Ever

Ok i just just got done what the rebuild and installation of everything today, but the car wont start.

This is what i have done so far,
I took out the plugs and made sure they fired, before this i primed the fuel system and then tried to start it. when i took out the plugs there was no gas on them or the smell of them, this may seem stupid but i am tring to start the car with no coolant and oil, ( but i use premix ) but is there something where the computer wont let the fuel injectors work unless there is oil pressure or something. All i want to do is get it started if it starts my intention was then to buy all the other crap i need ( coolant, oil, gear fluid, etc ) no use in wasting money if the damn car wont start,

Now I have messed with the timming also, but only my trial and error, i dont have a timming gun in my possesion atm, i will be getting mine back tomarrow, but also is there anything to help with the Crank Angel Sensor, a tool or something because all i am doing with that is trial and error also.

Thats it sorry its a mouthfull, if you have any input please reply.

Thanks in advance

Terrh

iTrader: (7)

err
DO NOT start ANYTHING with no oil
you will DESTROY your bearings and have to rebuild it again
really.
not even for a second.
put the oil in
coolant is diffrent, can probably run in 30 seconds or so with no coolant.

Ryde _Or_Die

Ya get some oil in there. If money is an issue you can get DAP brand for like $5. If you can't afford that they you need to sell the car cuz w/o gas it ain't going nowhere anyways

hypntyz7

premixing oil in the gas only lubricates about 5% of the engine, the apex seals only. IF you want all the main bearings and gears to receive any oil you had better fill that bad boy up. Youre damn lucky it didnt start...5 seconds with no oil and the motor would be toast...it would lock up.

I was once involved with a guy who rebuilt his own engine at my place. I helped him with his questions but did not oversee the project. Startup time came, and it ran for about 10 seconds then died and would not TURN at all. HE pulls it back apart. I stayed a bit closer to him during disassembly, and it turns out that the small key that goes ont eh oilpump drivechain sproket had fallen out during installation, meaning that after a few seconds of running, the oil pump stopped turning, and ran the engine dry. THe front main and rotor bearing looked like you ran a chainsaw across them.

Rpeck

OMFG! Don't even SPIN the motor without OIL!!! Jesus. Pre Mix just helps the rotor housings... nothing else .. I.E. E-hsaft, bearings, sides of rotors.. your KILLING ME!

Ever

Ok i put oil and a new oil filter on it.

Now the problem still remains the car wont start

Ever

Bump, please help

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

Is your entire intake system intact? AFM, intake hose, etc???

Ever

yes yes, everything is all together, the only thing i am not 100% sure of is the electrical, such as the fuel injector connectors and the pressure relief parts i could have put them on the wrong ones, does anyone have picture of a 86 fuel line system cus i could just match them up by the colors since the things are colored plastic... i am desperate lol

hypntyz7

Engine needs 3 things to run:

compression
spark
fuel

We'll assume you have compression. To be sure, dump in some oil or atf into the chambers. Fresh rebuilds always need somethign to help get started in my experience of 20+.

Check for spark...I take off the l1 wire, insert an old plug, and lay it on teh strut tower by the bolts that were under the rubber boot I just took off. Crank the car and you can watch it for a blue/white spark.

Check for fuel. Remove the front fuel line from the engine...this is fuel supply. Crank the car, and watch for what comes out. IF you have the fuel supply and return lines mixed up, dont expect it to run.

IF you check all these and have them all, it is a control system problem and well have to check othr things form there. Let us know what you find.

Ever

well i havent done exactly thoes things but i have reason to believe i have all 3 coved,

Well for Spark i have check the plugs, blue/white spark comes out i tested one from the trailing and one from the leading to be sure.

As for fuel when i took off the spark plugs, the tips of the plus had a little fuel on it plus it smelt like gas. which leads me to believe that i am getting fuel.

Now when you mean put atf into the chamber what exactly are you talking about, like try and get some in where the plugs go in, sorry i am not good with mechanic words and such.

Silkworm

Did you reinstall the CAS right? Go over everything.. Did you prime the fuel system?

PaulC

hypntyz7

IF I am going to help you with your problem step by step instead of a guess here and there, "reason to believe" will not do for me. You need to perform each test as I give instructions on it. After each test has been cleared I can give further instructions on more tests to perform until the problem is found. Just as I would do if the car were here in front of me. IF you guess at it, it will take you a week to get running.

As for atf in the chambers, or oil either one, yes I meant into the plug holes, the lower 2. Use either a funnel and long tube or a hand oil pump with long tube. Depending on what year aned model car youre working on, there are easier ways to inject it, but the plugholes works for any rotary. This oil/atf will coat the internals and instantly build compression...fresh rebuilds are often low compression adn flood easily. This explains the gas on your plugs.

Ever

ok I did everything you said, the most i got out of the car was one backfire, like it was almost gonna start but that was it, just kept on cranking after that...

Roy James

unflood again, and check timing

Ever

o yeah i also forgot that i also see a little bit of white smoke come out from on the left side of the engine, when facing the car,.... hope thats not totally bad

Ever

i am thinking its the timming, but i donno how to check the timming with out that car ideling

Roy James

did you set the CAS properly when you put it in? that may be your problem

Ever

you talking about lining the marks on the gear to the line on the cas yes i did that...

hypntyz7

To satisfy Roy James' curiosity, and complete another step in the process, please check the CAS installation:

take the cover off the top. Remove the CAS form the engine. Turn the engine by hand, clockwise, until you alogn the pin to the first mark ont eh pulley...should be red. IF you cant tell what color, it is the first of 2 youll encounter when turning the crank clockwise.

Find the gear on teh CAS, and note that there are 3 marks on the gear...2 are pin holes, and one is a position marker. Align this position marker with the line cast into the frame of the CAS that is stationary. Now, note the position of hte pickups up in top of the CAS. Mark if need be, and hold them while you reinstall it.

Due to the design of the gears, the CAS and shaft will want to turn clockwise while you install it, so turn it a bit CCW, maybe 1/2", before trying to slid it down in there. Youre trying to keep the shaft from spinning, while getting the shiny spot on the case(where the adjustment bolt was) to line up with the hole for the adjustmenet bolt/stud. The shaft may move about 1/8", this is acceptable once it is installed in order to realign the shiny spot to the adjustment stud.

BE sure to plug it back in, and try it again. The white smoke will be normal for about 15 minutes, considering there is atf/oil in the engine...it has to smoke/burn it out of the chambers and exhaust. When it starts, be ready to keep it going...it WILL want to die, and WILL NOT run on its own for several minutes. I always idle my cars way up before trying to start them, so I can get out after they run and check for leaks etc. without it dying.

IT is also a good idea to boost the car off while doing this..it takes a strong battery to turn a new engine over enough to fire it up, being as it is low compression and all.

IF youre wondering, I just started one today...I built it Sunday, installed it yesterday, started it today, and drove it about 30 miles so far...89 GTUs. These are the same procedures I follow.

hypntyz7

Assuming, then, that timing is ok, or close enough to start and run on) then check all your connections again. At this point there isnt much that will stop it from running.

The next step for me, is to remove the lower 2 plugs, and take them to a wire brush again. OR, try another pair, even a pair of trailings will do. Plugs get fouled really easily when subjected to gas and atf for a while.

TonyTurboII

Did you ever move the harness to the right place?

Ever

hypntyz7,

I did what you said with the CAS but you said the red one correct? Not that i am questioning your suggestions, just that the haynes book says that you line it up with the yellow one.... which one is right?..... I messed with the red one a bit today, but all i got was liek 1 or 2 backfires, at least thats what they sounded like...

I'll check my connections again also, and i'll clean my plugs.

thanks for all the help in my ongoing quest to get my beast started, ^_^

hypntyz7

Im sorry, I told you wrong, the leading mark is yellow, and trailing red. Use the yellow mark. You cant tell teh color on half of the old engines anyway...use the first one when rotating clockwise.

Roy James

Fuel is fine, spark is fine.... maybe its the cam timing! yeah yeah, change the timing chain! j/k , Man i dunno. Hypntyz7 has given you very good and clean instructions and if it passes all of that it should be firing. hhmm...