Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

So pretty much, the rear shocks in my rx-7 are pretty much shot. I feel lots of "roll" around corners (well, more than there should be) and on anything less than glass smooth asphalt, I feel like i'm bouncing around on a pogo stick. Of course, i'm exaggerating, but it just doesn't feel as solid as it should. Pretty much, my handling is not inspiring confidence at the moment. The shocks have 124,000 miles on them. One of the shops I went to commented on the shocks being old, and probably needing replacing. I was already planning to replace them anyway, and have come up with a couple of solutions that I might like to pursue:

Solution 1: Bilstein shocks and Ground Control sleeve coilovers.
I never really knew about sleeve coilovers until an E36 friend of mine recommended this. Apparently, quite a few E36 guys run bilsteins with the ground control sleeves. This setup all in all will probably cost nearly 1000 dollars. The quality is supposed to be superb, and perormance is not supposed to differ from threaded body coilovers.

Solution 2: Threaded Body Coilovers
My cousin suggested that I might as well go all the way and get coilovers. Used coilovers will not be a big deal for me, as I'd rather not drop TOO much money, though it will probably be inevitable. Looking around on RX-7 forums, I have taken interest in FC coilovers by JIC, Zeal, and Silkroad. All are supposed to be quality coilovers. JICs are relatively easy to find, and I can get a set of FLT-A2s for 1200 bucks. Zeals are ultra expensive, upwards of 2500 dollars a set. Silkroads are what I am REALLY looking for. They are pretty rare, as I barely ever see anyone running them. However, those who do run them feel that they are some of the best coilovers for the fc, especially given the retail price of around 1500 dollars.

Does anyone here have any suggestions and/or comments on the solutions mentioned? If anyone has experience with the shocks/coilovers I listed, please do share. I do not really care about harsh ride quality. The original intent of this car was to build a street driven car that would shine on the track. As of right now, the car is a daily driver. It will probably remain a daily driver, but performance is more important to me than comfort, which is why I felt that coilovers might be a feasible solution. Of course, I never realy thought about what it'd be like to break my back over cracks in the road, but I'd definitely like to see any and all opinions on this.

beamer242

what kind of ride are you looking for? how much do you want to drop the car? and how much are you looking to spend? you said prices, but not your budget.

Brian

Black91n/a

Body roll has nothing to do with shocks, how fast it rolls over does, but in steady state cornering it's the springs and sways that dictate how much roll you'll get.

I wouldn't touch JIC's with a 10 foot pole. I've heard many reports of shitty reliability and even shittier customer service. Several people on this forum have had them and regretted it when they blew after not too long and they had enourmous headaches getting them fixed.

Rarity (the Silkroads) isn't necessarily a good thing. I don't beleive they're serviceable in North America, meaning when they get old and need a rebuild (all shocks will need one eventually) they'll need to be shipped back to Japan and you'll have no suspension for months on end. I'd definetely advise that you get something that's servicable in North America, which will make things easier for you down the road.

About the Bilsteins, they're good shocks, but they're not adjustable, and they're setup for stock or nearly stock spring rates, so putting GC coilovers on them will mean that you've got an underdamped suspension and it'll be quite bouncy. Koni Yellows are adjustable and they can handle some pretty stiff springs without needing a revalve, so they're a better choice for an off the shelf solution (the Bilsteins can be revalved, but it adds cost).

You should search through the forums looking at the different options. Rishie at AutoRnD is a forum member here and has advised many people on coilovers and seems to give good advice and seems to really know his stuff. I may be wrong, but I do beleive he used to sell and promote the JIC's but dropped them after the reliability and service issues came to light. There's lots of others who have experiance and good advice, and there's even a thread of the sub $1500 coilover options for the FC.

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

For prices, I understand that there's pretty much no getting around spending a good deal on suspension. I don't want to cheap out only to regret it later on. On another (non rx7 specific forum), I've been recommended D2s and Megans, which I haven't really heard good things about. Pretty much, I'm willing to spend whatever is necessary to achieve my ends. Whether they can be achieved for cheaper (used) is another story. I've heard good things about koni, but never really took into account the adjustability aspect of them.

I will give autornd a call tomorrow. I actually live about 15 minutes away.

Healing

Just as Black91n/a mentioned, the Bilsteins are a bit on the soft side from what I've seen. KYB AGX's seem to be the general concensus for the best bang for the buck for the FC, and lots of people have paired these with the Ground Control sleeves with good results. Another bonus of the AGX's is that the rear settings are adjusted on a **** on the side of the shock, rather than on top. This prevents you having to cut/remove your speaker towers, if you want to keep those. Otherwise, adjusting the rear shocks can turn out to be a real PITA for other shocks/coilovers.

For this reason, I myself am strongly considering the AGX/Ground Control setup for my street driven FC (and perhaps occasional track warrior).

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

How would the AGX compare to the koni yellows in their quality/adjustability? Do you think they would work well with the gc sleeves?

arghx

iTrader: (3)

You want to get something monotube if you can afford it. The Tein Flex coilovers (not the SS) fit the bill.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Yeah I got the Tokico HP/Blue's. While they're not bad shocks, they are twin tube and non-adjustable. They feel really stiff to me for daily driving.

sar

iTrader: (1)

I decided not to go coilover: ground control or otherwise because I decided that I really didn't need height adjustment and in most cases don't need the other spring adjustment. Just getting KYBs and Springs costs less than $500 and gets you a nice static setup... why do you need the full coilover or even the ground control?

Stephen

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

Simply because I want it to be the best that it can be so to speak. I will be tracking this car, it definitely will not be only street driven. However, I don't want to sacrifice performance for liveability. It's hard to explain, but something inside me would rather drive a rough as hell track car than get a car that won't perform...QUITE as well on the track. I may very well be out of my mind.

If I was to go the shocks/springs route, in terms of the best quality/performance, which brands would I be looking at. This is of course within a reasonable price range. I definitely can't afford Ohlins or anything like that. But KYB AGX, Bilstein, and Koni are all brands that I have looked at and considered. What would give me the best performance given the price range of those shocks?

Healing

http://www.koni-na.com/presentations/civic/

Here, you'll be able to find some helpful shock dynos.

RotaryBuddha

iTrader: (4)

or how about ksport this is what i plan on running.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/KSpor...spagenameZWD1V

their was someone on here doing a group buy a while back that could save you some extra.

Richter12x2

iTrader: (1)

I did this a couple of months ago, picked up a full set of Tokico Illuminas on e-bay, new in box for less than $400, and a ground control set direct from groundcontrol.com for about $400 more, and $800 is cheaper by a couple hundred than what you've mentioned so far. I've been very happy with them so far, but if you corner hard sometimes you'll unload the springs enough for them to pop against the upper mount when the strut compresses again. Ground control will tell you that their RX7 kit is for a 6" spring in the front, and a 7" in the rear. Tell them you want an 8" in the rear. Otherwise, to get the car to sit right, you'll have the back dialed out to the top, and the front dialed to the bottom, which kinda defeats the point of adjustable height coilovers.

The only other words of wisdom is that 440 lb fronts and 300 lb rears is probably a bit stiff for a daily driver

Oh, and Mazda's competition parts catalog lists the Illumina's, along with Koni and GAB, so I took that as an endorsement.

Black91n/a

From what I've read the Koni's are better than the AGX, and can handle stiffer springs, but the AGX's are a very good deal, and the rear adjuster is a nice thing for us.

As for the D2, Megan, KSport, etc, I'd seriously doubt their valving and durability. I'd never trust them to have anything very close to ideal damping and I'd expect that to get prices that low that they'd have to cheap out (at least a bit) on the internals, meaning they'll probably wear out or blow out sooner.

I agree that if you want the best, get a monotube shock, but the Tein Flex is a twin tube. There's going to me a Mono Flex coming out some time this year probably, which should be pretty good.

I'm going to be buying some coilovers myself next year, and right now the Tein Mono Flex (depending on pricing and spring rates), and the Buddy Club RSD's are on the top of my wish list. The BC's should be good, they're monotube, have decent spring rates (a little stiffer than I'd like, but it should be ok) they've got a good reputation and are rebuildable in the US. There's a dyno plot of them on the Honda-Tech forum, and it seems decent, they've got a HUGE range of adjustment. The MSRP is $1880, but I've seen them for sale for under $1500. I'd expect the Mono Flex to be $1600+.

I had been thinking of getting Koni's and GC's but then when I priced it all out with camber plates, it's into the $1300 range, not cheap, but it can be done piecewise, which is probably one of it's greatest selling features (along with whatever rates you want at no extra charge). I decided that I wanted monotubes, especially seeing as I could get them, plus shock body adjustability for less than $200 more than the Koni + GC + camber plates combo.

Sideways7

iTrader: (7)

My car has AGX's with the GC coil-overs and GC front camber/caster plates, and its great. The previous owner tracked it to great success (whipping trailored-in 944's) and I have done much backroad driving in it. I feel it is a wonderful setup for a track car that is street driven sometimes. It has no perceptable body roll and is very predictable in the corners, even on questionable rubber ( Ecsta Supra 712's.) Most people will find it too hard for a daily driver, but its far from unlivable. I used it as a daily driver for several years and as long as you went slow over speed bumps and railroad tracks, you're fine.

snowball

a friend of mine just bought the STANCE GR+ PRO coilovers 2 days ago. we got them on today and went for some driving today. The car handles soooo much better its not funny. You can throw the car at corners at speeds that would have been unthinkable. body roll is almost 0. The ride quality although firm is not much harder than stock.

Healing

Stance is a relatively new company - but everyone who has them has only good things to say about them. Still, I'm waiting to see how they last in the long run...

Tein Flex is soft. Too soft.

snowball

the stance look very well built, i dont have any other coilover experience to compare too though. they gave him 2 spring sets too, 8/6 and 9/7

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

What are the differences between koni yellows and koni reds?

I've always been under the impression that the yellows are very performance oriented. However, a friend of mine working at a european auto shop mentioned koni reds the other day. Now he probably isn't nearly experienced enough to know, but it got me thinking about the differences betweem yellows and reds.

Black91n/a

The reds are more of a premium OEM replacement. I don't beleive they're externally adjustable. The Yellows are the sport model. They'll be able to handle stiffer springs and are externally adjustable.