RETed

You'll have to excuse him.  He's our resident anti-CDI member...


-Ted

hondahater

iTrader: (2)

I have the msd 6a in my car right now however to tell you the truth I haven't noticed anything at all. Of course my car is not tuned properly so I will get it tuned soon and get back to you on the mpg improvment if any. As far as idle ahhh I could have gotten it as smooth as the msd but oh well it was free so thats why I have it.

MARTIN

200 for an ignition w.o any heavy mods is worthless. unless your running boost or nitrous( and im not talking about a 50 shot) theres really no point in getting it. As for the idle there is some improvement but minimal at that. And as for the gas mileage youll have to do calculations just to find out the difference( dont expect anything more than 2mpg if that). Like I said before there is no point in spending that money. If you want to work on your mpg then go ahead and buy an safc. Itll do alot more than the msd will.

RETed

Wow, don't you just love replies from people who have ZERO experience with a mod and just shoot it down cause it doesn't make any sense to them.

1) The CDI box, when installed properly, will produce more power - period.  Go argue with the SAE paper that Mazda themselve claimed 8hp increase when they did their testing.

2) The CDI box ensure consistent ignition spark firing.  Yes, this will help forced induction engines more, but it's significant on a normally aspirated engine, as the stock FC3S typically misfires at very high RPMs.  If you don't believe this, run your engine on a dyno - the dyno doesn't lie.

3) Increased gas mileage is a possibility.&nbsp; Increased gas mileage is ALWAYS a plus on a rotary engine.&nbsp; The <$150 price tag from Summit Racing will be easily recovered over one to two years of driving - this makes this NOT a waste of money, if you use modern accounting practices.

4) The normally aspirated engine has very little options in terms of upgrades.&nbsp; What do you do after exhaust, intake, light flywheel, porting, rebuild?&nbsp; Almost everything else equal TONS of money - <$200 sound pretty cheap compared to those options.&nbsp; This makes this mod AFFORDABLE.

Mazda says it works; I tend to believe Mazda before believe people trying to explain something they are ignorant in.


-Ted

jester1341

i've already got one, not tuned yet but it will be. hope to see a lil improvment from that. as for the ignition..... i dunno now maybe i'll save up for that FMIC!

ViperDude152

Yup, Im also going to get a SAFC. so a combination of that with the ignition should be pretty Good.

Justin

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

It's not that I'm anti-CDI, it's just that there are better things you can spend your money on. For most people, it's a $200 ($400 Canadian ) box that doesn't seem to have any real benifit. I speak from experience here, since I noticed exactly 0 improvement with my Crane box...Of course, my car ran properly before I installed the box, so....

For the ignition breakup at high RPM, how are you measuring this? Are you checking the output of the coil? Or the input to the ignitor? Just curious...

RETed

Back-to-back dyno runs with and without the CDI box installed.&nbsp; The high RPM power output is significantly smoothed out and higher with CDI box installed.&nbsp; Now the cavaet - the car was not running dead new spark plugs, so this could be a function of the spark plugs condition itself.&nbsp; But, this brings up another advantage of the CDI box - ability to fire larger gap spark plugs!&nbsp; We know our spark plugs are pretty pricey, and being able to double spark plugs life without significant drop in performance saves us at least $20 a pop.




-Ted

ORX705

ted, great website!

i see where your comming from, but doesn't CDI eat plugs tips even quicker?

i was quite often told i don't need a CD ignition as i only put out 350hp. i went a 4ch Autronic 500R CDI unit because i kept blowing the autronic ignitors and havn't regretted the expense since.

RETed

Interesting point...
From my experience, I can tell degradation in power output with as little as 2,000 miles on a brand new set of spark plugs.&nbsp; With the HI-6 running, I can easily go 5,000 miles with no hint of degradation.


-Ted

ViperDude152

I posted before about MSD no being digital and only analog.
Bah, I forgot about the MSD Digital 6 ignition. I dont know how it could have missed that. MSD does have digital equipment. Gez, How i hate messing up and giving people the wrong info. sorry guys for the saying the wrong info.

Justin

Maxthe7man

I have a Car craft issue, where they dyno test all the leading spark box's, and much to my suprise and Car crafts, they lost up to 5hp with each box when tested on a couple of different motors...
On a recent trip to the dyno, on a 10.5:1 chev 383 smallblock, we found the MSD 6al made no difference in power ouput when put in the loop.
On the other hand, ChrisNg, fixed his topend break up with the wolf 3d, with the msd.. My car doesn't seem to be affected by it missing or not driveability wise, even at higher boost pressures and Hp levels..
If memory serves 87 gtr just made some huge hp on the stock ignition..
Really the spark boxes have the greatest effect on older vehicles with somewhat weak or degraded ignition..
The oem chrysler electronic ignition that first saw duty in about 1972 till about 1988, was considered a excellant ignition in terms of spark quality and energy, the stock Mazda FC ignition doesn't really ever get enough credit for how good it is, comparing the FC ignition to the oem chrysler is like comparing a towering inferno to a zippo lighter...
I am probably gonna yank the MSD, since it destroys the NGK race plugs in no time flat, the thin centre electrode simply can't take the multi spark abuse, the stock plugs have alot of meat to burn, the race plugs don't and at 40 bucks a peice Canadian, I don't like changing them every week...Max

RETed

Hitman has always advocated the use against the CDI boxes, in his experience.&nbsp; My theory is on Haltech equipped cars, you can change the coil charge time via the Haltech EMS.&nbsp; There was a post a while ago from a member who did o-scope testings on the ignition system, and the conclusion was the stock dual post coil did NOT fire consistently; this explains the "stumble" for most FC idles, even after a tune-up.&nbsp; If anything, the CDI box should eliminate this "flaw".&nbsp; Any EMS (i.e. Haltech) that is able to adjust coil charge times is really not applicable in this situation - this is more for stock ignition systems, which most of us in here run.


-Ted

88ROTARY

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...2D49300&view=1 go here

88ROTARY

i bought on of these to put on my hi-per 350 and i notice a differece right away.

88ROTARY

also go here and look at the specs and no to mention it is half the size of every thing else on thi market. and its digital.http://www.mrgasket.com/accelpdf/ACCELignition.pdf

Bambam7

I installed an MSD 6a about 2 years ago.
For some unknown reason, it actually made my idle a slight tad rougher.
Midrange (under normal acceleration) is much smoother, and a slight, but definite gain in midrange tourque was noticed.
Mileage went up a small, but noticable amount.

They are cheap... I think I got mine for about 130 USD a few years ago.... probably pick one up on ebay for much less.

Ted is a huge proponent for CDI boxes, but I never realized the gains he touts, and I definately wouldn't make it a priority over something like an exhaust, but it's definatly an part not to be overlooked in a modified car.
FWIW, do you know what made even more difference in smoothness and idle transition than the MSD box? MSD 8.5mm wires- they are AWESOME, and cheaper than most others. Plus they come with a heat jacket.

imloggedin

whats the difference between the HI-6 and the HI-6S http://store.summitracing.com/partde...%2D6300&view=1

RETed

HI-6S is NOT a CDI box.&nbsp; This thing just ups the voltage going into the coil.

You want the HI-6.


-Ted

imloggedin

thanks ted

Tofuball

If your wires are giving you a noticeable gain, I'll have to ask you, how old were the ones you replaced?

MARTIN

Yea for real. People are saying that cdi boxes hardly give any noticeable gain. I cant imagine wires giving any gain at all other than if they were replacing extremely worn ones

ViperDude152

- The HI-6S is NOT compatible with DI Systems like in our cars. Its NOT a CDI Box. Its Just a Performance Ignition System. Its only for Distributer Points ignition. Its also for vehicals that have a redline below 8000 Rpm. It does have the Multi Spark System and Rev Limiter. Its basically for street driving not street/strip use..

It Not For Our Cars. MAybe The 12A but Not 13b or above.

- The HI-6 is for Points Ignition System or DI systems. It has the Rev limiter and the Multi Spark system. For Street / Racing Applications, Nitrous, Supercharged, Turbo. Also has an error checking system so you know exactly whats wrong with your ignition. For Vehicals that redline below 10,000 Rpm. 9,900 rpm Redline. 12,000 rpm operating racnge with rev limiter disabled.

HI-6 is they way you want to go.
Hi-6S just would not work on our cars.

Justin