Am I stupid for liking DTSS?
02-06-07, 08:55 AM
#26
FD pro licensed driver
Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Renton/Bellevue/Seattle WA
Posts: 2,897
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Its a wide open road in the middle of no where. I am in no way trying to brag, just looking for info on the system.
Ever been to Moxee WA or Pullman WA? hehe. Didnt think so. Nothing / no one here. :P
Anyways I think I'm going to keep my dtss and attempt to learn it. I like the challenge.
Thanks all.
Ever been to Moxee WA or Pullman WA? hehe. Didnt think so. Nothing / no one here. :P
Anyways I think I'm going to keep my dtss and attempt to learn it. I like the challenge.
Thanks all.
Last edited by TweakGames; 02-06-07 at 09:03 AM.
02-06-07, 09:03 AM
#27
The Extremist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bridgewater, Nova Scotia
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So I have a question. I know i'm going to sound like a total noob here, but when I bought by car it had the energy suspension bushing kit installed. Does this include the DTSS eliminators, or does my car still have it?
02-06-07, 10:04 AM
#29
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Originally Posted by sleeepyhead
Ive been driving 2nd gens since i got my liscense and when i got better at driving, i felt it and the toe steer still bothered me. On a freeway ramp i would slowly accelerate and suddenly feel the back step out slightly, when i reacted by countersteering a tad, the car would behave like it was still 100% gripping and just steered out a little bit. When driving with the dtss on a mountain road, i had to constantly adjust my steering angle mid turn. I eventually got the eliminators and a alignment setting the rear a little toe in and the front at zero. The rear at the same cornering force would still stay planted and when i felt a slide it would actually be sliding. MUCH more predictable. I now need to make much less steering corrections midturn. The only flaw in my mind is some of the nimbleness is gone, but the confidence i gained by eliminating the vagueness caused by the dtss is worth it and when i figure out a way to get some front camber dialed in i can get that nimbleness back.
02-06-07, 10:05 AM
#30
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Originally Posted by fcdrifter13
Tell me if I am wrong, but arnt hte bushings made out of a special type of material that only works at said gs
For example there is Kevlar, and Teflon and several different durometers of rubber and urethane all in the bushing assemblies
02-06-07, 04:57 PM
#32
FD pro licensed driver
Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Renton/Bellevue/Seattle WA
Posts: 2,897
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Does anybody have any clues on how much it would cost to get new DTSS parts from mazda? If mine works (from what I think) good ... and its this old, I wonder how nice it will be if it were new.
02-06-07, 05:01 PM
#33
registered user
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am also interested in how to test the DTSS, and also what breaks, I have heard it said that new bushings where 180 per pr.
Second question, what effect would suspension modification have on DTSS. I really need a more technical view of how the system actual functions so that I can come to my own conclusion. I really do want to keep DTSS
Second question, what effect would suspension modification have on DTSS. I really need a more technical view of how the system actual functions so that I can come to my own conclusion. I really do want to keep DTSS
02-06-07, 06:44 PM
#34
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Originally Posted by My5ABaby
What is the DTSS listed under in the FSM/Parts Fiche? I can't seem to find it.
02-07-07, 12:34 AM
#35
The Firestarter
my first FC had the eliminator on it when i bought it. And it felt nothing special in or out of cornering high or low speeds. My second FC TII had a functional DTSS and it was awkward experiencing it for the first time. I was not aware of the limit points in the tires because of the sudden change in directional toe. Times were i was expecting to hear tire squeal it didnt, the smooth transitions in cornering tricked my driving style. It didnt take long till got use to it, and honestly...i really like DTSS and how it still feels like im gripping the road under side to side load..and the transfer is smooth with proper shifting. I dont think id want to take it off just yet untill i really find an annoyance to it.
02-07-07, 01:48 AM
#37
doritos and peanuts
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: south carolina
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
dunno.. i do know the suspension is kinda different, only cause i see lowering spring sets and coil overs that specify which model they are for.
not sure how different they are, though. i dont see why it wouldnt have the DTSS. they handle just as well as the coupe from what i hear, sometimes better.
chris
not sure how different they are, though. i dont see why it wouldnt have the DTSS. they handle just as well as the coupe from what i hear, sometimes better.
chris
02-07-07, 01:49 AM
#38
No money. No love.
iTrader: (12)
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: SACRAMENTO
Posts: 2,807
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So anyone know how much Mazda would want to charge me for a set of new DTSS bushings? Just want to know since if the price is outragouse I'll just eliminated it.
02-07-07, 07:44 AM
#40
FCs** the new Pokemon
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Icemark
You buy the rear carrier assembly. It is a factory installed part
02-07-07, 07:52 AM
#41
Rotary Freak
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Wayne NJ
Posts: 2,508
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
youll have to call them and ask they dont post alot of their stuff on the site and ive popped mad tires b/c of the dtss thos goddamn crubs on the sharp turns it seems like they make the car turn more then it is supposed to
02-07-07, 09:15 AM
#42
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Originally Posted by yeti
This maybe a silly question but does verts have DTSS? I think I remember reading somewhere they didn't. If not, why?
02-07-07, 09:18 AM
#43
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Originally Posted by JWteknix
ive popped mad tires b/c of the dtss thos goddamn crubs on the sharp turns it seems like they make the car turn more then it is supposed to
"Must be the car is bad, because I know how to drive" mentality.
02-07-07, 09:41 AM
#44
(Terraplane)
Ijust eliminated my DTSS mainly because of the unpredictability feedback it gave.
One example was when I was coming to light and it turned yellow. Speed up right?
Well I made a left turn at an agressive speed. Nothing I haven't done before and actually enjoyed as the DTSS tended to square off a turn.
The back end came around on me, I touched the brake and snapped 180 facing on coming traffic. I couldn't power out of it because the traffic was all around me.
A quick reversal and an embarassing exit on to work as the on looking faces were all glaring at me. That spooked me and left me rather perplexed.
I'm at PIR on an NASA event day and going thru Nascar turn 3/4 at a high rate of speed. The back end feels like its on jello! I couldn't find a comfort zone/speed that gave me any confidence. Same with turn 1. You enter at high speed and have to kink left. The back end is not stable. It had new AGB shocks on it.
I can tell you that when I ran my Audi Quattro out there, I had no jello felling at all. Of course it is 4WD. The rx-7 is more fun.
I haven't been on the track yet but based on driving around town, the rear end is planted. No spooky feedback. If I want, I'm sure I can find a predictable limit where I can break it loose and recover.
One example was when I was coming to light and it turned yellow. Speed up right?
Well I made a left turn at an agressive speed. Nothing I haven't done before and actually enjoyed as the DTSS tended to square off a turn.
The back end came around on me, I touched the brake and snapped 180 facing on coming traffic. I couldn't power out of it because the traffic was all around me.
A quick reversal and an embarassing exit on to work as the on looking faces were all glaring at me. That spooked me and left me rather perplexed.
I'm at PIR on an NASA event day and going thru Nascar turn 3/4 at a high rate of speed. The back end feels like its on jello! I couldn't find a comfort zone/speed that gave me any confidence. Same with turn 1. You enter at high speed and have to kink left. The back end is not stable. It had new AGB shocks on it.
I can tell you that when I ran my Audi Quattro out there, I had no jello felling at all. Of course it is 4WD. The rx-7 is more fun.
I haven't been on the track yet but based on driving around town, the rear end is planted. No spooky feedback. If I want, I'm sure I can find a predictable limit where I can break it loose and recover.
02-07-07, 01:52 PM
#45
Just a guess but it sounds like ynkeetratr's DTSS is worn out, since he faced massive oversteer. Another solution would have been to replace the DTSS, rather than blaming it. Haven't been able to drive enough to test mine out yet, but I'm going to replace it if/when it fails. All the posts about DTSS seem to be "I hate it because I don't understand/like the feel" or "Once you get used to it you can corner better." Y'know, I think I'll spend the $180 ($140 more than DTSS eliminators) and learn to make use of the nice handling boost.
A properly functioning DTSS with a properly functioning driver is supposed to get rid of oversteer while giving a little added grip during hard turns. So I imagine that when TweakGames felt like it was going to oversteer, it would have without DTSS. I also suppose some people don't like that, because they want it to oversteer when it feels like it will oversteer, etc.
A properly functioning DTSS with a properly functioning driver is supposed to get rid of oversteer while giving a little added grip during hard turns. So I imagine that when TweakGames felt like it was going to oversteer, it would have without DTSS. I also suppose some people don't like that, because they want it to oversteer when it feels like it will oversteer, etc.
02-07-07, 04:20 PM
#47
FD pro licensed driver
Thread Starter
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Renton/Bellevue/Seattle WA
Posts: 2,897
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Originally Posted by ericgrau
A properly functioning DTSS with a properly functioning driver is supposed to get rid of oversteer while giving a little added grip during hard turns. So I imagine that when TweakGames felt like it was going to oversteer, it would have without DTSS. I also suppose some people don't like that, because they want it to oversteer when it feels like it will oversteer, etc.
My first attempt I was taking a sweeping right corner (a little slower then normal becuase I am attempting to get a BAD feeling for dtss and dont want to roll or something at full speed.) and 1/4 the way through I acted like the rear was sliding (how a newbie to the system would react when they feel the *** flex and squat). I straitened out the wheel instead of turning to the right as if I was to start countersteering for a slide/drift. It caused the rear to "bounce" ( some may refer to this as a snap) back and made it hard for me to get back into a smooth DTSS turn while it bounced back and forth. It felt like I Was a fish swishing my tail back and forth. Now I wasnt really sliding, just the bouncing caused the car to feel unsafe because of the crazy body roll from the bounces.
I went back to testing nice smooth non jerky corners and I was back in heaven again. As long as the road is dry it's great. I have STOCK 19 year old suspension and can only IMAGINE how a fresh dtss, properly aligned, new sports suspension/coil over system would feel. All I can say right now is, ya my NA is SLOW(er) and I really need to slap on a turbo or something, but right now I am going to spend some money on handling. It just makes me smile.
Last edited by TweakGames; 02-07-07 at 04:27 PM.
02-09-07, 09:40 AM
#48
A couple of comments regarding DTSS and the DTSS eliminator crowd.
First of all, we should all learn to drive. If this statement makes you angry, then it is directed at you. Just because you went to some track days or autocross does not mean you understand the dynamics of what is going on with your car in a corner. You need sound theory as well as practice.
Second of all, get a really high quality alignment. This is NOT an alignment done at the tire store where everyone is happy that all the corners are 'Green' on the computer printout. If you are in the DFW area, PM me an I will give you a name and number for a shop that does excellent alignments. He is NOT an RX7 guy, he just does an excellent, accurate, as close to perfect alignment as is possible on your car. Your car will come alive. Ask me how I know.
Third of all, educate yourself on the DTSS- it's purpose, it's function, it's history and development; this does NOT mean read all the posts made by the DTSS eliminator crowd that tells you how ''unstable" and scary and dangerous the DTSS is. Most (not all) people who eliminate the DTSS cannot even articulate the purpose and function of the DTSS. If you don't know how to find out accurate information, this is part of your problem.
Fourth of all, if you have 'drift' in your plans, forget all the above statements and just eliminate the DTSS, 'cos drift just rocks, dude!!!!!
First of all, we should all learn to drive. If this statement makes you angry, then it is directed at you. Just because you went to some track days or autocross does not mean you understand the dynamics of what is going on with your car in a corner. You need sound theory as well as practice.
Second of all, get a really high quality alignment. This is NOT an alignment done at the tire store where everyone is happy that all the corners are 'Green' on the computer printout. If you are in the DFW area, PM me an I will give you a name and number for a shop that does excellent alignments. He is NOT an RX7 guy, he just does an excellent, accurate, as close to perfect alignment as is possible on your car. Your car will come alive. Ask me how I know.
Third of all, educate yourself on the DTSS- it's purpose, it's function, it's history and development; this does NOT mean read all the posts made by the DTSS eliminator crowd that tells you how ''unstable" and scary and dangerous the DTSS is. Most (not all) people who eliminate the DTSS cannot even articulate the purpose and function of the DTSS. If you don't know how to find out accurate information, this is part of your problem.
Fourth of all, if you have 'drift' in your plans, forget all the above statements and just eliminate the DTSS, 'cos drift just rocks, dude!!!!!
Last edited by jackhild59; 02-09-07 at 09:48 AM.
02-09-07, 12:47 PM
#50
Icemark, I've driven many an FC both in my personal life and through work and never liked the feeling of DTSS no matter how I tried to change my driving style. Unfortunately these were all 21-16 year old cars so my question is this: What should a new DTSS bushing feel like during a high speed corner?