another starts then dies thread
12-04-10, 07:44 PM
#1
another starts then dies thread
First off I've searched, and read, and repeated. The car is an 88GXL N/A with about 5k on the rebuild. I just finished a trans swap, but I cannot get the car to stay running. It will crank, fire, hit maybe 2k RPMs, then die. I've tried starting it in neutral and in gear, each time I get the same result. What I've read/tried...
1. Made sure AFM was plugged in (it was) and I even cleaned the contacts on the plug with a little rubbing alcohol on a q-tip. I also tried starting it without the AFM plugged in, and it would not even catching when it was cranking. Also had a buddy try holding the flapper open a bit, no good either.
2. Checked for vacuum leaks, even went as far as pulling of the UIM and cleaning/reapplying some gasket maker. All my vac lines were replaced with silcone hoses when I put the rebuild in, and they all look to be in very good shape.
3. Jumped the fuel check connector (which I believe is a form of testing to make sure the AFM isn't cutting fuel?) No change in the startup behavior at all.
4. Checked for codes, and it's not giving me any.
Some other notes, the gas isn't old, and there is about 3/4 of tank in it right now. I replaced the fuel filter when I did the motor swap. I have not checked the fuel sock yet (possible culprit?)
So any gurus have some suggestions on areas for me to look into? I'd really appreciate some help with this, I really miss driving this girl.
1. Made sure AFM was plugged in (it was) and I even cleaned the contacts on the plug with a little rubbing alcohol on a q-tip. I also tried starting it without the AFM plugged in, and it would not even catching when it was cranking. Also had a buddy try holding the flapper open a bit, no good either.
2. Checked for vacuum leaks, even went as far as pulling of the UIM and cleaning/reapplying some gasket maker. All my vac lines were replaced with silcone hoses when I put the rebuild in, and they all look to be in very good shape.
3. Jumped the fuel check connector (which I believe is a form of testing to make sure the AFM isn't cutting fuel?) No change in the startup behavior at all.
4. Checked for codes, and it's not giving me any.
Some other notes, the gas isn't old, and there is about 3/4 of tank in it right now. I replaced the fuel filter when I did the motor swap. I have not checked the fuel sock yet (possible culprit?)
So any gurus have some suggestions on areas for me to look into? I'd really appreciate some help with this, I really miss driving this girl.
12-04-10, 11:49 PM
#2
Full Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Green Bay, Wisconsin
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
idk if this helps at all, but my car will do the same thing. But i have my pump hot wired to switch and if i leave the switch on before starting it will do this. So its flooding and getting to much gas. Because normal setups pressurerise then stop. So maybe flooding is an issue?
12-05-10, 02:54 PM
#6
I tried this and nothing changed. i also tried disconnecting both the throttle cable and the cruise cable in case they were holding the throttle plates open some, which the car unable to start at all.
going to pull back the carpet and check my fuel sock now...
going to pull back the carpet and check my fuel sock now...
Trending Topics
12-05-10, 11:22 PM
#9
the days leading up to the trans going out it seemed to be running fine.
had a friend over to help today (by help i mean drink beer and watch me work) and we tried something. had him cover most of the AFM with his hand while i crank the motor over. by restricting the airflow we were able to get it to run somewhat longer and at a lower RPM. could that be an indicator that it is a vacuum leak? i've been over the vac lines and gaskets so many times i find it hard to believe, but just a thought.
had a friend over to help today (by help i mean drink beer and watch me work) and we tried something. had him cover most of the AFM with his hand while i crank the motor over. by restricting the airflow we were able to get it to run somewhat longer and at a lower RPM. could that be an indicator that it is a vacuum leak? i've been over the vac lines and gaskets so many times i find it hard to believe, but just a thought.
12-09-10, 07:19 PM
#13
It stopped raining long enough for my to pull the UIM and lay the new gasket down. Also double check the vac lines that are under there (oil injectors and whatnot) but it didn't change my start/idle problem at all. Tested the AFM as per the manual and seems to check out ok, i'd like to swap in a known good one just for my own piece of mind, but that is a matter for the regional forum.
pulling my remaining hair out over this problem. going to test the boost sensor tomorrow if it's dry out, also read somehting somewhere about the Vref signal and testing that, but i didn't seem to bookmark it. oh well.
other ideas?
pulling my remaining hair out over this problem. going to test the boost sensor tomorrow if it's dry out, also read somehting somewhere about the Vref signal and testing that, but i didn't seem to bookmark it. oh well.
other ideas?
Last edited by 3vil; 12-09-10 at 07:19 PM. Reason: spelling & grammar
12-10-10, 11:13 PM
#15
snap crackle brap
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: indianapolis, indiana
Posts: 536
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
unplug the tps. if it runs half way decent, then replace the mass air flow meter. if it does nothing, replace the tps AND mass air flow meter. i am pretty good at diagnosing fc's seeing how i have ran into just about every problem that could go wrong with them.
it sounds like when it hits a certain rpm, then the maf cant keep up with the fuel so it floods itself out with gas. i bet when you go to start it every time, it spits a cloud out the back.
change the maf. it will fix it.
it sounds like when it hits a certain rpm, then the maf cant keep up with the fuel so it floods itself out with gas. i bet when you go to start it every time, it spits a cloud out the back.
change the maf. it will fix it.
12-11-10, 01:34 PM
#16
no cloud, no flooding really either, after it dies i can just crank it again and it will start back up (then die again). and it's not like it hits a certain RPM and then dies. sometimes it'll only goto 1k and fall off, other times it might be more like 2500.
with the TPS disconnected it got worse. it would only rev itself between 500-700 RPMs. and while doing this is was running really rough kinda of stumbling.
with the TPS disconnected it got worse. it would only rev itself between 500-700 RPMs. and while doing this is was running really rough kinda of stumbling.
12-11-10, 02:04 PM
#18
You mentioned that you jumpered the fuel check connector and it made no difference. How about measuring the voltage on the Brown wire at the fuel check connector w/key to on and it should read 12 volts or so. If it doesn't then report back with your findings. If it does have battery voltage then try jumpering the fuel check connector "but" also jumper the Black wire in the fuel check connector as well to a ground and try to start the car. So there will be two jumpers. One from Black to ground and the second one from Brown to Black.
12-12-10, 03:16 PM
#19
just tried replacing the AFM and then the ECU with parts borrowed from RW-7 (thanks again man) with no change. i'm going to start on those suggestions given by blackrotary23 and satch, and if that doesn't turn anything up i'll move on to checking voltages on the ecu pins.
thanks again for everyone who has tried to help me with this so far.
thanks again for everyone who has tried to help me with this so far.
12-12-10, 04:12 PM
#20
satch, when checking voltage at the Fuel Check Connector i got 12.3v (batt was reading 12.5v) and when i tried grounding like you suggested there was no change.
blackrotary23 i think you've found it. both my leading coils are firing just fine but the trailing are not. i was using a timing light to test them, the t2 coil flashed twice as i was cranking over the car, and the t1 coil flashed once. correct me if i'm wrong here, but shouldn't both coils be firing continuously while i'm cranking? (that's what the leading coils were doing)
i've got the FSM out and am about to run through their testing procedure. obviously i do not have access to the fancy mazda tool, so i guess i'll have to search for a work around for that test.
blackrotary23 i think you've found it. both my leading coils are firing just fine but the trailing are not. i was using a timing light to test them, the t2 coil flashed twice as i was cranking over the car, and the t1 coil flashed once. correct me if i'm wrong here, but shouldn't both coils be firing continuously while i'm cranking? (that's what the leading coils were doing)
i've got the FSM out and am about to run through their testing procedure. obviously i do not have access to the fancy mazda tool, so i guess i'll have to search for a work around for that test.
12-12-10, 04:51 PM
#21
ok i got a question now, i'm following the highlighted area of the FSM and i'm not seeing the voltage i am supposed too. am i miss interpreting the instructions, or is this a problem?
also the resistance check for the coils came back ok, 1.0Ω T1 and 0.9Ω T2
also the resistance check for the coils came back ok, 1.0Ω T1 and 0.9Ω T2
12-12-10, 06:11 PM
#23
sorry i guess i worded that unclearly. i'm gettin 12v from each of the b/y wires when tested in series with the right terminal on the coil side of the plug. but if i try to test either of the b/y wires with the left terminal of the plug i get about 0.1v. both of the wires on the coil side of the plug are tan-ish in color.
does that make any sense?
does that make any sense?
Last edited by 3vil; 12-12-10 at 06:14 PM. Reason: spelling and grammar
12-12-10, 06:32 PM
#24
I believe you are misunderstanding the noted instructions. Secondly, the car will start and run w/o the need of the trailing coil. Perhaps you could try disconnecting the electrical connectors to the trailing coil and give it a go as far as starting the car.