brakar

Ok so I got the motor appart and in the front housing there is, well its hard to explain, kinda a scoring on the housing. It goes from the bottom to the exhaust side, 1/4 of the housing. I want to know if it is garbage because of this.

None of the apex seal are broken or cracked or anything, infact they measure in just a smidge under 8mm. I don't belive they are the originals because there was only one spring and they don't look like the ones in the fsm. I just got this car a week ago and don't know anything about the cars history.

Anyways heres the pics, the scoring is right on the edge of the housing. Tell me what you think.

Sorry couldn't get them to attach, don't know if this will work or not.

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=2135311573

brakar

Sorry don't use that link. Here are the pics.

TwEaK

iTrader: (6)

if you can run your nail across it around the whole housing and feeling and groove or bump no it cannot be reused.
TwEaK

brakar

ttt

Can anyone tell if those apex seals are the originals or were replaced?

ddub

Those are 2 piece apex seals, originals were 3 piece.

coldfire

iTrader: (1)

i think all the FSM says about scoring is that there should be nothing noticeable. for sure if you can physically feel it with your hand that is most definetly too much. if not then there has to be some other evaluation criteria involved.
what i do know is that you also what to check the WIDTH of the rotor housing in different places, and for this there IS a max spec that is stated in the FSM.

edit: although i don't know if Mazda used the 3-piece only in the FC, i DO know that they make 2-piece seals, and i don't know specifically what aftermarket company(s) makes 2-piece seals...

RETed

Holy crap, those housings look new!
Why was the engine torn apart?
Those apex seals are most likely Hurley's or old RA's.


-Ted

brakar

Engine was torn apart because I bought the car a week ago for $500 cnd. Guy told me it had low compression. Yes the housings look brand new but both have a noticable mark on them in that place. That one is the worse of the two. It sucks.

Edit. I put arrows on the pic now. You can see the mark im talking about with the little ridges. It goes all the way up past the exahust port.

ddub

Run a razor blade over it and see if it catches at all. Then feel with ur fingers for a bump, if you dont have a problem with either of these tests it should be fine I'd think?

RETed

Okay, those grooves are normal.
They are made by the triangle assist piece on the apex seal.
I wouldn't worry about them, unless they are really deep?
How wide is the groove?
1mm to 2mm is normal.

You find out the reason why the engine had low compression?

Are the apex seals intact or did one (or more) fail?

Are you going to reuse the apex seals?
If not, can you smash one with a hammer?
If it shatters, it's probably a Hurley unit.
If it doesn't, it's most likely an RA unit.
Either or I would not recommend to reuse.


-Ted

drago86

i agree completly normal my motor whihc only had 60k on it had them.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

it will affect compression slightly but those grooves in the last pic were from a different set of apex seals, those seals you are using did not cause them but those grooves are fairly normal so long as they are not excessively wide.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

Those grooves on the back edge of a rotorhousing are normal as a result of apex seal wear from the stock 3pc seal's corner piece, it comes to a near point and wears off teh edge of the housing. This is reuseable,however the more grooving, the weaker of an engine it'll build. That looks perfectly fine to me.

Those look like hurley seals to me. Replace them with mazda or atkins seals.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

atkins 2 piece seals can also cause that grooving, nothing major though just a characterisitic of the engine.

coldfire

iTrader: (1)

Mazda also did make 2-piece seals, so why could they not be them?

also Ted, what is your basis for testing if it is a Hurley or RA piece? why does the Hurley one smash and the RA one not?

just curious. please do not flame if these are simple matters...

RETed

Mazda's triangle assist piece is a "triangle".
I know of Hurley and RA that uses that elongated short piece as shown in the pic.
Someone mentioned Atkins, but I've never seen an Atkins apex seal myself.

That's how they are constructed.
Hurleys are known to disintegrate when they fail, so they will be rather "brittle".
RA's are harder steel, and they should not shatter when hit, but the early RA apex seals are known to warp.
RA has acknowledges early manufacturer problems, and the new apex seals are redesigned.


-Ted

eriksseven

iTrader: (6)

Hey I have a related question, are the reasons for low compression always due to either a bad apex seal or bad housings? Like, are these the only two factors in whether or not a motor will have low compression? I have a TII motor with 140k miles on it, that had low compression (95ish and 85ish). When I deconstructed it all of the seals were intact... Does this ONLY mean that my housings were to blame for the low compression? Or could there be a bad, intact apex seal that was to blame for the low compression #'s?

Thank YOU

brakar

Thanks alot. Thats great news. I have a feeling I took this apart for no reason. Altough as i was the water pump was done shaft was like l/l the / being the saft. The plugs were also completely fouled. But I leared what everything is, and im getting it street ported while its apart.

All the apex seals look new. Here is a question thou. Do all the aftermarket seals still measure in at 8mm for the hight. Cuz there are like 7.95mm.

brakar

up up

hondahater

iTrader: (2)

side seals sticking or worn will cause low compression as well as corner seals sticking or worn however usually side and corner seals don't wear out so usually it's crud that gets stuck in the side seal grooves and makes the springs no longer springy but stick downward causing the side seal to lose compression thus making the engine lose compression.


I'm sorry I'm slightly retarded I forgot I was searching for hurley seals so I replied to this old *** thread.

TitosToy

wow..i didnt even noticed on how old this thread is. but since we're in the subject, i too have a housing with a groove. i dont hav a cam but it's about 1 1/4" long and it runs down jus above the exhaust port. i can stick my fingernail through the groove so i guess it means it's kaput huh?

RETed

Above the exhaust port?
**** it, just use it.
If it has sharp edges, just "sand" it down a little...


-Ted