13angryBees

theres probably already a post about this, so im sorry. Just got a 1986 rx7, found a turbo2 motor, but was wondering if I should just stick with N/A. I heard the stock ECU wont recognize anything over 8psi, with that turbo2s cant make much power. 230-240hp. What else can be done to a N/a 13b to make around that much power besides your exhaust system and intake. For the money and the problems what would be the best choice????

88t2romad

your right, turbo 2's cant make much power....

If your going to do some sort of swap, id suggest going with a different ecu over the n/a one.

A n/a without nitrous would take serious porting (bp, or PP) to make 240 whp

iceblue

I have a feeling there is going to be quit a few half finished 13bt swaps up for sale soon.

stock ECU wont recognize anything over 8psi, with that turbo2s cant make much power. 230-240hp

Completely incorrect. The stock NA PS won’t see boost at all. The TII PS will max out the turbo no probs. A TII application should use the TII ECU PS AFM 550cc injectors.

stacher

It is probably easier to get that kind of HP out of a TII than a NA. It would be more reliable as well.

slpin

iTrader: (9)

stock ecu WONT regonize the higher boost... remember? fuel cut defender...
the afm will make adjustment to fuel though...

13angryBees

so you all agree that doing to turbo 2 swap to get somewhere around 240hp is the better bang for the buck. Rather than N/A....

cwsttu

yes looking at how to build a beefy n/a youll see clearly that its alot of work to make a fast n/a

iceblue

hehe you got me slpin. Been playing with my N338 to long ;-)

It is always easier to make numbers with boost.

13angryBees

but how reliable, id rather make 200hp out of a n/a that is gonna get me from a to b with no problems, then a 300hp turbo2 that isnt gonna last.

How much more work is it to put a turbo on a n/a rx7. rather then me buying a tubro motor???

iceblue

Buying a TII is cheaper and easier then both of your options. All you need is a Exhaust and FCD and two 720cc injectors

CrypticApathy

If you really wanna stick with a N/A you can go to a 20b swap. Its faster then a TII

You could add a throttle body, headers, Bridge porting. It will get you around 200. You could also lighten the car which will help. Wont directly add HP to the car but it will change the power/weight ratio.

gerbraldy

If you want a n/a 6port to keep up with a mild 13bt it will need some sort of port job, aftermarket ems (or carb+manifold) exhaust etc. It would end up costing the same if not more than a somewhat stock 13bt swap, but you would have a nice rebuild motor but still lacking on really good power.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

Er, most streetports now a days HIT 200 HP without an EMS, a bridge should do between 215-250. Also the throttle body isn't the problem, unless you're talking about individual throttle bodies.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

Um, when adding a turbo to a 6-port will present just as many problems if not more. You should listen to Iceblue.

But getting a 200HP NA isn't too hard. Good streetport, 9.7 rotors, SAFC + wideband, good exhaust. Anything above that you're going to switch manifolds and engine management (to at least take advantage of a bigger port).

On a turbo car its simple, RETed has a step by step on his site.

http://www.fc3s.org

Both cars can be reliable, but NA rotaries tend to be a little bit more.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

you can build a 300RWHP T2 that is more reliable than a 200RWHP n/a, please get your facts straight before jumping to conclusions.

iceblue

A proper tuned motor pushing 300hp of stress is the exact same reliability as a boosted application pushing 300HP of stress. It is simple a set number of HP/TQ will cause equal amounts of stress and wear on the motor.

People pop boosted motors more often b/c the push to much HP without proper tuning.

RockLobster

iTrader: (7)

Why tell people to get new injectors when they don't need them?

Freshly cleaned stock 550cc are fine for up to 12psi on a stock ported motor. 12psi coming from freer exhaust and intake.

iceblue

^ STFU n00b

NA injectors are 460cc and will not cut it for boost. Stock TII 550cc injectors will not cut 300hp period.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

that sure makes it sound like it is some easy task to get 300RWHP from an n/a.

comparing apples and oranges will bite you in the ***, you can push forced air through a stock ported motor properly tuned for a fairly easy reachable goal of 300RWHP, in an n/a you would need severe porting, porting which will reduce the reliability of the engine.

Eternal_Gamer

iTrader: (10)

NUFF SAID! So go get a TII. End of story!

slpin

iTrader: (9)

nope. :/
a 300hp NA will suffer more stress than a 300hp Turbo engine...

the 11000 rpm needed isnt that great...

iceblue

You misunderstood what I said. Nothing was about how eas it is. I was trying to say if the motor makes 200hp or 250hp or 300hp they motor is subdued to the same amount of stress.

RETed

Have you been in a turbo FC?
Have you been in a 300hp turbo FC?

Most people who say this haven't been in one...


-Ted

RETed

One thing nobody has mentioned yet is that a 300hp NA versus a 300hp turbo...

The EGT's will be lower on the turbo engine, period.
Turbos needs more fuel to run safer.

So all else being equal, the turbo motor will run cooler due to the lower EGT's.
This implies reliability will be in the turbo motor's favor, ignoring all other factors.

Seriously though folks, all the NA guys out there hatin' on the turbos, how many of you been in one?
Very few people would take the NA over a turbo once they have a ride in both.


-Ted

therotaryrocket

For reliability, doesn't boost pressure decrease the life of any engine? therefore the turbo II has to use pressure to get 300 hp which would lower the life of the internal components (i'm not talking about the engine blowing from detonation, i'm talking wearing out.) whereas the n/a doesn't need the pressure (but to make 300 hp n/a i'd imagine 11,000 rpms and extreme porting which will probably bring reliability down).

I like my turbo II, but it costs a lot of money (or atleast it seems) to keep together, i did buy it cheap ($500) but i had to do some work (clutch, and other stuff). now it is awaiting a rebuild after i blew the engine from detonation. it was probably 210 hp. and i've driven n/a, plenty of times, they are both very exciting cars to drive, but jump out of my turbo II and into an n/a on like the same day and you would probably be wanting more power. so i'd rather have a reliable 300 horsepower turbo II, than a reliable 200 horse power n/a. haha or a tdi.