2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992) 1986-1992 Discussion including performance modifications and technical support sections.

Heat shields above the cats

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 10, 2024 | 09:47 PM
  #1  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Heat shields above the cats

Hi everyone,
While my engine and transmission are out I have the chance to clean-up the bottom of the chassis. I found some heat shields bolted to the body above where the catalectic convertors are, never knew they were there!
I removed them, had them sandblasted, primed and painted with exhaust hi-heat Rust-oleum. Ready to put them back on.

I should have taken a photo of them before I removed them! I can't figure out where they bolted to, Every time I think I figured out where they go they either block where the transmission mount goes or the shifter opening is! Here is a photo after I removed them.



Can someone help me with the correct positioning of the shield? The factory undercoating you see faces away from the body, only two ways it can fit! I count six holes where the bolts went. Thats not counting the two bolts that go to the captive nuts that hold the three pieces together.
Thanks
Reply
Old Sep 11, 2024 | 06:22 AM
  #2  
Jeff76's Avatar
Rotary Enthusiast
Community Builder
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 817
Likes: 168
From: Pittsburgh
The left piece in the picture goes closer to the rear of the car after the driveshaft, transmission and the rear sub-frame with the differential is installed. A hanging driveshaft that isn't connected to the diff will bend the shield.
Reply
Old Sep 11, 2024 | 05:11 PM
  #3  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Originally Posted by Jeff76
The left piece in the picture goes closer to the rear of the car after the driveshaft, transmission and the rear sub-frame with the differential is installed. A hanging driveshaft that isn't connected to the diff will bend the shield.
Thanks Jeff76, figures I have it bass actwards!

I swear the largest piece went where the transmission bellhousing is!

I went through all this because I have a BLACK GLX, anything to keep heat away from the cabin is important. The dealer made me switch to the newer freon which only cools at 75% of what the R13 did. Perhaps I will change it back?

I'll blame it all on global warming, working on the car in the hot sun all summer has fried my brain a bit.

Can't wait until I have a bunch of parts left over after I get it all back together.
Reply
Old Sep 11, 2024 | 09:28 PM
  #4  
Jeff76's Avatar
Rotary Enthusiast
Community Builder
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 817
Likes: 168
From: Pittsburgh
I am gunning for you with your restoration. Many wouldn't have gotten as far as you have.

Take care of yourself out there. Heat stroke is a killer.

My battery died before I could take more pictures. Here is part of the rear shield so you have a bit of an idea where it starts.



The shields are important. I saw some jokes here about melting your passengers shoes soles. 😆
The first S5 I rode in and later bought, my friend drove the car so hard the cats were glowing red with heat.

Last edited by Jeff76; Sep 11, 2024 at 09:33 PM.
Reply
Old Sep 12, 2024 | 07:33 PM
  #5  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
installed heat shields

They are finally installed correctly!


Back shield

Middle shield

Front shield

complete shield install

It looks like the driveshaft mount on the differential is off center to the tunnel!
Is this the reason for u-joints?

I'm pleased that parts are being put back in now.

It looks like I will have to remove the back shield to install the transmission and driveshaft.
Reply
Old Sep 12, 2024 | 08:18 PM
  #6  
Jeff76's Avatar
Rotary Enthusiast
Community Builder
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 817
Likes: 168
From: Pittsburgh
[QUOTE][t looks like the driveshaft mount on the differential is off center to the tunnel!/QUOTE]

Good question, I just looked at mine. The drive shaft is straight with the transmission but not centered in the tunnel. I would assume that the tunnel needs centered because of the seats, etc. The rest fits so.....

It's looking good so far. I will say though the second one is blocking the holes for the trans mount. There is a fourth very small shield on the mount as well. This will keep some of the heat off of the bushing, hopefully extending the life of it.



The center bushing is up side down, I have since fixed it.
Reply
Old Sep 13, 2024 | 07:08 PM
  #7  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Getting things to fit on the reassembly.

(Quote) I will say though the second one is blocking the holes for the trans mount.

I will have to bend the shields somewhat to get the transmission in place. I am impressed with the level of engineering that went into the design of RX-7's.

They have gone to great lengths to control where the hi-temp exhaust gasses leave the engine.

I plan on installing a header type exhaust manifold, it just looks too good not to have one!
I will wrap it with insulating material to minimize the engine compartment heat level, perhaps fabricate a sheet metal heat deflector above the header.

What do you think?


Reply
Old Sep 13, 2024 | 09:34 PM
  #8  
Jeff76's Avatar
Rotary Enthusiast
Community Builder
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 817
Likes: 168
From: Pittsburgh
I have been researching this for a bit now. I have read were some suggest it especially with a turbo and the cast iron manifold.
Aftermarket sheilds do exist, Racing Beat I think. Maybe for a 12a though? An N/A with a header won't hold as much heat as a cast one.
I saw a post where Aaron c said it wasn't necessary with a header. I personally would want something. Even if was just a half one like the Racing Beat one.

Perhaps someone else has some input here too.
Reply
Old Jan 15, 2025 | 12:22 AM
  #9  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Thoughts on a header heat shield

As we all know the denser the air/fuel mixture the more power the engine will produce.

Even though the ECU will determine the correct A/F mixture at a given temperature the cooler the intake air the more power the engine will produce.

So, anything to reduce the intake air temperature will make more power along with cooler fuel temperature.

And we all also know that rainy days make the engine run smoother. Higher humidity taking up some space in the A/F mix! (water injection)

That makes an argument for blocking the heat from the exhaust from increasing the air temperature entering the engine.

If you can deflect the exhaust manifold (header) heat away from the intake air ducting it will be beneficial to the power output of the engine.

Also, if you can incorporate a cool can (dried Ice) into the fuel inlet flow it will increase the density. (power)

Will these modifications be worth the effort? (on a 13B NA)

Your thoughts are appreciated.
Reply
Old Jan 18, 2025 | 02:06 AM
  #10  
Malic's Avatar
Full Member
Veteran: Air Force
 
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 166
Likes: 38
From: Minnesota
Dry ice flowing into the air inlet, no.

Dry ice is just frozen carbon dioxide, it evaporates and is just another gas that can not be combusted. You cool down the air, but then add a non-combustible gas, you would make less power by doing this, lots of this documented with drag racers at all tiers.

Dry ice cooling an intercooler, yes, as it cools the metal, that pulls more heat from the air charge, make sure the air flow does not go into the intake. Dry ice in a bine solution for an air to water intercooler to get below freezing temps would see benefits too.

This is why the FC has the tube that pulls air from in front of the radiators that the hood rubber wraps around when shut, so it gets as cool air as it can.

Last edited by Malic; Jan 18, 2025 at 02:12 AM.
Reply
Old Jan 18, 2025 | 04:01 PM
  #11  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Originally Posted by Malic
Dry ice flowing into the air inlet, no.

Dry ice is just frozen carbon dioxide, it evaporates and is just another gas that can not be combusted. You cool down the air, but then add a non-combustible gas, you would make less power by doing this, lots of this documented with drag racers at all tiers.

Dry ice cooling an intercooler, yes, as it cools the metal, that pulls more heat from the air charge, make sure the air flow does not go into the intake. Dry ice in a bine solution for an air to water intercooler to get below freezing temps would see benefits too.

This is why the FC has the tube that pulls air from in front of the radiators that the hood rubber wraps around when shut, so it gets as cool air as it can.
Thanks for the reply, but the dry ice is placed in a "cool can" which has a spiral of tubing carrying fuel alone. This lowers the fuel temperature entering the injectors.

The heat shield for the exhaust pipes prevents the heat generated from increasing the inlet air temperature. There were hood scoops to pull the cooler outside air directly into the carburetor.

Water injection into the inlet air stream will make the combustion event produce a bit more power by raising the compression, water vapor is not compressible.

What do you think, these are all things that were used in the 60's & 70's muscle cars, why not now?
Reply
Old Jan 18, 2025 | 04:59 PM
  #12  
Malic's Avatar
Full Member
Veteran: Air Force
 
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 166
Likes: 38
From: Minnesota
Are you planning on refilling it every 5-10 mins? Dry ice is not going to last long under hood even in a cool box, it has to vent to release the pressure as it turns from a solid to a gas or you have made a bomb.

Drag racers use them because they do a pull on the 1/4 mile and then refill before they go again.

An air to water intercooler, which once it heat soaks, is worse in a road going car then air to air. The only time an air to water is used is for either a) packaging reasons or b) drag racing, where it goes into what is described above, a cool box filled with water and ice, or a brine solution, which is corrosive and needs to be cleaned out after every race.

On a stock 13b, cooling the fuel is not going to have a noticeable power increase, less so on a non-turbo. They did it in the 60's and 70's because those cars were making 400+ hp and they were looking for fractions of seconds. Again, a 13b NA is not doing that.

Reply
Old Jan 19, 2025 | 05:59 PM
  #13  
gsmithrx7's Avatar
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Tenured Member: 10 Years
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 500
Likes: 78
From: Ware, MA
Originally Posted by Malic
Are you planning on refilling it every 5-10 mins? Dry ice is not going to last long under hood even in a cool box, it has to vent to release the pressure as it turns from a solid to a gas or you have made a bomb.

Drag racers use them because they do a pull on the 1/4 mile and then refill before they go again.

An air to water intercooler, which once it heat soaks, is worse in a road going car then air to air. The only time an air to water is used is for either a) packaging reasons or b) drag racing, where it goes into what is described above, a cool box filled with water and ice, or a brine solution, which is corrosive and needs to be cleaned out after every race.

On a stock 13b, cooling the fuel is not going to have a noticeable power increase, less so on a non-turbo. They did it in the 60's and 70's because those cars were making 400+ hp and they were looking for fractions of seconds. Again, a 13b NA is not doing that.
Yes I agree with everything you say. For my everyday grocery getter it would be a waste of time!

These performance enhancements are for those looking for that increase in performance, a few horsepower at a time. Another enhancement is Nitrous Oxide which used to be hidden in the roll bars, all for the fun of it.

The only thing I would add to my NA engine is water injection, I would need a system that only added vapor until the intake air was about 100% humidity. The added benefit of the vapor injection is to remove carbon from the rotor.

Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
HoustonMS3
2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992)
19
Jan 12, 2011 12:21 PM
TweakGames
2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992)
8
Nov 3, 2006 05:37 PM
litlred515
2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992)
3
Jun 2, 2003 01:23 AM
93redFD
3rd Generation Specific (1993-2002)
5
Jun 29, 2002 07:35 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:06 AM.