keep the twin-scroll on there, the green solenoid and hoses, but its not necessary to run ok, it affects low end spool of the turbo. I run without mine.

I took the throttle body off, and flipped that black plate around backwards...this closes off all of those dynamic chamber nipples but one; on te backside, the lower one. I had to cap this one. I capped all the other nipples, and put short bolts in place of the oil ijectors. I used large vacuum caps to close ff the spare coolant nipples that did run teh TB and BAC. I took ALL that hsit off; my car runs on a afm and 4 injectors.

BoostedRotors

Hypntyz: where did you get that air splitter on the front of your car? I remember reading it but cant find the post now.

hypntyz7

Demonspeed.com. Email douglas and tell him that Kevin sent you.

BoostedRotors

Will it fit/ does he make one for an s4? How much was it shipped?

hypntyz7

he makes a similar s4 version. Theyre a bit under $200 shipped. Mine fit great...I had to drill my holes and that was it. Even comes painted black.

BoostedRotors

Cool, thanks! My car is red, but I think that the black splitter would look very nice, add a subtle touch.

hypntyz7

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/attach...&postid=506748

BoostedRotors

VERY nice! He has since painted that black hasnt he? I saw it from the side and it looked very sleek!

HAILERS

The -1370's should be the 550 injectors that came with the car. There should be a *tab* for the electrical connector on it and it should be centered vs offset from center. I don't know what -3350 are. Not a clue. Make sure the -1370's go in the primary holes. If the -3350 turn out to be 680's or 720's, then the car will flood when you try to start it.

The spider......the spider connects to each of the four oil injectors and the single large hose on the spider goes to one of the four metal nipples on the rear side of the throttle body. You can't miss it, its the only large one in the vertical row of four metal nipples. What you need to know is that what the spider does, is supply fresh filtered air TO the oil injectors. The vacuum is being pulled thru the oil injectors into the rotors on the intake stroke. There is no vacuum at the large nipple on the throttle body's large nipple.

IF I think of it later today, I'll jpg a wiring diagram of the fuel injector wiring. The wires are color coded for each injector.

While we're here....there is a metal nipple b/t two of the oil injectors. That should have a hose going to one of the four nipples on the back side of the throttle body, as long as it does not go to the bottom one or the large one. It also is just drawing fresh filtered air, but to the fuel injector *bleeds*.

The bottom nipple on the throttle body, the one that actually draws a vacuum, goes to the water thermo valve about six inches to the left of the nipple. Its that plastic device with two plastic nipples.

HAILERS

some help.jpg This jpg should show a N/A of the 87 year, but the injector wire color is the same for a 87 turbo.

EDIT: Well the thing didn't paste. Try this thread at https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...tor+and+wiring and about in the middle of the long thread you'll find a couple of jpg for a 87. Wire colors the same n/a or turbo for 87

edomund

Thanks Hailers and Hypnytz7 for the info.


Hypntyz could you put up the injector #'s I just want to make sure I put in the right ones. As for taking all the vaccum stuff off, I wish I could, but I live in California.


Another question, what goes to the metal nipple on the lower manifold above the oil injectors. It's right inbetween the secondary injectors where they go into the manifold.


It would also help a lot if someone could explain where the metal vacuum spider lines go. (Particularlly the six that are right next to each other near the EGR valve.)

There is also one to the right of those six, to the left of the oil injectors. I have a haynes manual but the drawing is small and hard to read.

Thank you so much for the help. I would be stuck if it wasn't for this forum helping me along the way.

-Ed

edomund

Any body?

I know four of those six lines go to the four lines directly above, thats obvious. But two go somewhere else. Where do they go and which two are the ones that go somewhere else?

Thanks, Ed

hypntyz7

The best description is the factory vacuum diagram, go to fc3s.org, how-to's --> manuals --> 86-88 Factory service manual --> 4a nonturbo fuel adn emissions control systems. There will be a vacuum diagram int eh first few pages of this.

HAILERS

Go to the 4B for the turbo. I'll work on this a bit later when I get home. Frankly neither manual in my opinion shows clearly the routing. The best way I found to do it was to say go to the Relief solenoid, disconnect the hose on it and blow into it. Then see which of the six the blowing air came from. But even thats not a sure fire method because two lines go to and from the relief solenoid and you have to know which goes where on the acv. Helps to have been around the block on this.

Basically the turbo I have was in the same condition as yours. All the vac lines burnt off and where do they go situation. Later after work . I've got a spare turbo engine (no vac lines yet) and a working turbo on the car.

Try the schematic in the book, but its lacking in clarity.

P.S One thing I know for certainty in life is that -1350 fuel injectors with the tab in the middle are 460's low impedence and that -1370's are 550's for a turbo and if the tab is in the middle they are low impedence. The other ones in your original post I know not a thing about.

HAILERS

Ok. At work but I thought about the metal pipe b/t the secondary fuel injectors. It should be the manifold air pressure line for the fuel pressure regulator. Go to the orange solenoid and take off one or both of the lines and blow thru them. One will go to a metal line about six inches from the line b/t the fuel injectors (that one is at an angle if I remember right). The other line that you blow thru will go to one of the six metal lines you mentioned. From there it goes to the fuel pressure regulator on the secondary fuel rail.

If you look at page 4B-5 in the 88 manual, you'll be deceived into thinking that line b/t the fuel injectors goes to the pulsation damper on the primary fuel rail. We all know the pd does not get a vac line. Thats what I mean by a lack of clarity on that page of vac tubes.

banzaitoyota

Where is the JPG that has the color coded vacuum line diagram?

HAILERS

Ok. Thought about it again. There are six metal lines. We've decided one is for the fuel pressure regulator in the above post. Now three of the remaining ones go to the air control valve. Go to the grey solenoid and blow into both of its lines one at a time. One of those six should get some air when you blow. That one is meant to go to the nipple on the acv that stick straing up. Now b/t the six metal lines and the acv, there is another set of three metal lines. So the path for that grey solenoid's vac is thru one of the six metal lines, out thru a rubber vac hose to one of the three metal lines, then to the nipple sticking straight up. If that makes no sense write back and I'll redo it. YOu do have the set of three metal lines b/t the acv and the six mentioned in your firt post????????????????

HAILERS

Ok. Of the six two are accounted for. Two more of the remaining four are coming and going from the acv. One goes to the very bottom of the acv where there is a nipple. The other goes to the nipple that is about in the middle of the acv. Go to the Blue solenoid. Blow thru both lines on it. Once you determine the two lines connect them to the two places on the acv I mentioned above. It matters not which goes where in this case as long as they go from the blue solenoid to the two nipples I mentioned on the acv. Once again, there is that seperate set of three metal pipes b/t the six metal pipes mentioned. All three of those are accounted for now. If this does not make sense write back.

Of the six, I've accounted for four. Three to the acv and one to the pulsation damper on the secondary fuel rail.

Of the last two, I think one is dedicated to the EGR. Go to the yellow solenoid and blow thru its hose. One hose should go to one of the six metal nipples. Hook that one to the EGR with a hose.

The last one I THINK, goes to the switching actuator at the bottom of the turbo. Go to the GREEN solenoid and blow thru the hose and see if one goes to one of the six metal nipples. That should go to the switching solenoid. I believe you'll find a long metal line coming off the switching actuator at the bottom of the turbo, that comes near the six metal lines. Connect it up.

See, thats whats wrong with the picture in the manual. They don't show the six lines all together. They show four together, so theres a touch of confusion as you look at it. Also the lines are muddled as they approach the solenoid area.

Now a saftey note here. Most likely the pulsation damper was burnt. You NEED to determine if the diaphram on the pulsation damper is leaking or burnt up. Take it off the rail and blow thru the hole on it. If it leaks out where the small screw is, its gotta be replaced.

If I remember, I'll double check what I wrote so far, this evening. I think what I wrote makes sense IF you have that seperate set of three metal lines b/t the six mentioned. If you don't have those it might not make sense.

edomund

Thanks for the write up. Sorry I can't confirm all this info today. I had to work late, so I'll have to try tomorow after work. I'll post back after I look at it, just reading it is hard to make sense if I'm not looking at the car.

I do know I have the lines above the six. But there are four of them instead of three.
I read the diagram on the hood, so now I know where the four go after they connect to four of the six below. Now I have to do the tests you posted to see which of the six below go to those four above.

Then I will have two left of those six. One goes to the Pressure regulator like you said and the other goes to the back of the upper intake. (I just have to figure out which is which)

1. There is a line that confuses me though. There is a metal vacuum line below the EGR valve. It's inbetween the exhaust manifold and the motor. It comes up from underneath the car very close to the housing you can barely see it. Is this the turbo switching actuator your talking about?
Do you know where it goes to and what it's coming from?

2. There is also a vacuum line on the spider that goes left (towards the front of the car) when the other six go right (to the back of the car). Where does this go?

So let me get this right. Your saying that the metal nipple inbetween the injectors goes to the vacuum spider line thats right next to it ( "the one at an angle") nipple.


Hey, really thanks a lot for helping me sort this mess out
- Ed

HAILERS

On number one: that goes to the most outboard of the six metal nipples.

Tell you what, I'm off today making a wheel chair ramp. But later today I'm going to take my intake manifold off to do a little project I've been thinking about. I'm making a different arrangement for that single hose on the bottom that is a pain in the rear for the removal and installation of the manifold. When I do that I'll get on the keyboard and tell you where each goes.

HAILERS

Ok. Heres the deal. I've got the intake off. I'll do one hose at a time.

Between and below the secondary injectors there is a pipe sticking out at an angel. Use a short piece of vac hose and connect to the pipe almost exactly two inches below it. That one you connect it to is angled out from a gaggle of pipes welded together. Its final destination is to the ORANGE solenoid. It feeds the ORAGNGE solenoid from a pipe just below and outboard or the ORANGE solenoid. Light up a Monte Christo and blow smoke into the metal line and make sure the smoke exits just outboard and below the ORANGE solenoid. Next post will be another line.

HAILERS

Next is the nipple at the fuel pressure regulator on the end of the secondary fuel rail. Put a vac hose on the fuel pressure regulator and counting from the right and looking forward at the gang of six metal pipes below the fpr, put the other end on the second from your right.

This pipes final destination is the outlet pipe on the ORANGE SOLENOID. Light up again and blow smoke to make sure its connected correct. This pipe exits just inboard and a touch forward of the ORANGE SOLENOID.

HAILERS

Now lets talk about the GANG OF SIX (shades of Mao Tse Tung). There is one pipe that is biased towards the rear more than the others. This pipe is for the actuator on the turbo. Switching actuator. Connect a vac hose to the pipe coming from the switching actuator to the pipe that is biased to the rear. Prior to doing that blow smoke into the pipe and make sure it exits just inboard or the GREEN SOLENOID and that hose that is just inboard of the GREEN SOLENOID , connects to the top of the GREEN SOLENOID.