ok folks, don't bring T2 into the talk please, it's like to compare Node with ... well ... anybody else

So, what could be the advantage of a second gen (NA, no convertible too) over a first gen (mainly SE in my case)?

power is "about" same (or can be made as fast), cheap aftermark, go-kart handling....

don't forget that styling is only a mather of taste too

Or why you bought Serie4-5 over a first gen could also help me too...

 

I actually like the way the -SE looks better than the FC. But I sold it because I wanted another TII.

The FC seems to be a much better daily type car. In the way the car feels, its kind of like the FC is a 300 ZX and the -SE is a go kart

The -SE has very old and outdated suspension. Worm gear steering? I mean, come on!

I'd get whichever one you could come across first.

BTW, there is a guy in the 1st gen forum that has a 200k mile -SE with a big carb setup and exhaust running 14.20's

 

I like the FB, but there are little things (improvements) that they made to the FC. Like how the doors shut, interior noise, all the creature comforts I guess...

But hey, i'm keeping both of mine

 

First and foremost the second generation does not have that three dollar bill steering rack that the First Gen has. That steering box is represenative of all that was wrong with American cars of the fifties and sixties. Oh heck, throw in the eighties too.
The second generation has a fully independent suspension, something that my 82 should have come standard with. The brakes should have been disc all the way around, which they were not.
I still have the 82, but due to the faulty steering box that cost 500 dig ones to replace, it may be headed for a new owner. By the way I'm aware of the methods of tightening up the slack in the box. Its just too worn out.

 

Independant Rear Suspension, Independant Rear Suspension, Independant Rear Suspension, Independant Rear Suspension, Independant Rear Suspension, Independant Rear Suspension,

I owned an '84 GSLSE and a '90 'vert. The handling of the 2nd gen is WAY more stable. In the '84, if the rear twitched more than a foot, you were going for a ride on the Merry-Go-Round. The second gen allowed for a lot more oversteer before the tail would give up.

I got my final proof of handling a few years ago. A friend bought an '85 GSLSE while I had my 'vert. At the next autocross, we were pretty dead even. For the next event, I was the chairman (got to design the course). Abusing my privilege, I added a few elements that I knew the FC could handle but may upset an FB. Sure enough, at the end of the day the difference wasn't tenths, it was full seconds.

 

Remember FC people this can go 2 ways..


FB: (GSL-SE)
Cons:
Steering box
Live rear axle
Pros:
Light
Solid interior (Quieter)
Cost

FC: (NON-TII, NON-Vert)
Cons:
Crappy electronics. (BIG PROBLEM)
Crappy 4 wheel steering (Very un controllable, Fixable)
Crappy Plastic radiator (Fixable) Heavy
Pros:
IRS
A little more power (Depending on year)
Rack & Pinion steering


If i where gonna do a FC i would do an 89+ Other wise i would go with a GSL-SE....

The pre 89 Cars had tons of electrical problems. Almost undrivable at times. But the 89+ cars are much better & have more power.. But of course they aslo cost more.


-Zach

 

I think electronics were a factor in both cars.
My '84 went thru a combo switch (headlights), Cruise control box, factory stereo, and the tach.

The second gens are susceptible to wiper switch, headlight switch, clock, and CPU issues. All of the fixes except for a toasted headlight switch won't set you back more than a few bucks in solder and relays.

 

I saw alot more problems with my 86...

Bad MAF, Horn, Dummy ligts, Wippers, Air conditioning, 3K stumble, Tach, Spedo, also a bad headlight motor....Oh, and the stereo was crap. Oh, and the sunroof... Most of these problems where from the ECU or the dummy light having cold solder joints.
Owned for about 10K miles. had 98K when sold.


My 84 GSL-SE has had no problemsOwned for about 20K miles 130K on the clock.


-Zach

 

The GTU / GTU-S has more power than the GSL-SE's did. Better handling too.

 

Sounds like we both got cars built on a Friday

 

I like both. I have one of each. But if I had to choose between an SE and a NA 2nd gen. No contest I would be driving the SE. For any one who complains about the live axle. Get a grip. With minor mods (springs, shocks and bushnings) it will handle as well or better than A second gen. The first Gen is much more nimble and very easy to recover if you mess up.

The SE is faster in 1/4 than all of the second gen N/A's . The steering set up does suck, but it's not as bad as some of these people make it out to be. Once you get the slop out it will be a long time before it comes back.

I love the T2's but I'll take an SE over an N/A second gen anyday.
The second gen will give you more creature comforts. It's also more comfortable to ride in on longer trips. A lot more after market parts for it as well. Thats about the only pros that I can think of to owning an N/A 2nd gen over an SE.


Mike

 

FCs are HEAVY. On the other hand FCs are anywhere from one year to 12 years newer and I haven't seen a rusted out FC yet.

FCs are harder/more expensive to modify because they're fuel injected, but that's an opinion and it doesn't matter as much if you're comparing GSL-SE to FC. (Some people are afraid of carbs and prefer EFI. But hey the world's a crazy place )

FCs with 5-lug have big brakes. OTOH I had no problems hauling down in the braking zones with the 7.9" rotors and 7" (?) drums in my SA: the benefits of weighing only 2400lb with driver.

You don't have to spend $500 on an FC to eliminate the Watts linkage and upper trailing links so the rear suspension is more predictable, instead you spend $500 getting your toe links replaced and having the DTTS eliminator bushings replaced so the rear suspension is more predictable.

Finally, almost all FCs have power sunroofs. This is really bad if you're over about 5'8 and don't like having the seatback reclined so far you can look up through the hatch glass.

BTW I really will get my GXL running again... I need to get rid of it and a running car is worth about $2500 and a dead car is worth $25.

 

You know, I'm 6'1" and I have no problems fitting in my car. My knee sometimes bumps against the steering wheel (had to re-learn heel and toeing to deal with this) but i have an inch or two of headroom left and the steering wheel and pedals are at just the right place. Who knows.

 

I've owned a '90 GXL for a year and I've had my '84 GSL since '96.

My vote goes to the 1st gen. Yeah, its slower it rattles and the back end breaks loose a whole lot easier, but its more predictable overall has a nice powerband and it doesn't break down or have electrical "issues"

not to mention the removable sunroof which is almost as good as a convertible. Best of both worlds and much larger than the little sliding FC roof.

The other problem I have with the FC is the orange lights at night. RX-7 is supposed to light up RED.