petadeer

hey guys so i'm new here. I'm looking for an FC to use as a 'beater' while i work on my mr2 as its going to be jacked up and ill need a car to commute in.

i'm looking for one now and there are SO many different versions. i see like "s5" this "gtu" that or "vert" or "turbo II"or "se". you guys get my point? there are so many different versions its confusing!

can someone jsut clarify it for me? i suppose a list of it from like cheapest base model to baddest turbo model would be good.

also, i have no experience with rotaries but haven't really heard good things about them. how often do these engines blow? is it a bad idea to buy a car at 200k miles? will probably explode in my face after 100 miles?

i have a friend who is friends with a guy who has a brother... and that guy's fc apparently is 'slow as hell', gets 14 mpg or less, had many over heating problems, and didnt have enough electric power to power the headlights, and stereo head unit all at the same time.

don't worry, by 'beater' i dont mean im going to completely trash one of the rare rx7s, i am just going to use it as a daily driver.

Evil Aviator

At the top of the 2nd Generation Specific forum list there are some threads marked "Sticky". Read the one about Specifications and the one about FAQ.

The engine normally lasts about 120K to 150K miles, and costs about $1,000 to rebuild yourself, about $2,200 for a basic rebuild by a cheap auto shop, and up to $6,500 parts and labor for an engine that needs a complete rebuild.

FYI any 20-year old sports car with 200K miles and the original engine will blow up in your face after 100 miles.

Regardless of which car you buy, don't let that guy touch it, lol.

francogt1

iTrader: (2)

It says there you looking for a fc to make a
"beater" i dont thinkso if anything your mr2 will become your beater and the fc a never ending project.

petadeer

nah, i doubt an fc would become my project car. c'mon now, i think an inducted mid engine sports car from toyota that rides like a go kart would be much more fun to autocross with!

my mr2 is at 193k miles, still running strong, although it was rebuilt 169k. i do know a lot of other ones that reached 220-230k or beyond before needing a rebuild though

Gremlin

Well since you have a friend who is friends with a guy who has a brother...that sounds like very reliable info. Like Evil Aviatory said...check out the Stickied Threads up at the top of the FC section.
My personal opinion, you are already coming in with a somewhat negative idea of the rotary. Probably won't be the best 'beater' for you. Stick with another Toyota or a Honda. Definitely a better choice for a 'beater' while you build up the MR2. Will have less problems.

petadeer

good point, but that's why i'm not solely relying on that information.
but it just seems that in the car world (or as i know it) there is a slight discrimination against rotary, and i just wanna know if they really do break down a lot and easily or if they are just properly maintained, they will last a long time.

I would get a honda as a beater or an altima but i want something that is RWD. when i say 'beater', i don't mean a car that i'm just gonna treat like **** because im just commuting in it. i mean, i'll do the basic maintenance like change the air filter, oil in a timely manner, tranny fluid, brake fluid, rotors, brakes, timing belt, or whatever else that wouldn't require me to just pull the engine apart. and also, the beater wouldn't get to park in the garage. =) but i plan to treat the car right.

also, what are apex seals? i heard those have to be replaced a lot or something...

Super82

iTrader: (1)

Rotaries have better longevitity if they are setup right. Alot of the bad rep for rotaries comes from the FD, which from the factory was just begging to blow up.

Apex seals are the seals that are on the outside of the rotors. They hold the compression in the engine. Similar to rings on a piston engine. When you have to replace those that is equivilent to rebuilding the motor. A good NA can make it to 200K easily, other wise I think the TIIs are more around 150 and the REWs around 80K before they commonly pop. Of course there are exceptions to this.

duo2999

iTrader: (1)

he probably cant..errr..well doesnt know how to care for it properly.

RotaryRocket88

iTrader: (7)

The information you have is absolute ****. A properly maintained rotary will last 150k-200k+ easily. Apex seals are what give the engine compression, if they needed to be replaced "a lot", Mazda would have never been able to market the engine in the first place. They will last up until the point where you do something stupid like lean out the motor and detonate. On an NA, this is unlikely, but people frequently screw up turbo engines by getting boost happy.

Magpie57

My sugestion would be to have him get a beater MR2 while he is tricking out a nice RX7. Is there an MR2club.com site we can go on and let them know that I know the sister of her brothers cousins friend that has a beater MR2 that I am thinking about maybe buying for a daily driver that I can discard when my RX7 is puffed out. Think those guys would react adversly. OK guy get your tricked out
MR2 and match it up with one of these tricked out RX7s and see how it fairs. Enough said. Mag

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

Blame the twin turbos for that, they ruin more than just the engine with they're MASSIVE heat soak, they should ALWAYS be scrapped for single turbos and heat wrap.

Heat is the enemy of the rotary engine. So is poor apex seal lubrication, solve both and you have a potent little monster!

Merovign

Also, timing belt? Dude, read the stickies.

Go read the FAQs. The information is all here, you don't even have to work hard for it. I mean, you managed to post a message, a couple more clicks and you wouldn't have had to. If you're planning on buying a car, I would think a few hours' reading would be a trivial investment.

andresj

iTrader: (8)

yeah i don't know what to tell you dude.. you come in asking for help but you talk about your friends rotary sucking dick.. yet you want one. seems like he cant maintain a car. any car can be reliable as long as it gets its proper treatment. as for what model is better and all you can find it in the FAQ and please.. don't make your seven a beater.. and thats an insult to the rest of us..

petadeer

the things with forums is that everyone always tells someone else to go read a sticky or some other such thing... i'm trying to get some insight on the subject from those who have experienced these cars first hand. I want it in addition to reading some manual.

merovign - and yes, timing belt. I'm aware that the rx7 might not even have such a device ( i really know nothing about rotaries ) but i did a quick google and apparently sites sell timing belts for rx7s... or timing chains, w/e.

loook, it's a lot easier to just flame me. is it that hard to give me your own opinion on rotaries? obviously everyone here would like them but maybe even an owner would have to admittedly accept that there can be problems.

if my information is 'absolutely ****' like rotaryrocket88 says then how hard is it to clarify? it only took super82 a handful of sentences to give me his own opinion...

and duo2999, yeah, he probably can't.

look, obviously if i'm an idiot trying to raise the boost to 20 psi with a completely stock motor with just a bigger turbo i'm going to blow my **** up. What I'm trying to find out is if these motors can last if they are treated right with just basic maintenance like the kind i have listed. I'm not a tuner or a mechanic but i know how to not beat the **** out of my cars.

and do you guys even read my post before telling me that i should beat an mr2 out of an rx7? everyone is entitled to a preference and i just happen to like a toyota. maybe i used the incorrect lingo but by beater, i just mean a car that i'm going to daily drive in, NOT park inside the garage, and not try to perform some turbo swap or ls1 swap in. I just want a motor that if left untweaked will last me a decent amount of time.

edit: let me change my stance/pitch: right now i have a lot of things to work on my mr2 so i need another car to use as my daily driver as my mr2 will be jacked up in my garage for at least a couple of months. I am looking for something that is RWD and that is a decent car even while relatively stock. mr2s happen to be pretty quick and handle like champs even when stock and get great mpg so i suppose i am looking for a similar package but perhaps with more trunk space/seats.

I don't want a 240. They can be pretty neat when properly modded but i'm not looking to spend that kind of money. I've always thought rx7s look freakin' awesome so that's why i'm pretty interested in them. At most i would only want to spend money for coilovers + bushings + whatever suspension components that need to be replaced + basic maintenance (not a rebuild) as i'm not looking to replace any motors or trannys.

I am not getting one because of initial D. I am not getting one expecting that i'd be able to beat it to death and have it run like a champ. i've said this many times and basically, i can deal with small problems but i dont have the money to technical savviness to dump money on and facilitate a rebuild

I'm also looking at a starlet but those are 30 years old so I don't know...

Please don't tell me to get a honda. I don't want problems with understeering. I'm sure everyone knows how the honda world can be and for the most part I don't want to deal with the GENERAL kind of people that own them.

thanks for the knowledgeable and positive replies.

l3eltinck

iTrader: (2)

1.)for the questions you're asking, the FAQ and Stickied threads are what will benefit you the most. Those arent just opinions, they are facts that have been tried and tested from the best of owners/manufacturers/tuners...need i say more?

2.)No comment.

3.)stock n/a's handle fairly well, but mpg is not good for a daily driver 17-19mpg city or less, 22-24 highway or less--not horrible, but can easily find a ~25-30% increase in fuel economy in other cars similarly priced. more trunk space and seats...Have you ever been in an rx7? I dont think anyone can sit comfortably in the back seats (if you have them)...and trunk space, lol? if you're so against hondas, and you're scared of a rotary, have you looked at supras, etc..? dont be narrow minded.

4.) coilovers/suspension is easily over $2000. basic maintenance is probably more costly on an rx7 than most piston engines, considering it does consume slight amounts of oil. Also since you have no prior knowledge to the car you will probably be seeking help to do some things. (hopefully not by your friends dogs uncle or whatever) and you wont know what to be looking out for when purchasing it initially, you never know when the owner isnt telling you the whole story.

5.) not having money yet thinking of coilovers? make up your mind.

6.) you dont want understeer, but willing to accept that a stock sw20 (extremely oversteer happy) has great steering? besides i thought this was going to be a daily...when i think of a daily i picture it to be a car you actually drive the speed limit in and not be trying dumb **** in considering you do want it to remain reliable before you have TWO broke *** whips, right?...sounds like you would fit right in with the honda owner category to me.

Conclusion: do some damn research like any intelligent person before buying any vehicle (yes that includes reading the FAQ and stickies.)


p.s. stop being lazy.

walken

iTrader: (6)

sounds like a typical FC.

i would suggest to go find a 86-88 that has near or less than 150 on the clock. test drive it and make sure it doesn't idle over 800rpm and you can take it to 7K without a stutter. Take it for at least a 20 min test drive after you've let it warm up while you poke your head around the engine bay. If the temp guage never goes over 1/4 and you don't hear bubbling or see excessive exhaust smoke go ahead and snag it. do a full proper tune up and you'll have a great daily driver that once you get used to you'll forget about the MR2.

Gremlin

I am in no way trying to flame but

i'm trying to get some insight on the subject from those who have experienced these cars first hand.

That is what the FAQ and Stickies are. Take some to and read thru those. Plenty of info. I still even read those. If I was looking to buy another 7 I would not look at one with 200k miles unless I was ready to send it off for a rebuild. Take some time and read thru the FAQ and Stickies. My 7 just got rebuilt and it is my daily. Just maintain it like any other vehicle and you will love it.

AGreen

iTrader: (11)

Sounds to me like you need a cavalier.

sodara

iTrader: (1)

rx7's make great beaters and rotaries enjoy being redlined. Just gotta keep up with regular maintenance like any other car. I redline mine at least once a day.
The rotary is notorious for failure but then again it is not it's fault but the owner. Like everyone else is saying, they can last up to 200k miles.

I live in MN and I've been daily driving my aw11 cuz it's awesome on snow/ice. Once the snow melts I'm daily driving the FC again just because it's a bit more fun in my opinion at least.

Merovign

petadeer: Everyone's telling you where you can find that first-hand info you're asking for.

Not our fault if you refuse to go there. It's right there. Waiting.

If you came here for affirmation instead of information, just say so.

petadeer

walken - thanks for the advice/suggestions. it's condensed with information from many different areas that i would've probably had to spend quite a while reading stickies just to put that all together.

right now i'm looking at an 87 turbo for 3100. it has about 150k on the chassis but the owner claims it was rebuilt at 148k. there's an erratic idle though that the owner says is due to a bad Throttle position sensor.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/999325443.html . <- there is the ad, please provide any feed back. any opinions or suggestions would be greatly appreciated

Gremlin - thanks, I've taken everyone's advice and i've looked at the stickies. I'm on my crappy laptop mon-friday so it's kind of hard to do hardcore reading/navigation with it but i found some answers to questions such as how long the engine usually lasts and how much hp there is on each model.

still, like sodara says, the rotary is notorious for failure so i just wanted to alleviate any qualms. so yes, Merovign, i think 'affirmation' is what i was really looking for after all and to know that as a performance car it can be a great and reliable daily too

l3eltinck, I'm assuming a typical rebuild for a rotary would cost as much if not more than for a piston engine so that would land it around 2k+. coilovers are half of that and I'm sure many people would rather spend 1k to immensely improve handling as opposed to 2-3k fixing a motor with either a short life span or one that just wasn't taken care of.

as for telling me i should be in there with honda owners, thats just messed up, bro. yes, i would prefer oversteer to understeer any day because in my opinion even when you over steer, there are things you can do unlike with under steer where you just brake and hope that your tires grip again... so yeah, in that sense i feel i'd have more control. and i drive an aw11, not sw20. yes, the snap oversteer issue requires more foresight and better judgment but it's not a disadvantage if you don't drive stupid-ly, in my opinion.

and yes, i have begun reading the stickies and shall continue now...

petadeer

i don't know how to edit my post but darn, the craigslist ad expired. it was a 150k 87 turbo that was rebuilt at 148k. I'm thinking if it was rebuilt legit or not, 150k miles isn't too bad. had an exhaust leak and erratic idle due to tps but it was for $3100. doesn't seem bad to me at least

RichmondFC

iTrader: (1)

86 N/A 230k no rebuilds... still runs fine.... If you don't drive your car like an ******* and maintain it any car can run for a long time. I drive the hell out of my tII however, I'll be happy if I get 100k out of it lol

Hello Roto

I picked up an 86 N/A GXL with 120k miles on it for $700 bucks.. drove it daily for over a year.. through winter spring summer and fall.. still had good compression and NO problems. I did regular maintenance on the vehicle (i.e. oil, air filter, 02 sensor...) but NO serious power mods..it still ran good when i sold it at 158k. Then i come to find out that not even a week after i sold it this 16yr old kid, he tried to go racing and drifting in it.. and apparently it went POP! So it just depends on how you treat the car..

na5

rx7s have as many problems as any other sports car rotaries will be reliable if properly maintained

get one and you will have the same love or love/hate as the rest of us for our cars
and eventually want to hang up your mr2 cuz an rx7 will leave a bigger smile on your face