darinn

here is what i have so far..anyone wanna chime in before i place the near $500 order? (fuel extrusion is on its way already)

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

what kind of fuel rails do you have? Your gunna need something that will screw into the fuel rail. (ok I see now fuel rail extrusion, why not just use the stock rails?)

Your parts list is quite short.

And your gunna run -6 the whole way? Maybe its fine , but I went overkill.

darinn

im making my own fuel rails....pretty much the primary fuel rail will have a -6 elbo and straight oring fitting screwed in and the secondary will have 2 oring elbows screwed in, i will be drilling my own injector holes in the fuel rail....



saves some HUGE money.....

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

you're just gunna drill that thing?

Im doing the same thing with my 20b, but I plan on milling it ( I am very afraid of fuel fires)

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

what kind of power are you looking for

stock rails are good for a **** load of power.

darinn

not quite...its actually a 3 step proces and debur to get it to fit the fuel injectors..but basically yea im going to locate and measure the distance of the injectors, "drill" the holes", cut it to length, tap the 2 ends for -6 fittings, weld bracket mounts in the correct locations...fairly straight forward...



i think im more than capable of doing that

darinn

im shooting for 600whp on pump gas with AI, stock rails arent going to cut it....

darinn

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

man I just think -6 is too small.

I ran a -10 main line to a splitter, that reduced to -8 and I ran that for fuel rails then -6 out of the fuel rails to the regulator and then one -6 back to the tank.

It should handle all the power I want.

here is what I bought.


fuel system

-8 to 14X1.5 MRG-A148M 9.39 X2
-6 to 12X1.25 90 EAR-949091ERL x2

fuel tubing -10 SUM-G2558
fuel tubing -8 RUS-639280
Tube nuts -10 EAR-981810ERL x2
tube sleeves -10 EAR-981910ERL x2
tube nuts -8
tube sleeves -8 RUS-660660 x2

line clamps SUM-G1883


-8 90 swivel EAR-809108ERL x2
-6 90 swivel EAR-809106ERL x2

FPR AEI-13109

-6 fpr adaptor SUM-220166 x3
fpr gauge SUM-800160
-6 hose adaptor EAR-800106ERL x2
-6 180 EAR-818006ERL
-10 to -8 y MRF-MP-6208
-8 hose adaptor EAR-800108ERL


What turbo it that?

darinn

hrm, i see what you are saying, -6 should be good to 650 or so from what i read etc... -8 becomes much more costly, budget for fuel is $500 or so not $700 heh

turbo on the top is a holeset hx52, turbo on the bottom is a holeset h2e

Havoc

I went -8 and 1/2" inch wasnt that much more, and flows heaps, also means you dont need as many splitters as just run a bigger single pump

I wouldn't bother with 2 lift pumps, just run one 044 etc.

darinn

sexy sexy, i picked up 4 walbro 255s for $40 each, figured it was a great chance to run a real redundant fuel system... 4 pumps total is indeed very very redundant is it needed? naw not really....so hence the reason i threw the idea out there! looking like ill do 1/2inch as the main fuel line where the splitter is for now until i decide if im going quad pumps or dual

Havoc

Well technically you only have 2 pumps of redundancy, Also I would not call it redundency. If one feed pump fails, you then lean out and kill the engine.

Personally I beleive its better to have a full pump failure, lose all pressure and engine just stops.

1 walbro lift pump will be all you will need depending on your surge tank capacity.

If you do run duel feed pumps, be sure to run one way valves on them. Their are mant cases where (on here and in OZ) have had one pump over power the other. Then therefore engine then lean's out.

This for me was the reason I went a big single. (more redundancy)

Also this is how I did my engine bay and under car.





My lift pump 044

darinn

very good points all around, ill redraw my fuel setup and post it later today to see what everyone thinks...i know the 255's single can support 600whp correct? thats the only reason why i wanted to run dual of each....if one died it would still have plenty of pump power to run the engine at all rpm's

i found an aeromotive a1000 here local for $250 and a walbro 255 should be good for the lift pump in any case

Dorifter_LEXX

iTrader: (3)

You plan on building a complete fuel system with an fittings and ss fuel lines out of a $500 budget? I built a similar setup on my car, but mine was built in mind of 400whp only. Running one intank pump and one external pump. Everything was maybe around $1100 in total. There are many ways to go about these kind of setup.

darinn

no im planning on $500 for fittings and hose alone, not including fuel pumps, relays, wiring, injectors etc...only for fittings and hose ive decided to run 1 single pump for lift and efi, im 60% done with the drawing

Dorifter_LEXX

iTrader: (3)

Got cha. Yeah, two lift pump is over kill. You want something that can keep up with your external pump/pumps. You're only feeding the surge tank. And are you building your own surge tank or buying one? Just curious to see the design of it. I think it's best to get an actual swirl pot. With mine, I went with a Speed Machine surge tank. Not the best design, but it was the only thing I could find at the time (1.5 liter). Another thing to add on your diagram, another inline filter right before the Y block going to the rails. I used a Aeromotive 100 micron before the external pump (between the surge tank and the external pump), and a 10 mircron after (between the external pump and the Y splitter fuel block). Like I said, there are many ways to approach this, but you have to keep the basic concepts in mind.

I had to change the layout of my diagram plenty before I actually got it right. Good luck with your build, post up pics when you're done.

darinn

thanks for the info bud, i will be creating my own surge tank, maybe even post them for sale on here if anyone is interested, ill keep notes of how long each line is etc for a diy thread in the near future

do you have pics of your setup??

Havoc

this is my surge tank, holds about 2.5L.
try to keep it external from the car mate

darinn

Evil Aviator

Dual -6 AN lines should work OK, but you are going to need to step up to -8 AN for the single lines between the Y-adapters. A single -6 AN line is only good for about 500bhp before it begins to become a restriction, while a single -8 AN is good for roughly 1000bhp. Also, any external fuel pumps should use a suction line that is at least the same size as the inlet fitting.

Like Havoc, I am using -8AN and 1/2" hard line for everything except the fuel pump and pre-pump filter which require -10AN on the suction side. I am using KG fuel rails with 3/8NPT to -8AN adapters. I am expecting no more than 650bhp from my engine, so fuel flow will not be a problem. There is well over $3,000 in my fuel system, and I still need a few more fittings, lol.

darinn

yep yep, im doing 08 hard lines for almost everything except the fuel rail lines, ill post up the revised fuel line setup in an hour or less

darinn

Evil Aviator

Maybe drag cars are different, but road race cars usually have the following differences from your diagram:

- An additional 10micron filter is mounted between the fuel pump and the fuel rails because suction-side filters usually only have 100micron elements due to flow requirements.

- The return line goes from the FPR to the fuel tank rather than the surge tank. If there is a lot of recirculation through the return line, the fuel can get really hot and run the engine lean. The fuel can cool off better if it passes through the larger fuel tank as opposed to the small surge tank. The less the engine operates below the peak level, the less this will be an issue.

- The fuel tank and surge tank pumps are of the same capacity. If you use a wimpy fuel pump to feed the surge tank, then the engine can run lean if it operates at peak levels long enough to suck the fuel from the surge tank before the pump can replenish it. If the engine will only operate at peak levels for very brief periods, and the surge tank is of adequate size, then it is probably OK to use a lesser pump to feed the surge tank.

Also, I noticed that you changed your diagram from Magnafuel Y-fittings to traditional Y-blocks. I haven't tried it out yet, but I recently bought a Magnafuel Y-fitting for my car because it saves a lot of time and money, plus it has less failure points. So far it looks like it will work out well, but the purple finish does look pretty rice, lol.
http://www.magnafuel.com/products/ac...ings/index.htm

darinn

the magnafuel fittings are $37.99 each...pretty stupid if you ask me, i can machine my own y block and have it anodized any color i want for cheaper

idk man everywhere ive read about surge tanks this is the way to do it, and you are always supposed to use a smaller pump as the lift pump than the efi pump