THreshER 7

Have a dilemma I need some assistance with.

Situation:
Took the car out for the first time in a year.
Front tires hitting the top of the fiberglass fenders when braking and turning.
But ok when driving.

Details:
8 pc Wide body kit on the car
255 40 17 tires.
Working-GXL sport shocks currently still on the car. - can tell the difference.

Possible resolutions?
I know squat about shocks/springs, and I don't want a lesson on them-unless necessary. I just want to know what would be the CHEAPEST - way -(at this time) - to raise the front from not rubbing the fenders.
Can I just get a set of air shocks or stiffer springs? Do they make a spring that actually raises the vehicle?
Don't need opinions, just Need help!
The sun is out, and I wanna get it on the road!!!

Pic to show rub area: sides are fine. just the very top.

[IMG][/IMG]

Obviously, still a work in progress.

Thanks,

Troy Fitz.

farberio

iTrader: (7)

Your springs may be sagging, so buying new stock springs would probably raise it. They are $100 each at Mazdatrix though.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

Are the struts in good shape? I know when my struts were blown, the thing would nose dive like Top Gun when Id lay on the brakes.

well uhhh

^ +1 I would check the condition of the struts. My Honduh had a blown drivers front shock and under braking/hard cornering **** rubbed like crazy and made it very hard to control. It looked lowered on one wheel...

Roen

iTrader: (2)

If you spend some money on coilovers, you may be able to use them to raise your car.

THreshER 7

A year ago, I had the stock fenders w/ the same shocks and struts and actually a taller tire at the time w/ no problem at all. I am not able to see any noticeable leakage. So I am assuming that they are ok.
I just measured the actual fender width in comparison to the stock fender, and it may be about 3/8" wider from the top point of where the tire is rubbing.
Does anybody know if a set of KYB coilovers or simular would be able to actually raise the front as opposed to lowering it?
Anyone that has experience in this area, your comments would be greatly welcomed.

Farberio - thanks for the info. I had thought about just replacing w/ stock due to the time on the springs as well. But was not sure where to get "NEW" springs.
Will consider that if can't get other alternatives.

Came across something called MK1 coilover springs - they use the stock or replacement struts, and are basically a heavy duty spring w/ an adjustable base.
They are 169.00 for all 4 of them. Looks like the perfect solution.
Anybody tried these out?
If they can also raise a vehicle, I think this would be perfect. And I would be able to set just the right height all the way around the car.
I sent an email to the seller asking him if they can raise a car as well.
If not:

Any other suggestions are welcome!

Thanks.

Troy Fitz.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

Quality's not the best, but they could work.

Black91n/a

If that's the sort of thing you're considering, then go with Ground Control, they'll actually be able to tell you what the spring rates and lenghts are, they'll be able to give you good advice and will give you whatever rate and length you want (well as long as it's available in an Eibach spring, but there's tons of selection). I don't think they've ever published the rates or lengths that come with those and the lengths may be too short to raise the car. You will need some adjustable shocks with coilovers though, or it'll be way underdamped, bouncy and will handle like poo. KYB AGX's are a good budget buy, but Koni Yellows are better.

Maybe there's a lip on the fenders that you can trim off?

THreshER 7

Thanks for the info on the coilovers.
The lip trim option is definitely the simple least expensive solution. And I don't have a problem w/ making changes to the body as needed.
Just dremiling the lip, and reglassing a new inner lip may be the way to go. I like the ride height were it is, and I really think the rubbing is coming from the longer fender width.
If it was extreme, I should have broken the inner lip to smithereens on my first hard turn or brake.
I think I have my solution:
I want to keep my ride height were it is, so,
trim the fender as needed, and purchase the MK1 coilovers.
That will stiffen up the suspension and reduce the chance of any bounce.

But I spotted an alternative, a set of KYB shocks and springs are online for 145.00.
Being I know nothing about shocks, they have a little dial indicator on them. 1,2,3,street- or something like that. Would those work to raise or stiffen the suspension. Sorry bout the noob question, but I basically am when it comes to this area.

Thanks.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

The adjusters (if they even work) serve to adjust the stiffness of the damper, but they don't change ride height.

Derek King

iTrader: (2)

just get a little more negative camber. camber bolts

hurleysurf24

iTrader: (3)

spring spacers ?

THreshER 7

Would camber plates change the tire angle enough to prevent rubbing?
This is basically straight line street brawler that doesn't require crazy cornering abilities.
I found camber plates for 169.00 online, but not really sure this would be a benefit.
since this isn't a drift car.
Thanks for the great option though.

Not to sure about the "not going to change the ride height" info:
This is the description:
- 86-91 RX7

- AVERAGE DROP 1.5"-2"
- HIGH QUALITY BILLET SLEEVES, CENETRING TOP HATS AND DUAL LOCKING PERCHES
- HEAVY DUTY HIGH QUALITY SPRINGS ARE GUARANTEE NOT TO SAG
- BETTER HANDLING WITH STIFF SUSPENSION
- GREAT FOR DRIFTING
- WORKS GREAT WITH STOCK STRUTS OR AFTER MARKET STRUTS

Just don't know if they can raise the car or not.

Before and after pic's:

THreshER 7

Actually, I already went out and purchased some spacers. But I got the twist in kind as a quick fix. Didn't do my homework. The spring gap is huge in front. I know they have the adjustable spring shackles to raise and lower, but the package said for rear shocks.
I was going to get a set of those as a test to see how high if needed I really need to go to clear the fender before doing any fender trimming.
And with the very small number of coils on the front shock, not sure they would work.

But going to purchase them anyhow to try it to see if i can just get a gauge on it.

Thanks.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

What caused my lowrider

Black91n/a

What he's saying is that the shocks don't change the ride height, the springs do. Stiffer springs on OE shocks is dumb, they're old and weak by now and they'll make for bad handling. Next to tires, shocks are the most important part of your suspension.

Those coilovers probably can't even raise the car to the current ride height.

Blown shocks won't cause sag, sagging springs cause sag.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

My ride height was stock with blown struts, but itd dip and dive if I touched the breaks or hit a bump.
Not saying its the only possibilty, just what caused my problems.
I never had rubbing though, but I am running a 50 profile on a 15" rim.

THreshER 7

Ok, so I am slow at this, but suddenly starting to get a grip on it.
A shock has a certain amount of possible travel in both directions.
The spring based upon it's rate, just maintains the height regardless of the shock working or not working. It just dampens the bumps.
So, with my car, having only 83,000 original miles on it, kinda tells me the shocks are probably still pretty good.
In regard to the coilovers I am looking at, if they could reach and maintain a higher stance than the car has now with sagging springs, which means it probably doesn't need to be at stock height, wouldn't that still help the car be more stable?

I guess i don't understand how an OE shock -if in good shape - on a stiffer spring - would be dumb - or not handle very well.
What would be the overall handling result??

Thanks for the lesson. I guess I needed to know more about suspension than I
wanted to know after all.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

Have you verified that the struts are still good?
A primative way to test them is to push down on a corner and see how it recoils. If it bounces more than a couple times, It might be time to get new struts.
Mileage doesnt have a lot to do with their condition.
Things such as hitting a curb or driving on a lot of rough terrain can damage them.
If they are blown, they are likely leaking fluid, but this is not a given.
Imo, I noticed my rear struts being blown a lot more than my fronts. It actually wasnt until I took them off that I realized just how bad they were.

THreshER 7

Nope, haven't done that yet. Didn't notice any bounce in them all. But could be due to hitting the tires.
Might need to check that out next.
Awesome Avatar by the way.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

Yeah, Id definately check that. Not hard to do, just push down on the car and see how bad it bobs. It should just pop back to normal relatively quick and not go up and down.
As for the avitar, thats what you get with a bad TPS, no cats and a non-turbo

Black91n/a

A stronger spring needs a stronger damper or it'll be bouncy, and that's bad for handling. Your shocks are old, even though they don't have that much milage on them, it's best to replace them, and if you're going to get coilovers you'll need to replace them or the car will handle and ride poorly. To properly explain it all would take pages.

Those eBay coilovers probably have springs that are too short to take the car even up to its current height. The adjuster can only adjust so much, the springs still need to be of a reasonable height.

If the spring rates aren't well matched to the car then it can cause it to have lots of understeer or oversteer, both of which will make you slower. That's bad. Their entire R&D was probably just getting some junked shocks and seeing if the coilovers will bolt on. Ground Control has a long history of working with racers and street users and will actually be able to sell you something that works well. Their springs will also be of much higher quality, being more consistent in rate and length.

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

The proper way to deal with large wheels is to roll the fenders to provide more space. Or as said, old sagging springs might be causing your problem too. In that case new springs could help. As mentioned, if you get stiffer springs you must also replace the shocks or you'll get a bouncy ride.

Sideways7

iTrader: (7)

FWIW Ground Control coil-overs have about a 1.5 inch drop, but there is zero dive on braking. I don't even have a rear sway bar and there still isn't any noticeable body roll.

Black91n/a

You can get longer springs with GC's though, so you could go higher than stock if you wanted to.