Jimmy325i

I'm about 3 days from assembling my rebuild and am wondering what all can be tossed when putting it back together.

So far I have no:
egr
mechanical fan
TB coolant lines
ACV
feed line from exhaust
sub zero assist


So, of the vacuum solenoids which of those can be removed?

I'd like to make it as clean and simple as possible and I'm not going pre-mix because my omp works fine. So I know I need to keep that spider intact.

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Yeay, your in luck, i got bored earlier today no less and busted out a highlighter and figured out everying i can elminiated of a S5 T2

Relief Silencer, Air Chamber, ACV, Air pump, AWS, ASV, All the solonoides, Cold start assist, EGR and and cat feed pipe, if you want i hear ya can rip out the charcole canister and cap the lines not sure though

If im right, this will elminated 11 vac lines, thats alot less to confuse ya huh? Im gona scan this pic tommorwo during my photoshop class and ill try to post it,

Im not sure of the differences on other motors, but shouldnt be to differnt, i say again this is for Series 5 T2
-Jacob

Project84

Jimmy325i, what type of engine do you have? I have a S4 and I was wondering the same thing as you; what are the bare basics needed for the engine to run besides fuel and spark?

Blitz0309

Less vacuum lines means a lot less problems. Usually. I want a copy of your "work".

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Mine?
My list is just a compilation of everying ive hurd in this forum, ill post the pic tommorow when i can scan it

-Jacob

FC Drifter

yes please do crackhead ,heh always wanted to legitamately call someone that, anyways im very interested in seeing how everything vaccum related is removed from the engine. i want to do it to my 87 T2.

Liquid Anarchy

iTrader: (2)

Woohoo! I get to share knowlage I recently learned.

If you ditched the ACV, then you can't control the 5/6th ports or VDI anymore. So.... no emissions? No problem!!!

You'll have 3 vacuum lines.

1 for the Fuel Pressure Regulator.
1 for the Intake Pressure Sensor
& the lines for the oil injector.

Cap the rest off.... you don't need em'

FC Drifter

what about for T2s? anyone know of a write-up on how to do it?

Jimmy325i

Yeah, sorry about not mentioning my car.

its an 86 sport N/A with factory aluminum hood.

I was just mentioning all the crap on the actual motor thats gone. My a/c is already history all the plumbing for the ACV was included with that crap. No fan shroud or air filter box. (went to 3" cone filter right off the mas)

I'm running a custom bleeded ball valve off the air pump right now for six port actuation. (have been since I installed the RB header and 2.5" open pipes) I've yet to design an RPM actuated switch for an electric air pump so I still use the smog pump for something productive.

So the only three vac lines I need are the omp, fuel pressure and intake pressure sensor?

Do n/a's have intake pressure sensors?

All the wiring for the solenoids can go too? Isn't this gonna hose the computer? I can't afford the carbs and intake yet so even though this'll be a healthy motor I know its not gonna be fed right just yet.

I'm frankensteining my S4 with a turbo intermediate housing and healthy porting. Should wind out nicely when I can properly feed her. Side drafts and MSD are in the future, but I'd like to rip most of the crap off the keg now before putting it back in. The loom is pretty ratty so I figured I could pull wires out of it and re-do the shielding now that its snaked on the floor.

Liquid Anarchy

iTrader: (2)

Righty... pressure sensor is on the passenger shock tower.

For 5/6th port activation W/O an RPM switch, search for a post by me about Electronic 5/6th & VDI... it should do what you want it to :P, I'm a genius

Liquid Anarchy

iTrader: (2)

oh yeah, only need solinoids if you choose my method mentioned

Jimmy325i

Ah, so thats what the little black thingy is

My electronic 6 port actuation has already been designed, I just haven't gotten around to building it yet. I'll look into what you did. Might be similar to what I've thought of. I'm just too cheap to spend 40 bucks on an rpm switch that I can make for 5.

Jimmy325i

Not gonna use a VDI intake, as I intend on going carbs and mega nitrous in the future.

As for the cadillac air pump and all that junk... I'm thinking a little low volume air pump is all thats needed, and I'll have dip switches rigged so I can chose the points at which my ports open depending on the driving conditions.

What does the computer think when all that wiring is removed? Solenoid bank being gone sounds great to me, but I'm worried about the consequences.

Liquid Anarchy

iTrader: (2)

or just skip the RPM switch all together, and use the stock signal given by the ECU...

Jimmy325i

Signal given by the ecu? I wasn't aware that the N326 ecu could give selectable rpm signals. I'll stick with my design. Building an rpm switch will take about 10 mins and 5 dollars in IC's.

Liquid,

I seriously question everything you've said because of your ignorance on the BAC valve. That you didn't know it was part of the engine management forces me to put little faith in your advice.

wpgrexx

for an s4, you can have the omp working and still remove all the spider hard lines and the solenoids, if you remove

the egr
acv
bacv
cold start
and do tb mod
assuming you have no air pump and no cats

redo the fuel lines(primary to fuel filter, secondary to return line)
the only vauum lines left are
1. omp
2. boost sensor
3. fuel pressure regulator

dump everything else

Jimmy325i

I'm keeping my BAC valve.... its part of the engine management.

The spider I was talking about for the oil injection is the little plastic one, not the metal hard one that gets bolted to the block.

I have a cat, but its furry. Ok, bad joke.

I actually do have a dsm eclipse cat welded over my 2.5" straight pipe with its heat shield attached for looks. I don't feel like getting nailed with a $10K fine for lacking emissions so I put it on there for the barney fife test should I ever get one. It looks legal anyways.

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Why keep the BAC? No P/S or AC? i see no reason to have a BAC, they are the only things that can increase a load on ur engine right? therefor u probly dont need it

Jimmy325i

The BAC meters air that is used for idle. Think of it as the idle control air circuit. I tend to do a lot of short runs with my car (under 10 mins driving) and don't like the idea of having the car stall out because I removed the component that regulates the idle mixture as the engine warms up.

You are correct that I have nothing runing off the engine other than the alternator and smog pump at the moment. (smog pump will get flight lessons when I build the new 6 port actuation system)

Everyone who has cold idle problems on this forum either has removed the BAC or has one that isn't working properly. I'll leave something thats working alone... thats just my preference.

Project84

Jimmy, could you post pics of your engine? I want the engine I'm building to be like what you described.

Jimmy325i

Do you want the inside of the engine or the outside?

Oh, and I found VITON oil o rings for 2.21 a piece through a hydrolics shop. I did buy my 2mm apex seals from atkins though....

I don't have a digital camera and will most likely be assembling my motor alone so pics might be kinda tough. I'll see what I can do about getting pics of the outside when its done though.

I just wish I had an extra grand lying around so I could throw all this crap out and go carb'd now. Maybe by spring I'll have the cash. Too many other mods needed at the moment though. Might have to wait till next winter for that one.

Liquid Anarchy

iTrader: (2)

Little faith in my advice? Eh' whatever padna'.

By the by, I did forget that you have a S4, so my E5/6th setup won't work for you. Even still, nice way to go about it. Have fun building your engine. Don't bother asking me ****; but then again, why would you? I give bad advice?

BTW, the BAC only messes with the idle when there's an increased load put on the engine. The people you know who have taken it off, need to try messing with their cars a little more. The 5 or 6 people that have done it that I know, after setting their idle, have had zero problems.... shows my ignorance huh? L8er

Jimmy325i

Wrong Liquid, The BAC acts as the choke for the computer. If you live in a climate that doesn't vary much then you can compensate for this initially and get a resonably well runing car. If you live where I do, you'll hate yourself for removing it because it will take more adjustments than a holley to keep running right.

Then again, I've only been working on FI cars for the last 9 years so what do I know?

I suggest that you post a link to whatever source you have which states your claims about the BAC valve, and I will reverse my position at such a time as I am disproven. I'm not here to pick fights or **** people off... I just think you're not the person I want to listen to if you seem to think that removing vital engine drivability components is the way to go. I have a friend with a 1G eclipse who removed his MAF and his car still ran. Doesn't mean it ran well....

Project84

The outside. I have an S4 that I took apart, and I want to put a carb on it when I get it back together. I kinda would like to see what the finished product should look like since you are discribing a setup similar to what I want.

Also, I own a '84 GS, but I plan on getting a FC when this 13B gets ready to be put in a car. I usually hang out in the 1st Gen forum and don't know as much about 13B's and FC cars. I noticed that people here in the 2nd Gen forum are alot more synical toward each other, like you and this liquid anarchy guy. I heard that the 2nd Gen guys were quick to go at each others throats, and I've seen it in another thread earlier this week. Is it always like this? Its almost scary asking questions around here cause I think I'm going to get flamed off the forum.

Jimmy325i

Nah, Its all in a quest for truth on my part... I've seen all kinds of shady mods and the BAC removal from my perspective is asking for a kick in the nuts from a drivability stand point. If I wanted to dink around with my idle every couple days I'd get a carb. (oh yeah I want carbs) but since I have FI, I'd like to keep it running like FI. (hop in, turn key and drive)

I'll try and get some pics of my motor when its back in for you.

BTW: Liquid is only 19... I remember 1983. Iran Contra ring any bells? He was just popping out of his mom.