I Give UP!!! (long)
03-24-04, 05:22 PM
#1
I Give UP!!! (long)
So I order a BRAND NEW TPS yesterday and had it sent next day so I could get my TII on the road ASAP. I install the sucker start the car to warm it so I can adjust it, meanwhile it is having a VERY hard time just trying to keep the engine alive. I was watching my LM-1 WB while doing so, and a plus so far is that the AFR readings are better at idle, instead of 11.5-8:1 before, it is now at about 12.5:1 and it does not smell as bad! 
The LM-1 will also give me voltage readings from the battery, before it was about 10.8 now it is 10.3 ( I even have the FD alternator install! Whats up with that?
Anyways back to the TPS situation. I reved it a few times and again all it would do is bog down and want to die. Another good thing with the AFR while reving they only went as high has 15.2:1, unlike before where it would reach 17:1. I shut down the engine to check/set the tps. The closest I could get it to the 1K ohms was 1.270K (and that was with the screw completly unthreaded) So I threaded it back on so it was at 1.430K ohms WOT 4.35k, put the IC back on and attach the hoses. Start her back up and the idle is some what better, AFRs are the same, while reving it seems alittle bit better, NOT much though.
I decided to try and take it for a little drive out of the garage and on my drive way. Reverse was pretty good AFRS reached a max of 13.8:1, but shot up to 15:1 under engine decleration. I try to engage it to first and again I could only rev it to about 1500rpm (AFRS 15.1:1) and it will not go higher unless I feather it pretty good and almost floor it, so I let the clutch out when the engine is at about 1500rpm. The rpms immediatly drop to 750rpms, BOGGING REALLY REALLY bad. NO power NO acceleration, and the acccelrator is just about floored! While keeping a close eye on the boost guage and it is almost out of vaccum at 0, (AFRS began to sky rocket like with the old tps; in the 16-18.5:1 area). Depress the clutch and the engine wants to die. Time to pull her back into the garage. I shut her down and check the TPS again. No it is at .980K ohms WOT 4.35k. I do not understand! I could not try and drive it again because I had to head to class.
I do not understand any of this, really other than the idle AFRS being 12.5:1 as opposed to 11.5:1 the new TPS did jackshit! I am so tempted to just part the damn SOB out right now and leave the RX7 world!!! I have had nothing but headaches trying to figure this problem out for the past week and a half!!
What hell is the damn cars problem?!?!
The LM-1 will also give me voltage readings from the battery, before it was about 10.8 now it is 10.3 ( I even have the FD alternator install! Whats up with that?Anyways back to the TPS situation. I reved it a few times and again all it would do is bog down and want to die. Another good thing with the AFR while reving they only went as high has 15.2:1, unlike before where it would reach 17:1. I shut down the engine to check/set the tps. The closest I could get it to the 1K ohms was 1.270K (and that was with the screw completly unthreaded) So I threaded it back on so it was at 1.430K ohms WOT 4.35k, put the IC back on and attach the hoses. Start her back up and the idle is some what better, AFRs are the same, while reving it seems alittle bit better, NOT much though.
I decided to try and take it for a little drive out of the garage and on my drive way. Reverse was pretty good AFRS reached a max of 13.8:1, but shot up to 15:1 under engine decleration. I try to engage it to first and again I could only rev it to about 1500rpm (AFRS 15.1:1) and it will not go higher unless I feather it pretty good and almost floor it, so I let the clutch out when the engine is at about 1500rpm. The rpms immediatly drop to 750rpms, BOGGING REALLY REALLY bad. NO power NO acceleration, and the acccelrator is just about floored! While keeping a close eye on the boost guage and it is almost out of vaccum at 0, (AFRS began to sky rocket like with the old tps; in the 16-18.5:1 area). Depress the clutch and the engine wants to die. Time to pull her back into the garage. I shut her down and check the TPS again. No it is at .980K ohms WOT 4.35k. I do not understand! I could not try and drive it again because I had to head to class.
I do not understand any of this, really other than the idle AFRS being 12.5:1 as opposed to 11.5:1 the new TPS did jackshit! I am so tempted to just part the damn SOB out right now and leave the RX7 world!!! I have had nothing but headaches trying to figure this problem out for the past week and a half!!
What hell is the damn cars problem?!?!
03-24-04, 05:46 PM
#2
Lives on the Forum
Do you still have the cold start intact?
If you are trying to adjust the TPS with the cold start still working, you NEED to have the engine fully warmed up to eliminate the fast idle cam affecting the throttle plates.
This really sounds like you were trying to do with with your cold start system intact and the engine still cold.
-Ted
If you are trying to adjust the TPS with the cold start still working, you NEED to have the engine fully warmed up to eliminate the fast idle cam affecting the throttle plates.
This really sounds like you were trying to do with with your cold start system intact and the engine still cold.
-Ted
03-24-04, 08:24 PM
#3
Like I said above, I installed it, warmed it up till the engine was warmed up check it the first time and it was at 2.036k ohms, then I adjusted to 1.430k ohms ( that was the lowest I could go without the adjuster screw not being on). Then I started it back up til it warmed up again then I checked it again, this time it was at 0.980k ohms ( I did nothing BUT check the resistance).
So YES the engine WAS fully warmed when the TPS was adjusted the first time, second time I just checked it.
I have read that people have run their car without a TPS and that if the TPS is bad it reads like it is at WOT (ie running rich). But that does not explain why I lean out when I give throttle input....
So YES the engine WAS fully warmed when the TPS was adjusted the first time, second time I just checked it.
I have read that people have run their car without a TPS and that if the TPS is bad it reads like it is at WOT (ie running rich). But that does not explain why I lean out when I give throttle input....
03-24-04, 10:57 PM
#5
Yes it idles smooth, maybe not at exactly at 750, but somewhere inbetween 700-800 which is in the +- 50 rpm spec....
Ok I just went to check it out again. I warmed it up then turned if off after. Again I was watching the AFRs and they were very low 11.5:1. After it was running for a few minutes I tried to rev it a little and everytime I would give it ANY throttle it would top out at 1500 rpms and bog down, AFRS were reaching 16:1, which is bad. The only way I can get it to go over that 15oo rpm hump is it fether the throttle alot like 5 secs then it will increase in engine speed. After a few more minutes I turned it off.
I check the TPS again and it was at 1.021 K and WOT 4.320K, which is still in spec, and evrything could be A ok, right? But it is not. So I started it back up again and tried to rev it and drive it and AGAIN I can only rev it to 1500rpm, and I have to feather it alot to get it to go over that.
Like I said above, when I give it like 5-10% throttle (more like just ever so slightly applying pressure) It will ONLY rev to 1500 rpm, bog out and the AFRS get really high. Before I installed my reman I did not have this kind of problem, the only problem I ever had was my idle was a bit high at about 850-900 rpms, and that was with the old TPS.
Seriously, I am out of ideas on what the problem could be ( I really doubt it is the TPS), and I am getting VERY frustrtaed with this POS!
I also do not understand why my voltage is so low, ecspcially with the FD alternator installed...
Ok I just went to check it out again. I warmed it up then turned if off after. Again I was watching the AFRs and they were very low 11.5:1. After it was running for a few minutes I tried to rev it a little and everytime I would give it ANY throttle it would top out at 1500 rpms and bog down, AFRS were reaching 16:1, which is bad. The only way I can get it to go over that 15oo rpm hump is it fether the throttle alot like 5 secs then it will increase in engine speed. After a few more minutes I turned it off.
I check the TPS again and it was at 1.021 K and WOT 4.320K, which is still in spec, and evrything could be A ok, right? But it is not. So I started it back up again and tried to rev it and drive it and AGAIN I can only rev it to 1500rpm, and I have to feather it alot to get it to go over that.
Like I said above, when I give it like 5-10% throttle (more like just ever so slightly applying pressure) It will ONLY rev to 1500 rpm, bog out and the AFRS get really high. Before I installed my reman I did not have this kind of problem, the only problem I ever had was my idle was a bit high at about 850-900 rpms, and that was with the old TPS.
Seriously, I am out of ideas on what the problem could be ( I really doubt it is the TPS), and I am getting VERY frustrtaed with this POS!
I also do not understand why my voltage is so low, ecspcially with the FD alternator installed...
Last edited by eyecandy; 03-24-04 at 11:03 PM.
03-24-04, 11:41 PM
#6
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I'd chase that charging problem first. If your voltage is actually that low, that can wreak havoc with the ECU, cause internal regulation problems, etc.
If a diode in the rectifier is shorted to ground it can introduce ac voltages into the grorunding path. More engine management worries.
Pull that alternator & get it tested at a compotent shop, NOT an Autozone.
j.p
If a diode in the rectifier is shorted to ground it can introduce ac voltages into the grorunding path. More engine management worries.
Pull that alternator & get it tested at a compotent shop, NOT an Autozone.
j.p
03-24-04, 11:45 PM
#7
Hmmm I JUST got the FD alternator from silverrotor (sp?) last friday and installed it.... The problem is when it first starts up, maybe fore the first 2-3 minutes then it seems to pick up to about 11.5 volts (from 9.9-10.3). Its like the engine is rerouting power to the coils and such for warm up....
I might try to add some more grounds to the car tomorrow and see if that helps the voltage problem... how can I see iff the ECU is seeing the right amount of volts?
BTW the readings I am getting is from the LM-1 (when the sensor is warming up) Its says Bat: voltage reading, so I assume that is the voltage from the whole car, not just the battery. Because like I sdaid before after hose few minutes all the electricall stuff somes to life, and the voltage raises, then the LM-1 goes to AFR mode so I cannot see what the voltage is after that.....
I might try to add some more grounds to the car tomorrow and see if that helps the voltage problem... how can I see iff the ECU is seeing the right amount of volts?
BTW the readings I am getting is from the LM-1 (when the sensor is warming up) Its says Bat: voltage reading, so I assume that is the voltage from the whole car, not just the battery. Because like I sdaid before after hose few minutes all the electricall stuff somes to life, and the voltage raises, then the LM-1 goes to AFR mode so I cannot see what the voltage is after that.....
Last edited by eyecandy; 03-24-04 at 11:49 PM.
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03-25-04, 12:25 AM
#8
Lives on the Forum
Yeah, the voltage is low.
Check with a DMM to see if it's actually reading correctly.
Also, I would suggest scanning for error codes from the ECU.
I think you have an intermittent connection problem with a fuel injector somewhere.
-Ted
Check with a DMM to see if it's actually reading correctly.
Also, I would suggest scanning for error codes from the ECU.
I think you have an intermittent connection problem with a fuel injector somewhere.
-Ted
03-25-04, 07:52 AM
#11
Lives on the Forum
03-25-04, 12:44 PM
#13
Lives on the Forum
Doh, my bad, stupid Zenki error codes don't check the fuel injector leads.
Double check the plugs anyways - I know at least one thread in here that the owner blamed the fuel injector plugs not being fully connected for their headaches.
The original plugs are bad an crumbling - the pins could've misaligned when you installed them.
Long shot - how long have the injectors been sitting around before you installed and used them?
-Ted
Double check the plugs anyways - I know at least one thread in here that the owner blamed the fuel injector plugs not being fully connected for their headaches.
The original plugs are bad an crumbling - the pins could've misaligned when you installed them.
Long shot - how long have the injectors been sitting around before you installed and used them?
-Ted
03-25-04, 02:06 PM
#15
Lives on the Forum
Originally posted by Fitness Stain
will the injectors sitting for a long time cause problems?
mine have been sitting for months, and i dont want them to crap out
will the injectors sitting for a long time cause problems?
mine have been sitting for months, and i dont want them to crap out
Try and contact the guys who did the cleaning to see if it is okay.
The local shop we go to can't find a cleaner and lubricant that can let the injectors set over 2 to 3 weeks.
-Ted
03-25-04, 05:08 PM
#18
My engine blew last Oct, so they were on the engine until about March 9rd, I sent them out to get cleaned that day got them back like the 14th, installed them about 4 days later and that is when they were first used. So in short since they were cleaned/balanced thay only sat at most 6 days....
Dammit! I am getting sick and tired of taking the UIM off! In the past week and a half I have prolly taken it off about 4 times! Oh I guess its for the better
Dammit! I am getting sick and tired of taking the UIM off! In the past week and a half I have prolly taken it off about 4 times! Oh I guess its for the better
03-25-04, 05:55 PM
#19
Its 11.98 volts at the battery and 12.02 volts at the alternator, while the car is off. I could not check it while it was running because after it was running for like 3 minutes I let in the throttle pretty good ( got it to rev about 2200rpm) and all the electronics got really bright, almost like a power surge ( I am assuming that the voltage shot up higher), and it died immediatly. I am not sure if got flooded or what.... Because I went to try and restart it and it will not start. It turns over fine, I am not sure if there is vapor lock or if it is flooded. When I look in the exhaust after I try and start it alot of smoke billows out. What does that mean?
03-26-04, 12:31 AM
#20
Hmmmm, well I reinstalled the S4 alternator, and I checked the volatge at the battery and the alternator and they are about at 12.34 volts whiel the car is off. So it is a little better. But the car still will not start. I think it keeps on flooding, because when I remove the spark plugs they are soaked in gasoline....
I think it keeps on flooding, because when I remove the spark plugs they are soaked in gasoline....
03-26-04, 01:23 AM
#21
Ok got the car unflooded and started up. Check the voltage at the battery 14.09 and the alternator 14.23, ALOT better! Looks like Silverrotor sent me a faulty alternator
Although now I have idle problems, while it warms up it flacutates from 1050-1250 rpms, then it idles at 550-600 rpm..... I check the TPS and at first it was good at .978K ohms and WOT was the same a 4.23K ohms. but when I released the throttle it went up to 1.3K ohms, whats going on? Well the adjust screw is out at its max, so I have to try and realign the tps so it would push the plunger in further, so now it is back at .996K ohms and when I move the throttle it stays at that point.
Its late so I didn;t feel like restarting the car. But I still get bogginess when I give throttle input, like beofore I have to feather the throttle to get it to rev... Its like it just dies for a split second until I let off the throttle. The other bonus is the AFRS are up to 12.5-13.1:1 at idle, but liek I said earlier when i give it any throttle it bogs down and the AFRs go up to 14.7-15.2:1 which isn't as bad as before, but that is still not normal.
So it is partially fixed, but it is still no where near driveable....
Although now I have idle problems, while it warms up it flacutates from 1050-1250 rpms, then it idles at 550-600 rpm..... I check the TPS and at first it was good at .978K ohms and WOT was the same a 4.23K ohms. but when I released the throttle it went up to 1.3K ohms, whats going on? Well the adjust screw is out at its max, so I have to try and realign the tps so it would push the plunger in further, so now it is back at .996K ohms and when I move the throttle it stays at that point.
Its late so I didn;t feel like restarting the car. But I still get bogginess when I give throttle input, like beofore I have to feather the throttle to get it to rev... Its like it just dies for a split second until I let off the throttle. The other bonus is the AFRS are up to 12.5-13.1:1 at idle, but liek I said earlier when i give it any throttle it bogs down and the AFRs go up to 14.7-15.2:1 which isn't as bad as before, but that is still not normal.
So it is partially fixed, but it is still no where near driveable....
03-26-04, 06:39 AM
#22
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Have you done the obvious stuff, like ...
new fuel filter
Looks like you have fuel delivery problem: not enough fuel pressure, injector problem, signal from ECU to injector problem, etc etc ... Check thehaynes manual or FSM for proper troubleshooting.
hugues -
new fuel filter
Looks like you have fuel delivery problem: not enough fuel pressure, injector problem, signal from ECU to injector problem, etc etc ... Check thehaynes manual or FSM for proper troubleshooting.
hugues -
03-26-04, 10:57 AM
#23
I replaced the fuel filter with a OEM mazda one when the engine was installed about 2 weeks ago, the injectors were cleaned and balanced 2 days before that...
Now the POS will not even hold an idle!!!! The rpms will fluctuate from 400-800 REAL BAD, and any throttle input I give the engine it will not respond! AFter about 5 secs of that it shuts down! I check the spark plugs, even changed the wires (because it sounded like it was missing) and it still does the same thing! I am really getting F'N pissed off now! I fix one F'N problem and another comes right around! This is my last shot, I am going to recheck all vacuum lines and senors, wires, everything! Because I cannot think of anything else to do to fix it POS!
I really appreciate all the help you guys have given me thus far!
Now the POS will not even hold an idle!!!! The rpms will fluctuate from 400-800 REAL BAD, and any throttle input I give the engine it will not respond! AFter about 5 secs of that it shuts down! I check the spark plugs, even changed the wires (because it sounded like it was missing) and it still does the same thing! I am really getting F'N pissed off now! I fix one F'N problem and another comes right around! This is my last shot, I am going to recheck all vacuum lines and senors, wires, everything! Because I cannot think of anything else to do to fix it POS!
I really appreciate all the help you guys have given me thus far!
03-26-04, 01:47 PM
#24
I just checked everyting under the UIM, all the connections, vac lies, fuel lines, injectors, etc. Put everything back on and it ran for 2 secs, a very bad idle and died. Tried to restart it and it would not start, it runs over fine but nothing happens, the temp/fan light came on and was beeping when I was trying to start it, it wasn't warm so I do not see why that came on...
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